Hi

Since my Octavia now really wants a new battery, I decided to give to it the Superb's battery (only 2yrs old ) and give the Superb something more adequate. Think of it as a family upgrade :P

The one annoying thing about the Superb is that during the engine startup (2.5TDI diesel, so nearly 2kW starter :eek:), the voltage on the battery drops far enough that the CD loses memory of where it was playing, in fact the Solisto often starts with disc 1 track 1 after cold startup. Cleaning terminal posts etc does not really help with this one, tried that.

The other thing is that my car is often left garaged for weeks at a time, so a deep discharge battery would be better and last longer.

I traced 2 AGM batteries that might fit: Odyssey PC1500T/DT and VARTA AGM 70Ah. These have much higher cranking current and are happy with deep discharge. Has anyone tried these in the Superb?

Another (less expensive but also less robust) option I am looking at is fitting a size 110 Varta battery instead of 096/067. Size 110 are 30mm wider (length 315mm instead of 285mm, height and width are on the low side, ie 175mm). Has anyone fitted one like that? I know in the Octavia it is possible to swap sizes, but after my brief look into the Superbs bay I'd think the battery tray is too small for size 110?

Small secondary battery would also solve the problem, but I don't really have a good space to fit it in.

So, any experience with non-standard batteries?

No experience with a Superb but I do have experience of AGM batteries on the MX5.

They are good in terms of charge for thier size etc. but if you do allow them to go flat they can be problematic to recharge. They were once described to me as an like an Onion - you take the charge from the middle layers but put it back in through the outer layers so it takes time for the charge to build and hence can only be trickle charged.

I recently replaced my MX5 battery as it appeared not to be holding charge when in actual fact it was - the problem was that it had to be charged so slowly that even at 35Ah (or thereabouts) it needed a 5 day trickle charge!

Also it maybe worth checking the charging circuit etc. in the Superb and whether it is appropriate for an AGM battery. If not then you may be better off getting something like an Optimate that you can leave plugged in and connected in the garage for weeks at a time without damage.

Mine's (probably) due a battery this year. The two options as I see it are a higher specification 096 or the possibility of a 110, although the latter I have not looked into as yet.

That said I use my car in a totally different method to you, dieselv6, so I've never had the need to look at deep cycle (or similar) other than in the context of massive sound system upgrading.

I'd be interested to know if a 110 would fit though, should anyone have tried it?

Edited 15 September, 200817 yr by Bluefox
Poor English, as usual

The Superb has rather a high static current drain due to a few design sillies in the (Hella) CCM. There's not a lot you can do about it but if you know you are going to leave your vehicle idle for more than (say) 2 weeks it's worth giving the battery a charge. The socket in the boot is handy for this, and if the lead is thin (trickle charger) you can close the boot with the lead in the corner.

The 6 is actually an easier engine to start than the 4 (more compressions per rev) and I'm not a fan of exotic batteries having tested a few. Get the biggest Varta or Bosch battery you can fit into the (bloody awful) battery tray. This has to be one of the most stupid designs to be found on a car - I guess that with such a lot of weight ahead of the front axle, the battery had to go further back. At least it's marginally better than under the back seat (old Audi) where it would either soak the passengers in acid if you rolled the car, or explode if it was being overcharged and a rear passenger lit up.

Don't forget to remove the tray, de-rust it and the bolts and remove the plenum bungs whilst you are in there.

rotodiesel.

I agree that in money terms it usually works out cheaper and means that you only need to change the battery once while you own the car. I've done this twice while owning Fords - I think that it was Granada battery in Orion and RS2000 battery in the Fiesta - sorted! Well the Fiesta being a local runabout ended up having its lights + rear demister on 100% in winter (kids swimming!) and shortish runs mainly.

OK, things I gathered after looking into the plenum chamber:

1. Surprise, surprise, I already have the larger size 110 battery, ie 315 x 170ish x 185, and not size 096/067 as on smaller engines. Nothing larger fits, the battery tray is the limit.

