Battery drain, and refusal of engine to even turn over

[Breezy_Pete]

Well done, good progress. Did you try sepulchrave's suggestion of trying to turn the radio on when the keys are out of the ignition? That will probably tell you whether it's wired in correctly or not. It shouldn't work until the key is inserted, I think.

It does sound like your 70mA 24/7 battery drain is the heart of the problem.

 

Your 'engine on - all electrics off' charging voltage is a little lower than ideal, try measuring right at the alternator if you can get access (both probes of multimeter, positive on the output stud, negative on the case of the alternator, scraping through any surface corrosion for a good connection.  If it's 14.5 there, and 14.25 at the battery, there's a poor connection somewhere between the two.

 

Some of these alternators seem to have recessed square 'test pads' for probing output (may need to break though corrosion on these too), this one for example:

 

Edited 7 February, 2016 by Wino

[FLAPPERJACK7]

Hi which Skoda dealer did you take it too?

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

[Karsty]

He took it to Citygate Skoda, Chalk Hill, (Bushey) Watford.

[Karsty]

Just checked the radio, it cannot be turned on without the keys in the ignition. You have to turn the key 1 click and it comes on. If you turn it back again, the radio stays on. If you pull the key out, it goes off.

 

Then I took it out, and these are the wires:

 

 

Some red, but no yellow.

 

This is the stereo:

 

 

Any suggestions?

 

 

Edited 14 February, 2016 by Karsty

[wiredsoftware]

What are those blue connectors for? Looks like maybe an aerial booster?

(Edit: see my next post)

Edited 14 February, 2016 by wiredsoftware

[wiredsoftware]

At least one of those blue connectors seems to be on the "black with blue stripe" wire. That wire is the permanent live that runs directly from fuse 45 in the fuse box. I'd be very suspicious of whatever that is giving power to.

 

If you need to move it to a switched live, I think it's the wire that's brown with red stripe on connector A to the head unit is switched with the ignition. Make sure you get the one from the right connector, as there is one of the same colour on the speaker connector!

Edited 14 February, 2016 by wiredsoftware

[Breezy_Pete]

Take the Scotchlocks off and see if the current drain goes away. Then see if anything doesn't work that previously did.

[sepulchrave]

That is indeed an aerial booster and it should NOT be attached to the permanent live.

[entapryz]

I've read your thread and i too have been having battery issues.

I have replaced my battery several times. (Luckily my mate works at a spares shop and just swaps the battery for me.)

This does help, but obviously isn't getting to the root of the issue. And now that its esp cold, i've had to help my battery by jump starting it.

This has meant that i have to carry a spare battery and jumper cables in the car!!!

Its weird because, every 6 weeks or so, more often since its been cold, i have to jump start my car. It just seems that it doesn't have enough ooommppppfff to turn the car over.

It just needs a little help. 

 

I have an aftermarket radio, amplifier (on a switch). I do not leave any electricals connected. I do not leave the lights on etc.

 

Just getting tired of lugging an extra battery and jumper cables around.

 

any help appreciated.

[sepulchrave]

 

I've read your thread and i too have been having battery issues.

I have replaced my battery several times. (Luckily my mate works at a spares shop and just swaps the battery for me.)

This does help, but obviously isn't getting to the root of the issue. And now that its esp cold, i've had to help my battery by jump starting it.

This has meant that i have to carry a spare battery and jumper cables in the car!!!

Its weird because, every 6 weeks or so, more often since its been cold, i have to jump start my car. It just seems that it doesn't have enough ooommppppfff to turn the car over.

It just needs a little help. 

 

I have an aftermarket radio, amplifier (on a switch). I do not leave any electricals connected. I do not leave the lights on etc.

 

Just getting tired of lugging an extra battery and jumper cables around.

 

any help appreciated.

 

 

Best guess is a tired starter motor drawing too much current and not turning fast enough.

[entapryz]

thanks for the reply.

Are they dear and how easy to fit?

How much would it cost to get a new one fitted?

Sorry for all the questions....

[sepulchrave]

thanks for the reply.

Are they dear and how easy to fit?

How much would it cost to get a new one fitted?

Sorry for all the questions....

 

No idea, sorry, I do all my own work and I'd get the existing starter rebuilt by a local firm who do all my stuff.

[wiredsoftware]

@entapryz, do the parasitic draw test like the OP did, you may have the same issue.

