Have skoda reduced the Front brake disc size on new VRS's?

[AirborneVRS]

The 2.0 TDI 184ps is not a performance model though, just a 2.0 TDI 184ps.

The engine comes in other Volkswagen Group vehicles that are not performance models either.

A vRS badge does not make it sporting just gives it Sporty Looks.

Good torque and equally good engine braking.

Brakes up to the job of driving on the public road even public roads with higher speed limits than the UK.

If tracking one you know what maybe needs doing, better brakes, better brake fluid and lighten it.

Totally agree with you but read what I have said.

The vRS is termed "the performance/sporty" model. I am in no way saying it is a super car. Just that when I was told this is the "performance" model and explained that it has the "performance" suspension/brakes/seats etc at the time of negotiating my price with the dealer then that is what I except.

I have purchased a product and not received it. That is a simple concept and is fact.

Regardless of whether I am going to take the car 144mph is irrelevant. I would like the product that I purchased.

Otherwise, every Tom, **** and Harry who purchases a Porsche, Ferrari, Bugatti should be given a Fiesta 1.4 as this is perfectly adequate for normal road use and speeds.

Point is, I purchased a product and at the time of sale this is what was meant to be on the car. Changing the spec afterwards without consulting me is dishonest.

Edited 29 April, 2016 by AirborneVRS

[AirborneVRS]

On the subject of it having a 2.0L TDI 184 - I have just gone on the Skoda configerator and looked through the other models of Octavia Hatch and I couldn't find any which are offered in 184ps engine.

Not even the L&K is offered with this engine according to the Skoda configerator.

[SC03OTT]

Surely the argument could still be made that the smaller disc is still a 'performance' setup? It's what comes on the GTI and GTD no, unless upgraded? Had it come with a regular 288m(?) disc from a bog standard Octavia then it would be different. I'm not on either side of the fence btw. Just asking a question.

[AirborneVRS]

Indeed. They could equally say that this is a performance improvement due to reduction in weight.

Either way. I have purchased a product which is not as described/identified by the dealer and which is ever so slightly different due to the factory deciding to change it after my verbal/written contract was agreed.

Of they won't budge, then please give me the difference in cost between the brake setups. As I have purchased one thing but not received it.

[flybynite]

This is a really interesting one and I can see all sides of this.

To think you are getting something and not get it, especially on a new car is gutting when you may have spent a lot of time, effort and money speccing the car, I have had it myself more than once. A lot of people have had things disappear with a model 'improvement'

Whether there is any recourse will depend on whether there was any published spec or written agreement at that time which led you to believe that is what you were getting. To have any real teeth to the argument it needs to be in print or writing from the exact time. If it was not then the case is a lot weaker, but you can still raise it as most big companies will do something to appease an angry customer as it is good business. If you don't ask........

I drive both sizes and which one is 'better' is not clear. A lot of people do not like the 340mm brakes and I can see why. I have no doubt that cost came into it, no doubt emissions too but they may just have decided the 312mm brakes were better suited to the car. The diesel may have been more critical on weight or emissions targets but I would not rule out that the petrol may follow, 312 became the standard on the Golf GTi.

It is a real shame that Skoda did not just add it as an option like the Golf 'Performance Pack' for those that wanted it.

The other thing I have learned is - if it is that important to you, agree it in writing before you buy it. It may not mean you get what you want but it makes it easier to get something back if you don't. Getting the dealer to sign to the effect that you will get x,y and z or it will be exactly like car a, b or c shouldn't be a problem, if it is go somewhere else.

[AirborneVRS]

When I agreed the car, there was no option of "upgrading" the brakes and was told it comes with the "performance" set up.

I do think it is fair to receive what I was told and what was agreed regardless of whether it is required.

[flybynite]

On the subject of it having a 2.0L TDI 184 - I have just gone on the Skoda configerator and looked through the other models of Octavia Hatch and I couldn't find any which are offered in 184ps engine.