2. The highest battery fitting there would probably be 195mm, maybe 198mm (important for AGMs). The higher it gets, the more likely that the cowling has to come off for the swap...

Edit:

3. Swapped terminals are an option, there is space to shift both + and - connectors, the +fuse box being more trouble but possible.

Regarding trickle charging et al, I forgot to add that when the car is abroad, there is no possibility of trickle charge and the battery is used quite heavily in start/short drive/stop scenarios with the car left unused at least 3 days a week , also typically over a period of 6-9 weeks.

So I still think Absorbed Glass Matt battery could be better, but now I have to redo search for size 110 batteries. If not, the silver Varta 110 looks the part, and I will have to look into small secondary battery for the radio more closely...

Hmm.

With regard to the radio problem, perhaps a capacitor would do the job. They sell "Power Caps" to use with amplifiers when they are required to produce long, low frequency bass so they're already available in this market.

That said they're usually in the reigon of 0.5 - 2 Farads and designed to take input currents of around 30 - 120 amps...

Still... "d'you catch ma drift"?

Hmm.

With regard to the radio problem, perhaps a capacitor would do the job. They sell "Power Caps" to use with amplifiers when they are required to produce long, low frequency bass so they're already available in this market.

That said they're usually in the reigon of 0.5 - 2 Farads and designed to take input currents of around 30 - 120 amps...

Still... "d'you catch ma drift"?

I tried capacitors + diode, but only around 50mF, not 500-3000mF. Worked well in the Octavia, but not really in the Superb. Still, now that I am aware I can up the capacitance by a factor of 60 :eek:, I probably will give it another go. Thanks

OK what about a solar charger - I have one for the Mazda when it is sat and it does seem to work - just

Hmm.

That said they're usually in the reigon of 0.5 - 2 Farads and designed to take input currents of around 30 - 120 amps...

I just checked, and with enough budget, there is a 52 Farad module from Maxwell Technologies... That's enough charge to power the starter for 1 second, And the best part is that leakage is 1mA and internal resistance of 15mOhm. Also, for most ultracapacitors, the UK companies charge 3x :eek: more than the US ones do

Still, I think I will first try a more targetted exercise and add a smaller capacitor next to Solisto USB interface. I am hoping that it is normally the CD changer that remembers where it finished playing, not the head unit?

If that works, I'll just get Varta Silver for the battery and save money.

I just checked, and with enough budget, there is a 52 Farad module from Maxwell Technologies... That's enough charge to power the starter for 1 second, And the best part is that leakage is 1mA and internal resistance of 15mOhm. Also, for most ultracapacitors, the UK companies charge 3x :eek: more than the US ones do

Still, I think I will first try a more targetted exercise and add a smaller capacitor next to Solisto USB interface. I am hoping that it is normally the CD changer that remembers where it finished playing, not the head unit?

If that works, I'll just get Varta Silver for the battery and save money.

52F? Cripes, that must be about as large as your bonnet!Something that size would as you state support your starter, but I was perhaps more meaning to support the radio/cd changer?You're right about something like the smaller capacity ones supporting the changer. Perhaps even something the size of a power cap would be overkill.I'd be interested to know your findings when you try something - on a pure interest basis, I don't even have a cd changer let alone a 2kW starter

Hmm. Apologies for the lack of grammar - I'm using an old laptop with IE6 and pre-sp1 ( ! ) XP. Which dosn't seem to work very will with anything!

I'd be interested to know your findings when you try something - on a pure interest basis, I don't even have a cd changer let alone a 2kW starter

I'm interested this as well, got same problem with my blaupunkt. If engine was started while bluedot on, radio just reboots itself...

52F? Cripes, that must be about as large as your bonnet!

Actually, that's the surprising part, the dimensions are

L = 218.0mm, W = 85.0mm, H = 44.0mm; -40°C to +65°C

Edit: Here is the specification:

http://www.tecategroup.com/capacitors/datasheets/maxwell/BC_15V_MOD_power_1009644.pdf

It would readily fit next to the battery... but I did not get any response on the UK price yet (US price is USD220 + USD170delivery because of HazMat fee). Still, a capacitor of that size capable of outputting 800A+ probably would extend the starting life of any battery by 2-3 years.

