But it does need verification. This is an anecdote and there are tons of other variables which aren’t factored explained or potentially even obvious to the guy’s whose car it was.

Despite that it’s definitively the fault of the oil.

Despite what must be thousands of cars being used with that oil? Despite no information on how he’s driven it? Whether he’s had the car since new and always had the servicing done immaculately?

If there isn’t a trend to support the same thing and there is evidence to support that the oil has been identified as causal or at least contributory in this case then have to tak it with a pinch of salt.

The motor oil guy may support certain aspects of oil type and additives, but if there isn’t large volume data to support that in this situation, then you can’t draw any firm conclusions that it’s not circumstantial, same with the body colour or age of the car, or whether it’s a DE, UK or US car etc.

While it’s a shame the engine was needed on this 9-year old car with entirely unknown history, the only thing I take away from this is how sensationalist the internet is.

9 hours ago, gav_is_con said:

In addition... HPFP leaking fuel into crankcase...

That is sufficient to explain engine damage, irrespective of oil choices.

Well, true that it does need verification but all the factors listed herein are known variables that lead to inevitable - and costly - failure.

Oil dilution is not an unknown issue, been with us for years, cases with some engines such as JLR's Ingenium series are very well reported. But also in the off-road communities, where extensive/continous wading can provoke water ingestion in g-boxes, t-boxes and diffs, resulting in oil dilution with possible catastrofic failures.

In other words, oil should not mix with anything ... 😄

Oil viscosity and its long-term resistance when exposed to high temps for extended uses is also known, known example is discussions in towing communities where ATF degradation after "cooking the fluid" and its suggested anticipated replacement. Same for engine oil, especially in high-CR forced induction engines. Whether you talk fast street, race, drag or drift ...

Long life oils I will not get into it, but for the mechanically inclined, it is very difficult to accept that a lubricant will maintain its qualities for +20k, especially engine oil. Whatever progresses have been made in the field, there is no magic pill ....

The consensus I have gathered by people who work on engines, really work, is that rarely an oil (whatever make/type) allows more than 6-8k km before degrading to a point in which its lubricant and cooling capabilities become compromised.

Finally, there are also very specific conditions in which an additive is needed. People I know that work in labs in the field, report that under most conditions, it is possible certain additive properties "act" faster than the lubricant properties, thus negating the advantage of a high-quality oil, and creating a situation in which also the advantage of the additive is negated. Sorry for not explaining it more technically, but there is also lots of information on the subject.

In short, even though we went a long way since dino oil and 3k replacements, certain mechanical rules and basis cannot be magically altered ... true, there are engines seemingly doing very long mileages and apparently doing well, but what do they show if they were to be dissected and examined?

I do not want to risk ... costs me too much to have an engine overhaul. These are not anymore simple powerplants ...

Why does my 280 drive like it won’t take the skin off a rice pudding. In comparison my diesel 170 feels like it has so much get up and go accelerating on the motorway with kickdown. This coming from a diesel driver(be gentle), long drive home 4 hours in the new to me 280. I can only assume having test driven 2 of these before buying the current they are quick enough, just does it smoothly.

It has a warranty for 2 years so mapping could invalidate this right?

Edited 16 April16 Apr by gav_is_con
Typo

You think all drove the same? If so, then it sounds like yours is the same. Although as long as you drove all facelifts then you should have the same experience but if the test drives were pre-facelift then the previous generation engine had a different turbo with different flow-dynamics which may have made it seem like the turbo kicked in more sudden.

If you have a facelift then it’s a DNFE engine which is an excellent base for tuning…but good to let the warranty expire first for sure.

9 hours ago, gav_is_con said:

Why does my 280 drive like it won’t take the skin off a rice pudding. In comparison my diesel 170 feels like it has so much get up and go accelerating on the motorway with kickdown. This coming from a diesel driver(be gentle), long drive home 4 hours in the new to me 280. I can only assume having test driven 2 of these before buying the current they are quick enough, just does it smoothly.

It has a warranty for 2 years so mapping could invalidate this right?

I came to the 280 from a MKII Superb CR170. Whilst it appeared to’ve had more torque than the 280, it did not, with both delivering 258lbft. However the diesel peaks between 1750-2500 rpm and that short peak is what gives you that “kick in the back” feeling. However, the petrol engine delivers it in a more linear way between 1700-5600 rpm so it’s less of a kick and more of a longer push. And of course, the 0-60 times are 8.4s vs 5.5s.

9 hours ago, travs said:

You think all drove the same? If so, then it sounds like yours is the same. Although as long as you drove all facelifts then you should have the same experience but if the test drives were pre-facelift then the previous generation engine had a different turbo with different flow-dynamics which may have made it seem like the turbo kicked in more sudden.

