Remember Octavia 3 halogens are not only poor on dip compared to xenons they are also worse than Octavia 2 halogens.

Sneaky change from projector lenses to reflectors (UK market cars)

Technically you are right, but despite the projector lens on the mk2 I found their performance inferior to the halogens on my mk3.

In fact the lights were the most disappointing thing about the mk2. Never mentioned in any reviews I read either.

Aussie country roads have no lighting if the moon is not out and quite a lot of largish nocturnal creatures best avoided.

Not sure about this but do Osram still hold design rights on the H15 bulb? thus restricting other companies from making their own version.

 

Agree with vtec to vrs! it's the H7 (dip) that has more need of the upgrade.

 

It may also be that the design of the H15 leaves less potential for an upgrade over standard.

 

While I still think the dip on the Octavia 3 is a bit worse than the Octavia 2 (I liked the well defined cutoff of projectors), I think the main beam is a bit better. These things can be subjective though, as any discussion on the merits of different bulbs tends to reveal. There is also the issue of inconsistency, looking at magazine reports it does not appear uncommon for two examples of the same bulb to perform differently.   

hi , i ve read hundreads of lines about upgrading headlight bulps to an octavia mk3 1.4 tsi ( now has halogen with reflectors )

 

i ve heard that aftermarket chineze HID's maybe be dangerous for car's ecu. is it true?

also i 've read that hids that work are h7R with dc instead of ac ballasts

 

the other choice is leds.i am between these two

 

1. philips ultinon extreme gen 2 + 250%

and

2. novsight h7 leds ( 1/3 price comapre to philips ) 

 

what do you suggest? sorry if my english is bad and greetings from Greece!!

On 18/12/2016 at 11:30, Octy0GG said:

Remember Octavia 3 halogens are not only poor on dip compared to xenons they are also worse than Octavia 2 halogens.

 

Sneaky change from projector lenses to reflectors (UK market cars)

 

Ive just gone from Octy2 to Octy 3 and I'd noticed that. Thought it was just ageing eyes

 

22 hours ago, RIncewindwiz said:

 

Ive just gone from Octy2 to Octy 3 and I'd noticed that. Thought it was just ageing eyes

 

 

Going from Oct 2 Xenon to Oct 3 halogen ..... OMG - are they on!

Maybe something like this will give much better lighting

Order the right hids from hids 4 u for reflector lenses and they work , no coding just plug and play

 

Edited 21 November, 20196 yr by skippy41

1 hour ago, skippy41 said:

Order the right hids from hids 4 u for reflector lenses and they work , no coding just plug and play

Since the reflector lenses are not Type Approved for HID bulbs fitting them should be an MOT fail (since May 2018), but I know of several people who have retrofitted HID bulbs in non Type Approved headlamps on different vehicles and have passed an MOT test since the guidelines were changed so it seems many MOT testers are not able to apply the new guidelines fully.

 

 

Edited 21 November, 20196 yr by PetrolDave

1 hour ago, skippy41 said:

Order the right hids from hids 4 u for reflector lenses and they work , no coding just plug and play

 

 

I pass about 5 cars on the way to work daily that have HID kits in reflector lights and the amount of glare they give off is shocking.   They arent road legal for good reason.  The HID kits in the projector lamps whilst again not legal for road use are no where near as bad.

1 hour ago, ScoutCJB said:

 

I pass about 5 cars on the way to work daily that have HID kits in reflector lights and the amount of glare they give off is shocking.   They arent road legal for good reason.  The HID kits in the projector lamps whilst again not legal for road use are no where near as bad.

The hids 4 u kits have  the correct  bulbs for  the reflector the bulbs  have  a shroud running  their  length so that  they give  the correct kick up and don't  dazzle, I have  had  them  in for  the last 6 months and passed  an mot with them  in 

25 minutes ago, skippy41 said:

I have  had  them  in for  the last 6 months and passed  an mot with them  in 

Well, you shouldn't have passed the MOT as you have HID bulbs in a headlamp that isn't Type Approved for HID bulbs, which should be an MOT fail.