Looks like the technology for ultracapacitors really went forward over the past 10 years - they are used as short-term storage and peak load balancers in electricity generation , so wind turbines, solar panels, and there's also a big application for hybrid powertrains.

Anyway, I'll see what local Conrad (I'm in DE at the moment) has in the ultra-capacitor range today.

The Superb has rather a high static current drain due to a few design sillies in the (Hella) CCM. There's not a lot you can do about it but if you know you are going to leave your vehicle idle for more than (say) 2 weeks it's worth giving the battery a charge. The socket in the boot is handy for this, and if the lead is thin (trickle charger) you can close the boot with the lead in the corner.

rotodiesel.

When I had mine I left it for a month without any probs. If you can trickly charge via the plug in the boot, could you not also put a second battery in there to keep the main one topped up, or would that not work?

When I had mine I left it for a month without any probs. If you can trickly charge via the plug in the boot, could you not also put a second battery in there to keep the main one topped up, or would that not work?

I think it would work in principle but within limits of fuse and cabling (current carrying capacity) of boot plug.

Actually, that's the surprising part, the dimensions are

L = 218.0mm, W = 85.0mm, H = 44.0mm; -40°C to +65°C

Edit: Here is the specification:

http://www.tecategroup.com/capacitors/datasheets/maxwell/BC_15V_MOD_power_1009644.pdf

It would readily fit next to the battery... but I did not get any response on the UK price yet (US price is USD220 + USD170delivery because of HazMat fee). Still, a capacitor of that size capable of outputting 800A+ probably would extend the starting life of any battery by 2-3 years.

Looks like the technology for ultracapacitors really went forward over the past 10 years - they are used as short-term storage and peak load balancers in electricity generation , so wind turbines, solar panels, and there's also a big application for hybrid powertrains.

Anyway, I'll see what local Conrad (I'm in DE at the moment) has in the ultra-capacitor range today.

Hmm. That's certainly a surprise, you're right - they must have moved on!

Interesting about the HazMat charge though - even if these are electrolytic, surely there's only a "hazard" if the cap explodes... which of course is as a result of connecting the terminals the wrong way around. Correct me if I'm wrong, but surely the chances of that happening in, er, a box, are slim to none? :confused:

Surely though it would be far easier (and cheaper) to install a smaller cap to support the devices that loose power?

Surely though it would be far easier (and cheaper) to install a smaller cap to support the devices that loose power?

Come on, I have not substantially modified the car in almost 1 year, so why put 10mF capacitor when you can stuff over 1000 times more? :P

Seriously though, I don't have the time a the moment, since Octavia's MOT ate a lot of my car play time budget recently.

The earliest I can play with the radio is early October. I'll try a "small" 10mF capacitor on the Solisto first, then if that fails, I might assemble a juicier module for the main unit.

Regarding the battery, VARTA 110 Silver Dynamic looks best bet (if not the only uprated size 110 around) , but if I fix the radio by other means I might postpone the replacement until end of year - are there any Christmas sales on batteries?

If you put a battery in the boot ,it will never get as much charge (current flow) as the cars original battery ,because of the resistance of the wire connecting the two together (+ve connection) .,and the car chassis (-ve connection ).

If you put a battery in the boot ,it will never get as much charge (current flow) as the cars original battery ,because of the resistance of the wire connecting the two together (+ve connection) .,and the car chassis (-ve connection ).

This is pretty much what I tried to say in my previous post. In addition when you crank the engine the fuse will most likely blow due to huge current drained by start motor. Unless you install new wiring between batteries with bigger diameter and big fuse.

Come on, I have not substantially modified the car in almost 1 year, so why put 10mF capacitor when you can stuff over 1000 times more? :P

Seriously though, I don't have the time a the moment, since Octavia's MOT ate a lot of my car play time budget recently.