If you have a facelift then it’s a DNFE engine which is an excellent base for tuning…but good to let the warranty expire first for sure.

I drove a 2017 the a 2022/3 and this actual 2023 I now have. I have been reading about a pedal box as there has been a thread on here about it.

14 minutes ago, numskull said:

I came to the 280 from a MKII Superb CR170. Whilst it appeared to’ve had more torque than the 280, it did not, with both delivering 258lbft. However the diesel peaks between 1750-2500 rpm and that short peak is what gives you that “kick in the back” feeling. However, the petrol engine delivers it in a more linear way between 1700-5600 rpm so it’s less of a kick and more of a longer push. And of course, the 0-60 times are 8.4s vs 5.5s.

Yes on paper it’s all for the S3 on performance. I think my brother was expecting to leave him for dust in S2 when we both floored it on the motorway side by side. It just felt like a massive delay. lol.

I am loving the wireless CarPlay and don’t get me started on the ACC cruise in the traffic, it basically drove itself. Look no pedals 🤓. No wireless charge mat though. A friends Seat Ateca 2017/18 has one.

I did however feel Waze seems like a cut down version I can’t access all info like next turns and entities issues traffic and roadworks etc etc.

I could not turn off Stop/Start I used the A button but it kept turning off. In the end I went for my trusty option to remove the battery monitor cable. That did the trick 🤓

Edited 17 April17 Apr by gav_is_con

I had a CR170 DSG for 3 years before I got my 280 and towed the same caravan with both. The 280 definitely has more get up and go 😃

In day to day driving I think part of the perception is down to the dumbass decision to make the accelerator pedal non-linear and for the DSG to change up too early (all for 'eco' reasons I presume) so it can feel like you're in granny mode as it's never quite in the sweet spot for power. Sport mode sorts that out but then it's a bit too vicious for day to day driving.

4 minutes ago, numskull said:

I came to the 280 from a MKII Superb CR170. Whilst it appeared to’ve had more torque than the 280, it did not, with both delivering 258lbft. However the diesel peaks between 1750-2500 rpm and that short peak is what gives you that “kick in the back” feeling. However, the petrol engine delivers it in a more linear way between 1700-5600 rpm so it’s less of a kick and more of a longer push. And of course, the 0-60 times are 8.4s vs 5.5s.

Me also. My old CR170 diesel estate (FWD) was quick but had almost uncontrollable front wheel scrabble in damp / wet conditions, in the dry also if the front wheels were angled for a left / right turn at a junction. This was especially noticeable at roundabouts when you wanted to get into a gap quickly but were left stationary with the font tyres spinning in the wet! It also meant the front tyres took a bit of a beating with replacements fairly frequently at circa 20k intervals. So after 150k miles in my CR170, & with retirement looming, I wanted a smoother petrol 4 x 4 estate. Enter the 280!

The 280 has no wet weather tyre scrabble or traction issues whatsoever. Believe me I have tried!! There is / was a bit of DSG hesitation when setting off from a standing start but that can be mitigated a bit by using Sport mode. I had a Revo Stage 1 remap (360bhp) done a few years ago & I have fitted a RaceChip Throttle / pedal box which eliminates any DSG hesitation altogether. The RaceChip box was swapped from my wife's Karoq 1.5 DSG 4 x 4 when we sold it which suffered from terrible DSG take off hesitation.

Now the take off & acceleration of the 280 in sport mode is somewhat "savage" which makes it a bit of a hooligan as it hangs on the the gears much higher up the rev band. As you said, in normal Drive mode the torque comes in as a smooth linear progression for more relaxed but equally fast progression which negates the need to use Sport mode in all but exceptional circumstances.

By contrast, my wife has a FWD Kona EV which has 201bhp & 291 lbft (395Nm) of torque. It's quick but even in Normal drive mode in the dry in a straight line the front tyres struggle for grip. In Sport mode it's almost undrivable in the wet. My wife went through the front tyres in 13k miles! It's now set in Eco mode which eliminates the tyre scabble & it's still plenty quick enough. The current model 64kWh Kona EV's have the same 201bhp power but a reduced amount of torque (188 lbft / 255Nm)! I wonder why?

Not sure I could go back to a higher power 2WD car now?

It is actually difficult to go back to 2WD after you got "pampered" but the more controllable - but certainly also tracherous - all-wheel-drive....

I have noticed the 280 does it best in the mid-upper range of the rev counter.