Not even the L&K is offered with this engine according to the Skoda configerator.

In other markets it is, even in 4x4 have a look at Skoda Ireland.

[Ootohere]

'Performance and a MK3 Octavia Diesel just not happening',  Sporty Looks in a Skoda type way'. add tat / badges and call it Performance.

Seats, Wheels, body kit, exhaust pipes etc etc,  A Trim Level maybe even less sporty than a Scout version with part time AWD, and no better than some SEAT TDI 184 ps. 

If the Brochure lead you to believe you were getting a Performance Model then you had best look at the start of a Mis-selling Scandal.

[AirborneVRS]

I can see all sides as well. Maybe I am playing devils advocate here. I think it is mostly the principle of it.

[k3vkr]

'Performance and a MK3 Octavia Diesel just not happening',  Sporty Looks in a Skoda type way'. add tat / badges and call it Performance.

Seats, Wheels, body kit, exhaust pipes etc etc,  A Trim Level maybe even less sporty than a Scout version with part time AWD, and no better than some SEAT TDI 184 ps. 

If the Brochure lead you to believe you were getting a Performance Model then you had best look at the start of a Mis-selling Scandal.

 

Saying something over and over wont change peoples thoughts on this mate

[AirborneVRS]

HaHahaha. Indeed. I'm assuming the above was aimed at me. I am by no stretch of the imagination saying it is a performance car. Don't get me wrong wrong here.

Just that it is sold as such:

1. First sentence of paragraph three in both images from the brochure.

Don't mistake what I am saying.

It was sold as such with a certain specification as explained. This is what I expect. Regardless of the vehicle or product.

[AirborneVRS]

Knew this would open a can of worms.

All I've done is highlight that some may have an issue with lack of communication from Skoda and a change of spec without notice.

I've brought it to Skoda's attention and hopefully it will be of benefit to someone. As I have said many times, I am happy with the performance of the car and brakes and I do not think the car is a super/performance car.

What I'm unhappy with, is not getting what I believed I was entitled to as per my agreement with the dealer in 2015.

[Ootohere]

'What Car' car of the year 2015 was the Fabia before any customer even had one.

Rally Car DNA with the front wheel drive cars with 110 ps engines.

 

'Hints at' actually says it all the the vRS Octavias, 

hints at and fails to be more than Warm Hatches / Estates given the weight of them.

 

Lots gets lost in translation from German to Czech then into English.

[TonyD]

I have a 220 TSI estate delivered 1 month ago and it's got 340mm brakes

[AirborneVRS]

Forget whether or not it is a "performance" car. This is completely irrelevant to the argument.

I have purchased a product of a set specification. That is exactly what I expect regardless of whether it is required or needed.

For example, if I purchased an antique vinyl player for £500 to listen to all my LP's and as a nice piece of history but was sent a £100 Sony CD player, I shouldn't argue. Because at the end of the day, they both play music and if anything the smaller, more compact CD player possibly does it better. But ultimately, I shouldn't argue that it wasn't what I purchased or ive lost money.

[Genoa1893]

[OT]

This temptation is too strong for me: you are perfectly aware that there is a 99% probability that your £500 worth good analogue rig overperformes your £500 CDP, aren't you?

[/OT]

 

So yes and yes, Skoda should stop ignoring the specifications agreed on the contracts and pay for any inconsistency.

Edited 29 April, 2016 by Genoa1893

[Gromle]

So yes and yes, Skoda should stop ignoring the specifications agreed on the contracts and pay for any inconsistency.

But are the brakes specified anywhere?

[Mallettsmallett]

If this really was going to go anywhere, McDonald's would be buggered.

Have you ever had a big mac that looks like the picture?

[AirborneVRS]

Ok.

First Q: Are we agreed that any product which is sold, should be what is recieved? Irrelevant whether it is a £1 pack of sweets or a £100,000 car.

