HID's in yeti reflector

[Wheelie1]

Just been browsing the forums (after a few tinnies), so bear with me..... Forget which topic I was reading, but, Furbytom posted a link in said thread to HID coversions. On visiting the link it was advertising two different hid bulbs, depending on whether needed for PROJECTOR or REFLECTOR.

It stated, if for reflector fitting, then you need the 'anti-glare' bulb. If for projector, you need the 'normal' bulb. Can anyone tell me if it is possible/legal to fit. I've read all about the "headlight-police" in the past, but is this anti-glare HID a reality? I really hope so as my yeti is a little bit dim lol.

Mally.

[Llanigraham]

2 points:

 

Surely the choice of type will depend on what bulb is fitted in the first place? I thought the only Yeti's with projector type lenses already had HID's fitted. What ever is fitted will need a resistor to stop the Bulb Failure system showing a blown bulb.

 

Glare can be a reality. The reflector in a headlight is designed for a certain focal length of bulb, say a H4. If a HID is fitted that has a different focal length, and many of the cheap ones have that, then they can AND do cause glare. I have friends who are MOT inspectors and they do fail cars regularly for both glare and indefined beam shape.

 

 

[weasley]

You can get kits that essentially convert a reflector headlight to a projector one.  It requires the disassembly of the headlight to fit a projector in place of the H4 bulb, then reassemble the light and fit a HID bulb into the projector.  I'm not sure it's worth the hassle though when the Yeti halogens are so good (especially with Nightbreakers or similar in place).

[ejstubbs]

I agree with Weasley - you're almost certainly better off fitting decent Halogens such as Nightbreakers than trying to implement a legal HID conversion (which is what I understood the OP to be trying to achieve).

 

(I'm also pondering the OP's 20% window tints.  I know they're legal, but if he's complaining that the headlights are bit dim...style over substance?)

[Macdemon]

Why not just change the bulbs for better standard bulbs with a higher colour temperature???   

 

Something like 5000Kelvin rather than HID units, that will save you a few quid

[Wheelie1]

OK... must cut down on the alcohol. My recently departed fabia11 had projectors (they were carp), so I had them upgraded to HID's (they were brill).

I have no inentions of upgrading my reflector units to projector, cant afford it. No.. what I was trying to say, is, that link said & quote "if needed for reflector units, please choose the anti-dazzle bulb, if needed for projector units, please choose normal bulb"

This clearly (or not) gave me the impression, that I would be ok with the anti-dazzle bulb. Am I missing something here, or just thick?

@ejstubbs, yes mate 20%, but I didn't mean the windscreen

Mally.

 

[langers2k]

They aren't legal as:

- the optics aren't designed for a HID light source

- it needs washers/self-levelling for light sources over 2000lm to meet the ECE regs

 

The 'anti-glare' HID kits just have a metal shield around the HID capsule to try and reduce glare, however, in most cases they simply aren't effective as the design of reflector headlights vary so greatly. The seller doesn't actually care, they just want your money

 

Just as an example, another member fitted a anti-glare H7r HID kit to a MK3 Octavia with reflector style headlights and the result was terrible.

 

The shape of the beam looks about right although as it has saturated the camera it's hard to see where the hotspot etc actually is. However, it's the area I've marked out in red here that worries me.

 

That is caused by light that isn't being controlled by the headlight and is causing glare. I can't see any trace of the same pattern from the halogen even with the brightness/contrast turned up.

[Wheelie1]

langers2k... thank you very much. That is exactly what I expected to hear. I know this subject was 'done to death' a long time ago & I understand exactly what you say (pics speak for themselves). You said the sellers are not bothered, they just want your money!

I'm a little deflated though, as I thought someone had finally 'invented' a solution to HID's in reflectors

Never mind...i'll just have to go down the sensible route then, night breakers or similar. As an aside, the lights on my Enry are not too bad, just yellow.

Mally.

[137699]

Even in projector lenses, HIDs still are not legal.

 

Unless the projector is specifically designed for HID use, has self levelling and has an adequate washing system, it's not legal.

 

And that means in the event of an accident you may well find your insurers don't cover you - that exact thing happened to someone I know who had to sell his house to personally foot the £300,000+ bill for the "life changing injuries" to the guy in the other car he collided with,,,,

[Ootohere]

Were the lights deemed to be the contributing  factor for the accident.?

& did the Insurance company pay out the 3rd party claims then sue your friend to recover the money?

 

Washers and self levelling must operate when they were OEM fitment, as to the other point on retro fitted HID's we know how many have this and pass MOT after MOT since members come on here that have that set up.