And I now drive it in "manual" like ... all the time 🤨

I have a Racechip,XLR Throttle Controller too and it’s amazing. I also have a Racechip GTS Black. Love that too. However, the XLR made the biggest immediate change. When I first got the 280, it did get bogged-down on many occasions. Now it doesn’t.. ever.

Yes the XLR is very good. I have mine in Race+ - throttle like a hairline trigger. Muuuuuch better.

The diesel to petrol comparisons do also flag the torque/power comparison.

When I had the car remapped, the biggest difference was noticeable at higher speeds and not throughout all performance. It wasn’t until the intercooler and larger charge pipes made a noticeable increase all through the rev range.

When starting from cold do I need to wait for the revs to settle down before driving off as the engine runs at about 1k for a fair minute or 2. Sometimes happens even after starting from warm ?

3 hours ago, gav_is_con said:

When starting from cold do I need to wait for the revs to settle down before driving off as the engine runs at about 1k for a fair minute or 2. Sometimes happens even after starting from warm ?

I always start and go straight away - I'm not convinced it does any harm - my neighbour on the other hand sits with his Range Rover ticking over for up to 10 minutes before departure, claiming it prevents premature wear........?

7 hours ago, gav_is_con said:

When starting from cold do I need to wait for the revs to settle down before driving off as the engine runs at about 1k for a fair minute or 2. Sometimes happens even after starting from warm ?

I always have with turbo charged engines and always will.

The fast idle is perfect timing from start to allow time to spool up before driving.

I then always spool back down again for about the same time before turning the engine off again.

I also have a pedal box in mine and have done from basically new. Transforms the response of the car. Removes the lag which I found made the car feel gutless when trying to merge into traffic or negotiate junctions etc.

Cleaned the Sahara Desert off the 280 today. Didn’t realise how dirty it was! Also cleaned my wife’s Focus MK1.5 and our latest money pit too. Anyone want to take a guess as to make / model? (NO - NOT YOU TRAVS!😂).

26 minutes ago, numskull said:

Cleaned the Sahara Desert off the 280 today. Didn’t realise how dirty it was! Also cleaned my wife’s Focus MK1.5 and our latest money pit too. Anyone want to take a guess as to make / model? (NO - NOT YOU TRAVS!😂).

Merc, possibly a CLK maybe?

Edited 19 April19 Apr by UndertheRadar

2 hours ago, UndertheRadar said:

Merc, possibly a CLK maybe?

Spot on, well done UTR. It’s a 2004 A209 CLK500. It was gifted to me by our son who’s gone fully EV. This is a long term project, albeit I’ve already spent > £3k fixing MOT failure bits and others that annoyed me - meant the dash out for two of those! Back on topic now….!

Edited 19 April19 Apr by numskull

33 minutes ago, numskull said:

Spot on, well done UTR. It’s a 2004 A209 CLK500. It was gifted to me by our son who’s gone fully EV. This is a long term project, albeit I’ve already spent > £3k fixing MOT failure bits and others that annoyed me - meant the dash out for two of those! Back on topic now….!

The bargain V8.

18 hours ago, numskull said:

It’s a 2004 A209 CLK500.

Unmistakable top cover of the V6 and V8 Mercs of the era.

You got a very nice toy, likely the last "user-friendly" human-level sports MB. And with possibly their best designed V8, in terms of usability and longevity. Nothing before or after is equally rewarding ... there are fierce arguments on the subject, but the M113 reigns overall...

I got mates with such thing in whatever you can think of: got one that had a 400CDI G-klasse and went crazy in repair costs, and fitted a M113 500 ... another pur the same engine in a 124CE (a beast, very challenging to drive), got another who has your same car but manual, using the 6spd from a CLK240 (this one much more pleasurable to drive), another with a W140 with the same engine, another one with a ... Kia Sportage running on portal axles 😄 you name it!

Great thing, if you need any assistance do not hesitate to ask, half of the cars mentioned above have been rebuilt from the ground up and there is lots of experience on the subject 😉

On 18/04/2026 at 15:48, gav_is_con said:

When starting from cold do I need to wait for the revs to settle down before driving off as the engine runs at about 1k for a fair minute or 2. Sometimes happens even after starting from warm ?

On cold start, especially in colder weather, is not a bad thing to allow proper oil circulation before setting off, which can take a few seconds, i usually let it idle for 15/20 sec in warmer weather - it is not a big deal, the time to fit the belt, set up the infotainment, and such. On very cold say a minute or two....

Important thing is to be gentle and progressive in stepping on the skinny pedal, unless you are in a hurry, no sense to gun a cold forced induction engine.

And as travs mentioned, respect cool-down times.

