Anyone who's been driving over ten years (which I suspect will be quite a few of us) will have owned an 'old' car at some point (even if it was brand new then) and we're still here to tell the tale and people still die in brand new cars.

Obviously you want her to be safe but people have to live their own lives. If she's paying for it herself then she should get what she wants.

Of course if you're paying for it then she'll get what she's damn well given and be grateful!

The best thing is that second hand car prices are MUCH lower than when I started driving (as compared to new) so you can get a fairly decent motor for 3k.

My first car cost me 550 quid, a Ford Fiesta 1.1 Y reg, noise was terrible but it was a great car to gain that driving experience post-passing-the-test.

Apart from changing the ICE system for something that was able to outperform the engine noise :P I didnt have to do much to it, and it did me very well for what is was.

As long as the expectations of the car are realistic most cars can be fun to live with, in their own little way

I would hate for your daughter to be denied the sheer pleasure a proper mini brings. BUT, i would certainly be pushing toward the smart car. If the mini was involved in an accident with an NCAP 5 car, the results would be catastophic. This is a point that has been missed i think. As safety and technology improve, modern cars are very dangerous to have an accident with, if you are in an old car. Two old cars collising is one thing, but an old car and a new car in a collision is a lethal cocktail. As you dont get a choice when/if you have an accident, I would be looking to a potentially safer alternative.

An old Volvo would be very safe, look how many are used in banger racing. But they have no 'character'.

Don't know if she likes Morris Minors, but you should be able to get a reasonably good saloon for that money. A lot of them have been updated by owners safety wise with more modern brakes and seat belts etc. They are a lot more solid than the beetle or mini but are still great fun. Another plus point with a Moggie is that it doesn't encourage fast driving - I find I end up driving in a calmer and safer way when I drive mine as there is little point in trying to rush.

Down side is that there are no airbags, standard brakes are only drums and acceleration is leisurely to say the least

This is the same philosophy that makes mums with kids buy big 4x4s because they think they are "safer". Let her get the Mini she wants, and buy her some defensive driving tuition so she doesn't have this crash everyone seems to think is inevitable. Humph!

The suggestion of a VW Lupo might be a good one. Any other suggestions?

Well if a Lupo is on the list then don't forget the Arouser , erm , sorry , Arosa

Should be plenty of decent ones for your budget

This is the same philosophy that makes mums with kids buy big 4x4s because they think they are "safer". Let her get the Mini she wants, and buy her some defensive driving tuition so she doesn't have this crash everyone seems to think is inevitable. Humph!

I know what you mean Nick. I am keeping my Minor until my daughter is old enough to drive it (only another 15 years :P ) and I believe that it is a more inherently safe car than many more modern NCAP cars purely as:

(a) its slow;

( its noisy and even at low speeds sounds as though you are going fast;

© it makes you as a driver far more aware of speed, conditions other road users as you learn to concentrate / pre-empt road conditions and other road users - i.e. no nice quiet (often false) safety net like you get in modern cars.

(d) its seriously solid compared to most modern cars.

(e) it is more than "just a car" - I look after the Minor far better than any modern car (including the Octy) and am far more worried about it.... hence more careful all round when driving.

Although I must admit my "original only" attitude to the car will go out the window as far as daughter is concerned ... trafficators and no seat belts will definitely be changed and I might invest in a brake upgrade.

I love Minis, but they are probably the worst car possible to be driving if an accident does occur purely due to their size, whcih is a difficult thing to get over when it is your daughter that you are buying it for .

Dont forget newer cars are considerable heavier than cars of even a decade ago... So any really old car hitting a new car will come of considerably worse...

However a good older car say like a Audi 80/90/coupe this had a system called pro-con 10 which used cables that pulled the steering wheel/column

away from the driver, and tensioned the seatbelts,also the strong passenger cell made this a very good car for its time..

Cheers

Dazz

This is the same philosophy that makes mums with kids buy big 4x4s because they think they are "safer". Let her get the Mini she wants, and buy her some defensive driving tuition so she doesn't have this crash everyone seems to think is inevitable. Humph!

Statisitcally, you're FAR more likely to have a crash in your first year of driving. There's nothing wrong with learning defensive driving in a safe car.

Statisitcally, you're FAR more likely to have a crash in your first year of driving. There's nothing wrong with learning defensive driving in a safe car.

True enough , but many people see it as a choice.

Defensive driving *or* a safe car

I'd go for the defensive driving in that case Will keep the insurance lower too, not having crashes :P

Unfortunately though, you're right in that many people seem to think that IF they buy a 'safe car' they can get away with driving in a way that some might consider less than clever

Old minis are just that 'old'!