[Karsty]

Hi Folks,

 

 

 

 

 

Sorry it's been a while, been dealing with this, that, and everything!

 

Ok, honestly, I was a little confused by the last instructions. But, I heaved it out again, and did my best to make 1 step.

 

I undid the blue scotchlock which attached the White Wire to the Black & Blue Wire, and pulled off the White Wire. Then I tested the drain, and it was 0.025 Amps. Ok, this is apparently acceptable, but with fuse 45 removed, it is 0.01 Amps, so there is still something dodgy going on. Below is a photo of how I left it. The radio seemed to work ok like this.

 

 

 

Wiredsoftware, please can you be really specific, Which connector? What colour connector? I don't know what the Head Unit is or Connector A? I don't know which is the Speaker Connector?

 

Wino, I will follow your instructions of course, I just feel a bit wary of going headlong into it. I don't really know what I'm dealing with.

 

Don't worry, I am very practical. It's just a case of "it's easy when you know how"!

 

 

 

 

Many thanks,

 

K.

[sepulchrave]

Brutal scotchblockery, hateful to mine eyes.

[vRSAnt]

On the same vein as just "twisting the wires together and hoping for the best"

[FLAPPERJACK7]

Speaker connector is the brown block. Black is power ,earth , s contact.

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

[wiredsoftware]

"Head unit" is another name for radio.

[wiredsoftware]

The white wire presumably goes to your aerial booster (a thingy attached to the massive black wire on its own, roughly the size of a cigarette lighter, usually in a metal cylinder). Without it attached, you won't have the draw, but you may find your AM/FM radio reception is poor. You need to connect the White one back to the switched live I mentioned earlier if you experience reception issues. If you mostly just listen to CDs, you can leave it disconnected.

Edited 8 March, 2016 by wiredsoftware

[Karsty]

Hi Flapperjack7,

 

 

"Speaker connector is the brown block. Black is power ,earth , s contact."  -  Thanks for that info. So when you say Black is power, do you mean both of the black and blue wires??  What do you mean about "earth, s contact"??

 

 

 

Hi Wiredsoftware,

 

I think I've clocked what is the aerial booster.  I've uploaded a couple more photos with the unit turned upside down to get a better view of the wires in the black connector... Do you mean the switched live is the thin brown and red wire coming out of the black connector??

 

Also, the thicker blue/black wire coming out of the black connector has a separate brown/red wire scotchblocked to it. What's that all about?

 

 

 

I still need to figure out what that last 0.015 Amp draw is.... How can I do that??

 

 

Thanks for everything!

 

 

 

 

K.

[wiredsoftware]

What Flapperjack7 meant to say was I think "Speaker connector is the brown block (i.e. all the speaker wires are on the brown block). The Black BLOCK is everything else (e.g. power cables, earth cables...)"". 

 

I see in the second picture that you have part of a scotch connector still on the black+blue wire (the metal bit shaped like an "E"). For God's sake remove that, it's at risk of shorting behind the radio and causing a fire.

 

 

"Do you mean the switched live is the thin brown and red wire coming out of the black connector??"

Yes. In your pics there is a brown+red wire that is just under the black+blue one, that is the switched live, the white wire should be patched into that to put the booster back.

 

 

I can't see properly, but it looks like the brown+red wire may already have another connector on it underneath the one you have pictured, don't know what that is doing...

 

Your last bit of draw may not be anything to worry about, it's very low. Additionally, does it still happen after the car has been left sitting for an hour? Immediately after turning the car off, certain systems remain active for a little while.

Edited 9 March, 2016 by wiredsoftware

[Karsty]

Hi Wired,

 

 

I've taken the metal E off the wire, and put insulating tape on the offending bits. Still have to study it a bit more. There's actually 2 red/brown wires. 1 wire coming into the system which stops where it is patched into the black/blue at the front of the view of last pic. Also a brown/red wire coming out of the black connector going off into the sunset. What are they?

Edited 9 March, 2016 by Karsty

[wiredsoftware]

The red/brown wire coming from the black connector is the switched live (i.e. it only comes on when you turn the ignition key on). No idea what the other one is. As no car manufacturer will EVER use those blue scotch connectors, it must be something that is not a standard part of the car (or was standard and someone has mucked about with it!). It's wired directly into the permanent live, so if you're still suspecting a draw is happening, it's your next candidate. Bear in mind that a car will always draw some power when off (albeit a very small amount), just think how your dashboard clock is always on etc.