Second Q: What was the standard set up for brakes on diesel vRS's in late 2015?

Skoda have informed me that as of 01/01/16 only diesels will be fitted with 312mm brakes.

Third Q: Is it unreasonable to ask for the product that I was sold, especially when I have paid for it and it was standard spec at the time of my contract agreement?

[AirborneVRS]

If this really was going to go anywhere, McDonald's would be buggered.

Have you ever had a big mac that looks like the picture?

Totally accept your argument here but if it was a £28k hamburger then it bloody better had be.

[Petevrs184]

Having owned a mk11 vrs tsi I would say the brakes were inadequate when driving a bit quicker, the 340mm bakes on my current vrs are fantastic, and until now would have been the reason for buying another vrs tdi. I feel like I am now being forced to buy a performance petrol in order to get good brakes. I have also had a gtd for two weeks and after my brakes on my vrs felt inadequate.

[VRS1878]

I've had my phone call from Skoda today and to be fair it was quite positive, I've no doubt the small print in the brochure is going to be their get out clause but the lad who I spoke to (who said he's dealing with all the brake size complaints now) seemed fully on board with my feelings and it looked like the main point of investigation would be why this significant change has not been communicated down to either dealers or customers, he's promised to update further on Wednesday. Whatever, it's gathering pace and they seemed very interested as to what internet reaction was too. In reply to some of the comments above I totally disagree that the diesel is not a "performance" model, correct me if I'm wrong but the golf gtd is categorised as performance on their website and the focus St is available in both fuel forms so that doesn't wash with me, if it's not up to par don't brand it as vrs and call it a sport or something instead. At the end of the day my car was not delivered as expected and I want answers as to why and some sort of recognition for the fact.

[john999boy]

On a slight tangent to this debate - does this once again mean that 16" (winter) wheels will fit the diesel Vrs?

[AirborneVRS]

Having owned a mk11 vrs tsi I would say the brakes were inadequate when driving a bit quicker, the 340mm bakes on my current vrs are fantastic, and until now would have been the reason for buying another vrs tdi. I feel like I am now being forced to buy a performance petrol in order to get good brakes. I have also had a gtd for two weeks and after my brakes on my vrs felt inadequate.

I assume that is due to the vRS's extra size and weight compared to the GTD? I have no real experience with a GTD.

I've had my phone call from Skoda today and to be fair it was quite positive, I've no doubt the small print in the brochure is going to be their get out clause but the lad who I spoke to (who said he's dealing with all the brake size complaints now) seemed fully on board with my feelings and it looked like the main point of investigation would be why this significant change has not been communicated down to either dealers or customers, he's promised to update further on Wednesday. Whatever, it's gathering pace and they seemed very interested as to what internet reaction was too. In reply to some of the comments above I totally disagree that the diesel is not a "performance" model, correct me if I'm wrong but the golf gtd is categorised as performance on their website and the focus St is available in both fuel forms so that doesn't wash with me, if it's not up to par don't brand it as vrs and call it a sport or something instead. At the end of the day my car was not delivered as expected and I want answers as to why and some sort of recognition for the fact.

This my point exactly. Regardless of the terminology used ("performance", "hot hatch", "executive saloon", "super car", "hyper car"), the product is not as agreed. Therefore further investigation is required and a suitable answer provided. Someone has to be held accountable for this change and the change should only affect those whos contract/agreement started in 2016 not those in 2015.

On a slight tangent to this debate - does this once again mean that 16" (winter) wheels will fit the diesel Vrs?

No experience of winter wheels on this car yet but assuming it can clear 312mm discs and calipers then assume you can run 16" winter wheels. I am sure someone with more knowledge will be available soon.

[JPH0091]

...

No experience of winter wheels on this car yet but assuming it can clear 312mm discs and calipers then assume you can run 16" winter wheels. I am sure someone with more knowledge will be available soon.

 

Yes, this was stated and confirmed several times in the initial pages of the topic.