Once saw an accident at a set of lights (30mph road) which was a 'head on' between a Mini & a Ford Cortina MK3. The Cortina ended up with both front wheels on the windscreen & the Mini collasped underneath.

The Cortina we pushed off & was still drivable (ish),

Mini looked like it had gone through the compactor!

Cortina driver was fine with not a single injury, - Mini driver wasn't (had to be cut out) & ambulance took him away - steering column & dash impact.

Will never forget it & will never get in a Mini either.

Buy a reliable modern car with airbag's & ABS -

I love this forum, so much help and it's all so greatly appreciated. As different as the points of view are, they are all valid too, particularly with regard to the fact that an older car will make you drive with more awareness. It's often been said that many crashes today are as a result of the driver being too detached from the fact that they are hurtling along at high speed in a box made of metal and glass, where as an old car makes you feel more connected to what you are doing. A very good point has been made by a couple of people about the strength of the new car that might just hit you, I suppose as new cars get tougher, the older ones get comparatively weaker.

I made a comment earlier that she was buying with her heart and not her head but I suppose I am doing the same too. Her love for a mini is pushing her towards it, my love for her is making me nervous about it. At the very least I am starting to realise what I put my parents through when my mate used to pick 6 of us up in his old mini van!! It was dangerous, risky, unsafe and unbelievable fun.

I was almost run off the road by an old dear who changed lanes on a corner this weekend. She was totally unaware that she had done anything wrong but the main reason an accident was avoided was because I was expecting this sort of thing to happen and even if she had hit me - and believe me it was extremely close - her Kia wouldn't have hit my Superb with enough force to hurt me. It wouldn't have been the same with a new driver in an old mini. Actually, that may be the solution, get my daughter a mini and drive round ahead of her pushing all the incompetant drivers, of which there seems to be an increasing number, off the road.

The defensive driving thing sounds good. I was always taught to drive in that manner by my driving instructor anyway but I didn't know you could get courses on it. Does anyone have any more info on that?

The best thing for me with regard to road safety was passing my motorcycle test. You learn a hell of alot about the road and road users when you do that I can tell you.

Thanks again to all who have posted so far and are still continuing to do so. I want to show my daughter all your comments so keep em coming.

The old mini was discontinue for safety reasons. :thumbdwn:

A modern 'boring' car (even a 2* NCAP) is significantly safer than most older ones.

Buy as new as you can and as big as you can. Also, don't forget that if your arm can touch the screen, so can your head in an accident.

All old cars can be death traps, the mini (as much as I love it) is one of them.

At the end of the day if it gets hit by something bigger it will come off worse as will a metro or corsa or alike.

"If" it was my daughter I'd be looking along the lines of VW Polo, Rover 25 Skoda Felicia, seat ibiza.............things which are bigger.

All of which you can pick up with

At the very least I am starting to realise what I put my parents through when my mate used to pick 6 of us up in his old mini van!! It was dangerous' date=' risky, unsafe and unbelievable fun.

.[/quote']

Ah,memories of a trip to Alton Towers piled in to a mini van.Couldn't get up the hills so we all had to get out and walk except driver and one passenger.

My 1st car was a 1971 K plate Mini 1000.. Me and my old chap basically rebuilt it..

New wings, floor plates bonnet etc etc....

I used it for about 6 months until I destroyed the diff... Which punched a hole in the sump = knackered engine as all the oil spilt out!!!...

Replaced the engine/gearbox.... Used the car to go to Scotland.. So I'm travelling

with my ex and my daughter who was a baby at the time, car was loaded, I also had a small trailer on the back which was also loaded..

I was travelling up the A74 ( well before the M74 was built ).. Through southern Scotland at around 55-60mph.. The A74 was a dual carraigeway that had bus stops and junctions that allowed vehicles to cross the central reservations to join...

As I was travelling north I spotted a coach ( National Express ) pulling out across the southbound carraigeway, but instead of stopping in the central reservation he pulled out on me...!!!!! I hit the anchors ( Front drums = crap brakes )

and only just missed hitting him,, in fact the only reason i did'nt was the fact that the coach was accelerating at that point... Safe to say if i had hit it i would not be here telling you about it....

SCARY...

Coach driver did get some abuse when I finally overtook him... !!!

cheers

Dazz

Minis are great little cars.

My first car was a Ford Fiesta 1.1L - perfect first car at the time, did me well. My expectations/budget etc were different then compared to now. Anything built in the past 5 years or so will be pretty safe compared to most things that are older than that (car-wise).

For older cars, the bigger ones tend to be safer as there is just more stuff there to absorb any hits if you are hit from the front.

I'd say - enjoy the drive