Swapping 1.6TDI Engine with 2.0 VRS TDI engine

[eddiejonesus]

Hi guys I’m new here so nice to read all yo fun posts.....

I want to swap my MK3 1.6TDI engine with the 2.0 TDI from a VRS. Basically I want to transform my ordinary Octavia into a fully fledged VRS with all the performance replicated. Has anyone done this.? I cannot find this as a topic on the entire web!! I need to know how complicated this is, what else needs changing mechanically etc.

GUYS THIS IS MY CHALLENGE to this forum..... Given the range of VAG engines available, I cannot believe how infrequently such swaps are being discussed or attempted.... maybe I’m missing something? I can source all parts from Germany no problem but got no idea how much work needs doing. Thanks all

[Ootohere]

Welcome.

Just sell your car and buy a vRS they are not that expensive compared to buying the parts to turn your car into a vRS,

then you will have the brakes, suspension & interior and not just the bigger capacity /performance engine.

 

Why would you source parts from Germany to do the upgrade if you are going to, 

just get them from Breakers in the UK, or buy a complete accident damaged vRS.

Edited 27 May, 2018 by Offski

[eddiejonesus]

Thanks for the advice Offski, 

basically my initial instinct was that the entry level Octavia is near identical to the VRS in all but engine & performance parts like suspension/ breaks. My brother can change everything else for free except the engine swap so I was wondering how easy ( plug and play) this could be. I wouldn’t bother much with the interior as I’ve got the top spec toys already and upgraded sound system. I kinda wanna build a sleeper rocket with few hints of modification.......

I get your point about buying parts from uk salvage and will also keep checking salvage damaged cars. Still intrigued as to why I can’t find much evidence of fellow VAG lovers swapping these engines given the identical chassis and engine bay space / mounting ease?!!  Maybe I’m deluded....I used to drive Audi’s only till I discovered that Skoda were no longer made from cake and my Audi S3 got slayed by a tuned Fabia from Poland........ 

[Ootohere]

Sounds to me like your instinct is wrong on the entry level Octavia if that is what you have and the vRS Brakes and Suspension.

 

Look at the Project Builds on in Briskoda where Yeti, Fabia & Octavia owners have tuned 1.6 TSI's, bigger turbos / intercoolers, exhaust changes etc. 

[Defenderben]

In the old days, it was very easy to rip out a 1300cc ford engine from your Capri and stick the 1600cc engine in and swap brakes but these days the complexity of ECU's and various sensors it is probably not economic to undertake such a task.

 

The other issues are possibly type approvals and maybe MOT's etc - not sure about the UK but in Spain it is extremely difficult to venture outside of the approval list. Even having an unapproved tyre/wheel combination is an ITV (mot) failure.

 

As said above just sell your 1.6 and buy a 2.0ltr.

[eddiejonesus]

Cheers guys for the brilliant advice..... i can see why few attempt what I imagined to be easy.... I already had to change a few sensors in the stock Octavia and the cost is astonishing once out of warranty.  sounds like I’ll have to settle for boosting current performance and maybe some cosmetic upgrades...... or sell my 1.6 and save up a bit more to buy the 2 litre machine.

 

can you recommend any tuning shops/ kit for a 1.6Tdi DSG? I’m in Essex but I travel a lot if it’s worth the results. I might even drive to Cologne where I know a mad genius with VAG stuff . I won’t bother with protecting warranty as it’s pants anyway with almost nothing covered after 5 years. I’ll try squeezing every ounce out of this engine.

 

thanks again gentlemen for all your wise words....

[SashaGrace]

If you were to do it, you’d need the engine, a gearbox to match, the front brakes are larger and the rear subframe is different as the vRS has independent rear suspension over the standard cars torsion beam. Tbh you can get good gains from the 1.6 TDi. I’ve seen people running 200 bhp from them. vRS TDi is 181 standard and is honestly not a fast car. I love mine, but I would call it swift, not fast.

[eddiejonesus]

Cheers SashaGrace,

its good to hear of yo actual experience Running the VRS. 