[weasley]

Last time I read into it, it was "the Department for Transport's opinion" that HID lamps were not legal if used in housing not designed for them.  The letter of the law was not explicit though.  Furthermore, there is no specific requirement for headlight washers - I drove a Mitsubishi Lancer Evo VIII for a few months that had factory-fitted HIDs but no headlight washers.

 

That said, I hate the badly retro-fitted HIDs that you see around so agree that if you do it, do it properly.  The reason I looked into it in such depth was when looking into options to upgrade the pathetic headlight on my motorbike.

 

There's a good summary of it all here.

[weasley]

Have a poke around here: https://www.retrofitlab.com/

 

They do the retrofit kits I referred to - essentially you split the headlight open (sounds dramatic but is relatively straightforward), remove the H4 bulb, replace it with a projector housing designed to fit where the H4 bulb went, then reassemble the headlight.  I keep meaning to do this to my bike, but haven't got around to it yet.  You then end up with a projector unit designed to house an HID lamp - the reflector part of your headlight becomes nothing more than decorative.

[langers2k]

7 minutes ago, weasley said:

They do the retrofit kits I referred to - essentially you split the headlight open (sounds dramatic but is relatively straightforward), remove the H4 bulb, replace it with a projector housing designed to fit where the H4 bulb went, then reassemble the headlight.  I keep meaning to do this to my bike, but haven't got around to it yet.  You then end up with a projector unit designed to house an HID lamp - the reflector part of your headlight becomes nothing more than decorative.

 

A proper D style HID bulb in a correctly designed projector will be a significant step up from halogen or drop in HID kits, but it's only part of a fully road legal solution.

 

To meet the EU regs the entire headlight needs to be type approved, not just the projector and HID bulb. Therefore, if you were to fit a HID projector to replace a halogen reflector, you would need to submit the headlight for type approval.

 

The easiest way to a full road legal HID system, is to source proper Yeti HID headlights, the appropriate level sensors/range module and headlight washers if not already fitted.

 

I did this to my Octavia and the parts came to about £650. This was for both headlights, new D1S bulbs, front/rear level sensors, AFS module and wiring as I already had headlight washers. It's certainly not a hard retrofit, it's just down to how cheaply you can find headlights

[weasley]

Quite right - if you get pulled by a well-trained VOSA inspector you could fall foul of that.

 

In The Road Vehicle Lighting Regulations it says:

 

Quote

Filament lamps

14.—(1) Where a motor vehicle first used on or after 1st April 1986 or any trailer manufactured on or after 1st October 1985 is equipped with any lamp of a type that is required by any Schedule to these Regulations to be marked with an approval mark, no filament lamp other than a filament lamp referred to in the Designation of Approval Marks Regulations in–

(a)regulation 4 and Schedule 2, items 2 or 2A, 8, 20, 37 or 37A; or

(b)regulation 5 and Schedule 4, item 18,

shall be fitted to any such lamp.

 

Which essentially says, if your type-approved light uses a filament lamp, then you must use the right filament lamp.  So fitting a HID lamp into an H4 headlight is a no-no.  But then so is fitting an LED lamp into a rear light cluster or indicator that was supplied with filament lamps.

 

My approach to this is to do your best to do things well, making sure that whatever you do is not anti-social nor diminishes the effect of the light.  I have fitted DRLs to my motorbike which is not strictly allowed in any regulation, but it makes me more visible and they are not dazzling bright (plus it passes the MOT with them).  As I said I am mulling the use of a retrofit projector unit, having ruled out a simple H4 plug-and-play replacement unit because of the dazzle and poor beam pattern (brighter does not always mean better vision).  Same goes for those LED H4 replacements - no thanks.  If your lighting is effective and well-contained then the likelihood of being pulled over for a chat is reduced anyway.

[CFB]

There are two types of HID kit that can be fitted to a H4 headlamp.

The chavs usually fit the cheap, non shielded version, which does cause glare and the undefined beam pattern in the pic way back at the top of the thread. Illegal and dangerous. 

The reason is that a H4 filament bulb has a shielding cap moulded into the glass at the tip. Therefore, all the light is reflected back onto the reflector, thus providing an accurate beam.

The chavvy HIDs do not have the cap, so light can project forward as well as onto the reflector, hence the glare.

The other type uses exactly the same burner but has a shield covering the end of the burner and also the top, when fitted into the headlight. The shield has cutouts on the bottom side, which provides an accurate beam for dip and high beam.

 

I have the shielded kit fitted to my bike and the beam pattern on dip and main beam is identical to the halogen OE bulb.

 

Left is a conventional H4 bulb    Right is a HID H4 with shield.

 

Edited 14 August, 2017 by CFB