 

Since May 2018 just having correct headlamp aim and beam pattern isn't enough according to the MOT guidelines, see MOT Guidelines since May 2018

@skippy41 - Even H7R bulbs cause glare, much like when another user fitted a set to their MK3 Octavia: https://www.briskoda.net/forums/topic/389997-h15-hid-headlight-upgrade/?do=findComment&comment=4546155

 

 

58 minutes ago, skippy41 said:

The hids 4 u kits have  the correct  bulbs for  the reflector the bulbs  have  a shroud running  their  length so that  they give  the correct kick up and don't  dazzle, I have  had  them  in for  the last 6 months and passed  an mot with them  in 

 

 

This is taken directly from their website.  Its stating they arent road legal and wont pass an MOT (but suggest swapping them out at MOT time!) .... Doesn't matter about glare to oncoming users.  Also not all their bulbs have a reflector shield option but i guess that wont stop some people using them. 

 

As its a none road legal modification, if an insurance claim needed to be made, technically you wouldn't be covered and they could refuse to pay out .... unless you had declared it, but then the insurance company would surely refuse to have insured in the first place?

 

(Is HID Xenon legal) - Unfortunately no aftermarket HID kit is strictly road legal as you are changing the lighting system (from halogen to gas discharge) in your car and for this reason the bulbs can't be E marked which is a legal requirement. You also won't have the self leveling and washer systems installed which is also a legal requirement for HID and without these installed the kit would be an MOT failure. HID kits are plug and play so they are easy to remove and replace with standard bulbs come MOT time.

11 minutes ago, ScoutCJB said:

(Is HID Xenon legal) - Unfortunately no aftermarket HID kit is strictly road legal as you are changing the lighting system (from halogen to gas discharge) in your car and for this reason the bulbs can't be E marked which is a legal requirement. You also won't have the self leveling and washer systems installed which is also a legal requirement for HID and without these installed the kit would be an MOT failure. HID kits are plug and play so they are easy to remove and replace with standard bulbs come MOT time.

While agreeing that aftermarket HIDs should be an MOT failure (see my previous posts in this thread), HIDS4U have not been 100% correct with this statement.

 

The MOT guidelines (section 4.1.5)  state that where self levelling is fitted it must work, but do not require self levelling to be fitted:

Quote

Vehicles equipped with High Intensity Discharge (HID) or LED dipped beam headlamps may be fitted with a suspension or headlamp self-levelling system. Where such systems are fitted, they must work; however, it is accepted that it may not be possible to readily determine the functioning of self-levelling systems. In such cases, the benefit of the doubt must be given.

 

The situation regarding headlamp washers (section 4.1.6) is similar vague again only requiring that they work if fitted:

Quote

This inspection only applies to vehicles first used on or after 1 September 2009 equipped with headlamp washers.

 

So the lack of either self levelling or headlamp washers is NOT an MOT fail, but the fitment of HID bulbs to headlamps not Type Approved for them IS an MOT fail:

Quote

Some vehicles may be fitted with High Intensity Discharge (HID) headlamps. It is not permitted to convert existing halogen headlamp units for use with HID bulbs. If it is clear that such a conversion has been carried out, rather than replacing the entire unit with one designed and approved for use with HID bulbs, the headlamp should be rejected.

 

The MOT guidelines are a complete mess in this area IMHO...

Edited 21 November, 20196 yr by PetrolDave

Its interesting to say that it may not be possible to check self levelling - I though all Xenon equipped cars did a self level test at start up (all the cars I have had did this).

 

I did just find this though on the Gov website.

 

General legislative guidance on aftermarket HID Headlamps

In the Department for Transport’s (DfT) view it is not legal to sell or use after market HID lighting kits, for converting conventional Halogen headlamps to HID Xenon. If a customer wants to convert his vehicle to Xenon HID he must purchase completely new Xenon HID headlamps. The reason for this is that the existing lens and reflector are designed around a Halogen filament bulb, working to very precise tolerances. If one places a HID “burner” (bulb) in the headlamp, the beam pattern will not be correct, there will be glare in some places and not enough light in other places within the beam pattern.