[Karsty]

Thanks Wired,

 

 

Will get onto it again asap.

 

 

 

K.

[Cpat]

Well, I have just spent an interesting couple of hours on the car.

Results for battery test:

With nothing on at all, 12.63V

Engine on, all electrics off, 14.25V

With engine off and all electrics on , 11.625V

Engine on, all electrics on, 13.93V

Are those the signs of a healthy battery or of a bad one?

Ok, then I moved on to the fuse box. First I had to find out how to make the driver's door think it was closed when it wasn't. So I googled and found out the switch for the interior lights was actually inside the door lock. So I fiddled with a screwdriver and moved the catch right up, - the lights went out.

So I set the multimeter to 10A DC, and connected it between the negative pole and the negative lead. I printed out this fuse panel diagram - http://www.norton42.org.uk/389-broken-windscreen-wipers-on-a-skoda-fabia.html

For fuses 1, 43, 44, and 49 there was some strange fluctuations on removal and replacement, but it always settled back to 0.066A

Then, something unbelievable happened............... I removed fuse 45, and it dropped to 0.01A ! ! ! ! ! ! ! !

This was for the radio (there is no navigation system).

None of us can quite believe it, we are actually a bit stunned! All the same, time will tell what is actually the case.

So I have left that fuse out of its slot. At the moment, no radio, but (hopefully) no stress.

The next thing for me to do is see if I can get anywhere with the wiring circuit for the radio. Any tips, suggestions, advice?

Many thanks for all your help and comments!!!

(by the way, after all this when I was fiddling about with the door catch and door handle to get the catch back to the open position, the two front electric windows started opening. Should this be any cause for concern?)

Hi, I've had the same issues with my Fabia. Eventually replaced my 90amp valeo alternator with a refurbished 120amp bosch. Problem solved. After a few weeks of problems, and reading lots online, I was lead to believe the alternator output is regulated. So with the engine running it's at 14.5volts, switch the lights on, the voltage dips but then should come back up to 14.5v. I checked all my electrics for drains, and I was having issues whilst driving the car.

Well, I have just spent an interesting couple of hours on the car.

Results for battery test:

With nothing on at all, 12.63V

Engine on, all electrics off, 14.25V

With engine off and all electrics on , 11.625V

Engine on, all electrics on, 13.93V

Are those the signs of a healthy battery or of a bad one?

Ok, then I moved on to the fuse box. First I had to find out how to make the driver's door think it was closed when it wasn't. So I googled and found out the switch for the interior lights was actually inside the door lock. So I fiddled with a screwdriver and moved the catch right up, - the lights went out.

So I set the multimeter to 10A DC, and connected it between the negative pole and the negative lead. I printed out this fuse panel diagram - http://www.norton42.org.uk/389-broken-windscreen-wipers-on-a-skoda-fabia.html

For fuses 1, 43, 44, and 49 there was some strange fluctuations on removal and replacement, but it always settled back to 0.066A

Then, something unbelievable happened............... I removed fuse 45, and it dropped to 0.01A ! ! ! ! ! ! ! !

This was for the radio (there is no navigation system).

None of us can quite believe it, we are actually a bit stunned! All the same, time will tell what is actually the case.

So I have left that fuse out of its slot. At the moment, no radio, but (hopefully) no stress.

The next thing for me to do is see if I can get anywhere with the wiring circuit for the radio. Any tips, suggestions, advice?

Many thanks for all your help and comments!!!

(by the way, after all this when I was fiddling about with the door catch and door handle to get the catch back to the open position, the two front electric windows started opening. Should this be any cause for concern?)

Hi, I've had the same issues with my Fabia. Eventually replaced my 90amp valeo alternator with a refurbished 120amp bosch. Problem solved. After a few weeks of problems, and reading lots online, I was lead to believe the alternator output is regulated. So with the engine running it's at 14.5volts, switch the lights on, the voltage dips but then should come back up to 14.5v. I checked all my electrics for drains, and I was having issues whilst driving the car. Couldn't identify any drains so I can only assume hardly any charge was going back to the battery. My car had 2 brand new batteries so I could rule that out.

I got a refurbished alternator from

Schmitz Rotary Engineering LTD

Tel: 0121 622 2976

They sell them on eBay, mine cost £79.99. Arrived next day, looked brand new, very happy.

Sent from my Nexus 9 using Tapatalk