4 minutes ago, Offski said:

Re Highway code,   best read that and see now the wording & if the 11.00pm - 7.00am  is Built up areas, areas with street lights and not a ban on using a horn out in the countryside or where there is the NSL between 11.00pm -7.00am.

Quite  - and I think you just "shot" Wino  (and maybe yourself!) in the foot!

No idea what you mean, has anyone ever said anything against sensible use of a horn, just maybe someone with special needs usage, special horns for special people, like special lights for those in a different road from other road users.

5 minutes ago, Wino said:

OK, I won't. You sound tired enough already.

Not that tired as yet - but just don't "push it"  in future.

I must go out and check tomorrow if my horn works.

I don't think that I can remember the last time I needed to use one.

 

I was trained that if you used the horn:-

a ) you had failed to observe and anticipate another road (and pavement) users actions

b ) if you had sufficient time to operate the horn, you had sufficient time to carry out an alternative, safer, manoeuvre .

 

Use of the horn was regarded as the refuge of the incompetent or unalert. (not sure if that is a word, but you know what I mean)

If you're still curious about the MOT fail criterion, you can look up the 'reason for rejection' via the number on the fail certificate (find online via here if you don't have the paper copy any more). The full MOT testers manual is publicly available here (there's a new one due for 20th May onward). The fail number for your horn will begin with the relevant section number, in this case 1.6: then the reason for rejection number is tacked onto this from the right hand column of the table (presumably one of 2.c, 2.d, or 2.e).

2e 'harsh or grating' seems particularly subjective, and doesn't seem to feature in the new 20/05/2018> version (see section 7.7 here). Edit: Oops, yes it is, it's in the third sentence.

 

Below is the current list which your test would have been referenced to:
 

 

2. The horn: 　 a. inoperative 　 b. is not loud enough to be heard by another road user 　 c. is a gong, bell or siren 　 d. has more than one tone Note: When operated, a two or more tone horn automatically produces a sound which alternates at regular intervals between fixed notes. e. fitted to a vehicle first used on or after 1 August 1973, emits a sound which is: 　  not a continuous or uniform note 　  harsh or grating.

Edited 2 May, 20188 yr by Wino

Many buses and trucks come with air horns, I wonder if the wording is different for them. 

I'd ask where in the MOT test manual does it state he can fail your car for the horn being too loud.

 

Section 1.6 relates to the horn.

 

https://www.mot-testing.service.gov.uk/documents/manuals/m4s01000601.htm

14 hours ago, Ju1ian1001 said:

Must check the manual tomorrow, been an MOT tester for 15 years, and never failed air horns for being too loud, didn't think it was a reason for rejection (DVSA's term for fail)

 

For me the louder the better, as then you will hear them, and we all know the vehicle's horn must not be used between the hours of 11.00pm and 7.00am so should not make a difference

So I have checked the MOT testing manual and was right, you can 't fail the horn for being too loud, the only thing is I'm at work and can't add a link to the page as it's on a different computer that blocks all other websites apart from the DVSA testing website.

 

In London the hours are 11.00pm to 7.00am.

 

Edit: I see Rustynuts has already linked it.

Edited 29 April, 20188 yr by Ju1ian1001

Simples, the Highway code and The Law might be full of contradictions but Anti-Social behaviour is what it is.

If a pedestrian or cyclists can not hear a normal sounded horn why should others around them need to have a louder sound being sounded?

http://drivingtesttips.biz/car-horn-law.html 

 

Cant find London being different and 11.00pm -7.00am, and not 11.30-7.00am as in the Highway Code, 

maybe it is a Local Bylaw thing...

 

 

 

Edited 29 April, 20188 yr by Offski

The MOT tester knew full well he wasn't able to fail your horn for a legitimate reason.

 

He just made up some random reason knowing he was doing the rest of mankind a favour 

What about the painfully loud and discordant ' music ' on many cars' sound systems ?

 

40 minutes ago, punyXpress said:

What about the painfully loud and discordant ' music ' on many cars' sound systems ?

"Unfortunately" for most of us, those "systems" ("drainpipes" might be a better description!) are not subject to the MoT test regime - BUT WHY SHOULD THEY NOT BE because they are "distracting" to most of the rest of us, AND potentially dangerous to the occupants of the vehicles in which they are installed who can't then hear virtually anything coming from anywhere else?

AND, thus they prevent those occupants from hearing any "normal" vehicle horns - that's another reason for having a "more effective" system in cars like mine

 

Edited 29 April, 20188 yr by jeallen01

I can't remember the last time I actually used the horn in a car. 

If you are finding yourself needing it often enough, that you felt the need to upgrade it, perhaps it's time to make a note of the events that cause you to need it and then review these.  You might be putting yourself in a position that surprises other road users more often than your realise.

BTW - Those teenagers, staring at mobile phones and crossing side roads without looking.  This is risky behavior but they do have the right of way.  If they step out - you need to stop for them, not blast them with the horn.

 

Drivers in cities like New York, Cairo and Delhi seem to use the horn a lot.  Fat lot of good it does them too.