Just now, ScoutCJB said:

Its interesting to say that it may not be possible to check self levelling - I though all Xenon equipped cars did a self level test at start up (all the cars I have had did this).

 

I did just find this though on the Gov website.

 

General legislative guidance on aftermarket HID Headlamps

In the Department for Transport’s (DfT) view it is not legal to sell or use after market HID lighting kits, for converting conventional Halogen headlamps to HID Xenon. If a customer wants to convert his vehicle to Xenon HID he must purchase completely new Xenon HID headlamps. The reason for this is that the existing lens and reflector are designed around a Halogen filament bulb, working to very precise tolerances. If one places a HID “burner” (bulb) in the headlamp, the beam pattern will not be correct, there will be glare in some places and not enough light in other places within the beam pattern.

Ahh but you've fallen foul of the great stupidity of the MOT Test - it is NOT a test for legality.

 

As this HID issue illustrates it is perfectly possible to pass the MOT Test with a vehicle that is illegal - crazy but true sadly.

2 minutes ago, PetrolDave said:

Ahh but you've fallen foul of the great stupidity of the MOT Test - it is NOT a test for legality.

 

As this HID issue illustrates it is perfectly possible to pass the MOT Test with a vehicle that is illegal - crazy but true sadly.

 

True, its for road worthyness ------- but is a  car with an illegal modification road worthy?

Just now, ScoutCJB said:

True, its for road worthyness ------- but is a  car with an illegal modification road worthy?

Logically no, but according to the MOT guidelines yes

I have read that some new cars have low power hids installed from factory.

As I have understood the mandatory self leveling and lamp washers are tied to amount of light the headlamps emit. So if they are under certain brightness, they do not need self leveling and lamp washers and can still be factory fitted hids.

Normally halogen head lamps are under that brightness level and come with no leveling or washers but some cars come from factory with low power xenons and do not need them either. 

Maybe that's why the MOT guidelines are so vague because there are factory xenons on the market that are not surpassing the brightness requirement?

Of course it is marketing BS so that sales people can say oh, this car have xenons but they are actually not on the level people expect them to be.

A xenon under the washer / auto levelling limit will still throw out far more light than a legal halogen so not just marketing BS

1 hour ago, Kental said:

A xenon under the washer / auto levelling limit will still throw out far more light than a legal halogen so not just marketing BS

A measured lumen output does not care what type of bulb it emanates from. However the temperature emitted can appear to be 'brighter' and of course the efficiencies of xenon and led are far better than halogen.

Edited 21 November, 20196 yr by Gerrycan

From memory a 2000 lumen HID doesn’t need a washer, above that you do. Premium Osram Nightbreaker Laser bulbs are circa 1550 lumens so a HID with no washer can still be significantly brighter than a legal halogen bulb.

1 hour ago, Kental said:

From memory a 2000 lumen HID doesn’t need a washer, above that you do. Premium Osram Nightbreaker Laser bulbs are circa 1550 lumens so a HID with no washer can still be significantly brighter than a legal halogen bulb.

How confident are you your memory will stand up to cross examination in a court of law?  

 

Edited 22 November, 20196 yr by Gerrycan

My source is a car magazine that explained why there are cars on the market with xenon headlamps and no lamp washing and auto leveling systems. So my next thought was, maybe MOT rules are so vague because of those cases.

Anyhow I really do not care enough about this topic to research this correctly.

However 2000 lumen limit is correct for washers but this apply's only to low beams, there are halogen bulbs that are brighter than this but they are usually used only on high beams.

And when I said people get worse headlamps that are lower level than people expect, I compared apples to apples. Technically they are correct, car has xenon headlamps, they just are not at the level people expect them to be because of what they generally expect from xenon headlamps.

Edited 22 November, 20196 yr by TonisT

6 hours ago, Gerrycan said:

How confident are you your memory will stand up to cross examination in a court of law?  

 

Why I am sticking with upgraded but still EC approved halogen bulbs. 😉