The earliest I can play with the radio is early October. I'll try a "small" 10mF capacitor on the Solisto first, then if that fails, I might assemble a juicier module for the main unit.

Regarding the battery, VARTA 110 Silver Dynamic looks best bet (if not the only uprated size 110 around) , but if I fix the radio by other means I might postpone the replacement until end of year - are there any Christmas sales on batteries?

Hmm, I'm not sure... when did you say your coilovers were arriving? :P

I'll be interested to know if that little cap works in the CD changer. A simple fix for a (seemingly) fairly common problem.

Also with the battery... like I said I think I may be due one this year so I'll keep an eye out for the Varta.

EDIT: I've just realised that Varta now make Halfords batteries. Wonder if our "calcium" battery will be any good as a result?

Edited 23 September, 200817 yr by Bluefox
Realisation!

Hmm, I'm not sure... when did you say your coilovers were arriving? :P

I'll be interested to know if that little cap works in the CD changer. A simple fix for a (seemingly) fairly common problem.

Also with the battery... like I said I think I may be due one this year so I'll keep an eye out for the Varta.

EDIT: I've just realised that Varta now make Halfords batteries. Wonder if our "calcium" battery will be any good as a result?

Varta got sold to Johnson Controls a while ago. They're not brilliant but there simply are very few manufacturers of quality size 110 batteries in the market. I am hoping that the Silver one (with calcium) will age more gracefully than my current OEM Varta, and that the extra 10% higher starting current cannot really hurt. The only alternatives I found were AGM/dry cell ones - and these are 2x - 2.5x the price and not really fitting the confines of the plenum chamber.

For the Octavia, in the smaller 096 size, the upgrade was a simple matter - throw out the Varta and get a premium Exide (I guess nowadays it would be XP07). Maintenance free, going on 5 years now under heavy use, and still good enough for me to postpone the battery upgrades till next year.

For the Octavia, in the smaller 096 size, the upgrade was a simple matter - throw out the Varta and get a premium Exide (I guess nowadays it would be XP07). Maintenance free, going on 5 years now under heavy use, and still good enough for me to postpone the battery upgrades till next year.

Five years? That's pretty impressive.

I'm assuming that from your posts that Exide don't do a "premium" 110, which based on the performance of the one in your Octy, is a shame :(

In any case - for me I'll probably plump for a Hal(frauds lol) calcium due to the fact I get them... er... cheap :P

Obviously I'll report - but until then I'll keep an eye out for the others you suggested. Thanks

I lifted the battery out last weekend, here are my observations

First and most important, start going regularly to the gym before you attempt this battery job :P

The size 110 battery removal absolutely requires removing the windscreen wiper cowling and not just unclipping it. New windscreen wiper cowling and a new brake servo vacuum hose are on order

Plenum chamber drain was clean as a whistle, I am not sure if it is an updated grommet design or something but the grommet is a rubber pipe around 1in diameter, so unless you always park under a tree or have a flock of pidgeons living in the plenum, it is difficult to get clogged. But inspection yearly makes sense.

Rotated terminal battery is not really an option, the cables are too short (unless re-routed to the other side, also questionable)

access to battery cable ground connection is heavily obstructed by airco lines, and I actually have doubts about the quality of ground connection to chassis (ground connection to the engine is OK, otherwise it would not turn the engine).

So what I did is I ran another ground cable (about 15mm^2, and around 500mm long) to the mounting post for heated windscreen relay (at least on my car there is a prepared ground point there).

So far, I did not have the Solisto MP3 player reset a single time (I tried 5 or 6 starts on cold engine), so it's possible that the problem is gone. Of course, I also cleaned terminal posts so it's hard to judge which one has fixed it.

Anyway, I still might get that Varta 110 Calcium Silver, because I want to retire the Octavia's battery while it is still useful as a portable power source.

Interesting point about that poor earth... wonder if that was the cause in the end?