What Berisford's neighbour does is bad from mechanical perspective, and not only.

Now your 280 has also GPF, which means sometimes the engine management system will increase RPMs in order to heat, pre-heat, or run whatever cycle it runs with the GPF. While can be alarming at first, it is normal ....

If I have to manouver and it goes on fast idle, I wait until RPMs drop before turning off, something worries me about cutting off who knows what process that might set off a fault ....

3 hours ago, leolito said:

On cold start, especially in colder weather, is not a bad thing to allow proper oil circulation before setting off, which can take a few seconds, i usually let it idle for 15/20 sec in warmer weather - it is not a big deal, the time to fit the belt, set up the infotainment, and such. On very cold say a minute or two....

Important thing is to be gentle and progressive in stepping on the skinny pedal, unless you are in a hurry, no sense to gun a cold forced induction engine.

And as travs mentioned, respect cool-down times.

What Berisford's neighbour does is bad from mechanical perspective, and not only.

Now your 280 has also GPF, which means sometimes the engine management system will increase RPMs in order to heat, pre-heat, or run whatever cycle it runs with the GPF. While can be alarming at first, it is normal ....

If I have to manouver and it goes on fast idle, I wait until RPMs drop before turning off, something worries me about cutting off who knows what process that might set off a fault ....

Idling an engine is pretty useless. Sure, it warms up some of the oil, but the uncirculated stuff is still sitting cold at the bottom. The gearbox, differential and everything else is also still stone cold.

I normally turn the key, let the fuel pump prime, then turn the key. I'll then get some music up and sort myself out. In winter I let the revs drop, in the summer I tend to give it fifteen seconds or so and then slowly make my way out of the garage in reverse. By the time I've come out, shut the door and put the fob away, it's usually dropped below the cold start idle. In the winter I will let the engine revs drop before moving, or turning on the heating. That said, I also don't really use the throttle or go above 15mph until I get to the end of the road anyway. I don't really believe in letting the car warm up while stationary - things need to be moving and under some load IMHO.

Modern engines don't need warming up in the traditional sense. As long as they're driven gently until they're warm, they'll be fine. Oil temperature is another story however - I won't put my foot down until I'm above 90 degrees.

A GPF will regen during overruns. That means if you put your foot down on a slip road and are in third gear at 70mph, the car will hold that gear (and thus the revs and exhaust temp) for a few seconds, before shifting up. The car won't regen anywhere near the key being turned.

First drive to work it’s about 186 miles return trip. Got to say I am impressed with a few things the ACC in traffic is very good. But when it sees a sign and just slows dow, is a little annoying since I know the Speedo is out in most VAG cars. Is there anyway to get the Speedo to be reading that 70mph is really 70?

I love the fact I can have my work mobile and personal phone connected at the same time. I used to have a visor Bluetooth for my work phone before.

I hate how Waze is cut down on Car Play so it’s back to having a vent mount holder for Waze.

Still managed to play BBC sounds via Bluetooth Inc show graphic on car stereo. All very modern now.

MPG was about 39 on the way in and 41 on the way back. Not worked out that cost yet but I get super Esso petrol for 155.9 last fill anyway.

Hearing steering wheel in the morning was nice also.

I can see with Lane Assist and the ACC I am going to get into a lazy driver 😉

5 hours ago, gav_is_con said:

First drive to work it’s about 186 miles return trip. Got to say I am impressed with a few things the ACC in traffic is very good. But when it sees a sign and just slows dow, is a little annoying since I know the Speedo is out in most VAG cars. Is there anyway to get the Speedo to be reading that 70mph is really 70?

I love the fact I can have my work mobile and personal phone connected at the same time. I used to have a visor Bluetooth for my work phone before.

I hate how Waze is cut down on Car Play so it’s back to having a vent mount holder for Waze.

Still managed to play BBC sounds via Bluetooth Inc show graphic on car stereo. All very modern now.

MPG was about 39 on the way in and 41 on the way back. Not worked out that cost yet but I get super Esso petrol for 155.9 last fill anyway.

Hearing steering wheel in the morning was nice also.

I can see with Lane Assist and the ACC I am going to get into a lazy driver 😉

It’s worked out about 36MPG. I did do a little local drive also first. For some reason as I like to brim my cars. I keep spilling fuel. Never had this problem in all my life of driving. If anything in some cars like my superb 2 TDI clicks too early and I have to reposition the pump to get it to fill.

I forgot to say I find the Canton sound really good, the sub is on low and it’s still good bass. Having come from a Columbus with Sound System upgrade in the Mk2 I was already spoilt.