I use my horn regularly due to having lots of canal bridges from the Lancaster canal in the area, unfortunately I also live in God's waiting room for the aged and hard of hearing who seem to think "proceed with caution" does not apply to them, (I don't think Honda Jazzes have horns or cancelling indicators either). My Skoda horns have tended to be ignored, or unheard, by this section of the population whereas the VERY LOUD air horns on my Mk1 Escort seem to register!

25 minutes ago, P6bJOHN said:

I use my horn regularly due to having lots of canal bridges from the Lancaster canal in the area, unfortunately I also live in God's waiting room for the aged and hard of hearing who seem to think "proceed with caution" does not apply to them, (I don't think Honda Jazzes have horns or cancelling indicators either). My Skoda horns have tended to be ignored, or unheard, by this section of the population whereas the VERY LOUD air horns on my Mk1 Escort seem to register!

I'm totally with you on all of that - and the same is true with the " young idiots" who seem to think  that THEIR safety is someone else's problem when they walk out in front of "US" whilst "on their phones"!.

 

Therefore, I can't really accept that we should just slow down/stop when we see someone "on his/her" phone walking out in front of  "US" without doing anything else - like blowing a LOUD horn! In such circumstances, what I/we are doing is making the "subject" aware that he/she is doing a VERY stupid thing, and HOPE (probably without any real "HOPE" of success!) that he/she might JUST think about NOT doing something similar AGAIN!

 

PS: WHAT would the "Nah-sayers" on this thread ACTUALLY DO, IF some complete "numbskull" does what I described above?? Be HONEST now ! (I suspect that you/they will automatically hit the horn!).

Edited 30 April, 20188 yr by jeallen01

Nah, that's Darwinism in operation. You can't treat stupid.

11 minutes ago, P6bJOHN said:

Nah, that's Darwinism in operation. You can't treat stupid.

I think you missed a couple of edits that I made to that post - and so I totally agree with the above (= "You can't treat stupid"!). HOPEFULLY, YOU/I won't hit anyone - whilst the "nay-sayers" might just do that "in extremis" if they persist in their view about the need not to use a loud horn!

 

PS: only time I ever hit a pedestrian was when a  Canadian tourist walked out in front of me near the London Zoo because he looked right (as it would be in Canada!) when he should have looked left (as he should have in the UK)!

What was the actual fail code? I showed you how to find it a few posts back.

3 hours ago, jeallen01 said:

PS: WHAT would the "Nah-sayers" on this thread ACTUALLY DO, IF some complete "numbskull" does what I described above?? Be HONEST now ! (I suspect that you/they will automatically hit the horn!).

 

Brake?? (You know, it's the middle pedal near your feet about 3 ft. below the horn button.)

Steer?? (You know, it's the big round wheel around the horn button)

Change down a gear or 2??

Drive on??

 

BTW, i ASSUME that your ATTITUDE to driving is the same as your ATTITUDE to forum posting, in that you need to SHOUT at frequent intervals, except that, instead of the KEYBOARD, whilst in the CAR  you try to achieve the same EFFECT by using THE HORN.

2 hours ago, BJM said:

 

Brake?? (You know, it's the middle pedal near your feet about 3 ft. below the horn button.)

Steer?? (You know, it's the big round wheel around the horn button)

Change down a gear or 2??

Drive on??

 

BTW, i ASSUME that your ATTITUDE to driving is the same as your ATTITUDE to forum posting, in that you need to SHOUT at frequent intervals, except that, instead of the KEYBOARD, whilst in the CAR  you try to achieve the same EFFECT by using THE HORN.

 

Im going to "report" this "POST"  for insufficient use of "inverted commas"

@P6bJOHN - My Mum has a Honda Jazz, which I am insured to drive. My feeling is that it has "typical Japanese hyperactive self-cancelling" on the indicators (turns them off as soon as you breath on the wheel to reduce lock).

2 hours ago, KenONeill said:

@P6bJOHN - My Mum has a Honda Jazz, which I am insured to drive. My feeling is that it has "typical Japanese hyperactive self-cancelling" on the indicators (turns them off as soon as you breath on the wheel to reduce lock).

 

Try hanging your handbag on it....

(Or knitting bag, or the small dog that is sat on your lap's lead, or just bend it.)

Not every geriatric around here drives a Jazz though, the Rover 45 is still popular, as is the Picanto, i10 etc. Cars with no soul for those who have given up on driving.

^^^ All of those have the Cloak of Invisibility and can go round sharp bends / corners rather well.

If you are inclined then fit air horns and mess with peoples minds.

 

 

Edited 1 May, 20188 yr by Offski

I have VERY loud twin air horns on my other car - a tiny Citroen C1 that other drivers seem to try and ignore UNTIL they hear the air horns when I often see they visibly jump

 

Never had any problem passing the MOT.

On ‎30‎/‎04‎/‎2018 at 21:43, Wino said:

What was the actual fail code? I showed you how to find it a few posts back.

 

@jeallen01 If you're struggling with this, PM me your reg number and I'll look it up for you.