[eddiejonesus]

 

Cheers SashaGrace,

Sorry I pressed send prematurely by mistake! do you actually get decent mpg with it driving a bit ‘brisk’’. I do about 70 miles daily on motorways mostly. If you only rate yo VRS as swift then I defo don’t wanna do lots of work to get to that level. What do u like most on your car? I sense you probably can take it to next level performance but u maybe choose not to?

do you have any idea what kinda tuning went into those 200bhp 1.6TDI engines? Any tips / info  blogs would be handy

thanks a lot

[KevC_Derby]

The Projects section would be a good place to start.

 

https://www.briskoda.net/forums/forum/207-octavia-projects/

 

And I was going to suggest Performance Upgrades but see your thread was moved from there.

 

https://www.briskoda.net/forums/forum/212-performance-upgrades/

 

 

 

[eddiejonesus]

Hey Kev, 

thanks for the links, I’m checking them out now. Let me know if yo aware of any shops or whoever can do upgrades maddest!

[SashaGrace]

1 hour ago, eddiejonesus said:

 

Cheers SashaGrace,

Sorry I pressed send prematurely by mistake! do you actually get decent mpg with it driving a bit ‘brisk’’. I do about 70 miles daily on motorways mostly. If you only rate yo VRS as swift then I defo don’t wanna do lots of work to get to that level. What do u like most on your car? I sense you probably can take it to next level performance but u maybe choose not to?

do you have any idea what kinda tuning went into those 200bhp 1.6TDI engines? Any tips / info  blogs would be handy

thanks a lot

I do anywhere between 100-300 miles a day in mine and it’s a lovely car, really nice to drive and surprisingly comfy. MPG hovers around the 55 mark doing that, averages about 51 and I’ve had it as high as 66 measured. My favourite thing about the car is either the DSG gearbox or the fact that Cheshire Police traffic division own an almost identical one with a very similar registration so every morning commuting through Flintshire and Cheshire into Wrexham people jump out of the way when they see it coming  You can get big gains from the 2.0 TDi as well, but if that’s where you’re going, it’s far less hassle to buy a 2.0 and be start from there. For me, having owned 1000cc motorbikes and modified cars in the past as well as having a Mercedes CLK55 AMG as a second car, I perhaps don’t see the vRS for what it is. It’s a cooking car to me tbh, I only chose it for the DSG box, mine was the only vRS on my list of cars to buy haha. It’s quick for a 2.0 diesel though, but the DSG box takes the edge off that slightly. The 30-70 sprint using the paddles to change is impressive, and I’ve fended off advances from similarly powered BMW diesels, which is always nice  Have a browse around the projects sections and look at tuners like Darkside for inspiration

Edited 27 May, 2018 by SashaGrace

[juan27]

Wasn't there a non VRS model  with the VRS diesel in it? That would be a good place to start for a "sleeper" surely. 

 

Another thing to consider is insurance. If you put a 2.0 in a 1.6 or mod the 1.6 you will probably pay a lot more than for a standard 2.0.

 

I had a Felicia with a Polo 16v in it and insurance more than doubled over a std model.

[SashaGrace]

The 2.0 TDi 150 uses ultimately the same engine as the diesel vRS, but the vRS isn’t really a shouty out car in the more ordinary colours and now Race Blue is offered across the range you really have to go for a loud vRS specific colour to make it stand out. An anonymous grey one like mine doesn’t overtly stand out, so the answer is to drive it like an Audi driver (Ex Audi driver right here, no I didn’t drive it like a spanner I promise!). I don’t always overtake ‘lesser’ Octavias, but when I do I have to get a good look at the driver to see them weep as my superior car blasts past, it’s the only way to do it  

[ChoonDoode]

33 minutes ago, juan27 said:

Wasn't there a non VRS model  with the VRS diesel in it? That would be a good place to start for a "sleeper" surely. 

 

Another thing to consider is insurance. If you put a 2.0 in a 1.6 or mod the 1.6 you will probably pay a lot more than for a standard 2.0.

 

I had a Felicia with a Polo 16v in it and insurance more than doubled over a std model.

 

hear hear

 

some insurance companies do take great pleasure in ramping their premiums up for modified cars.

 

Even things like bigger brakes get questioned as to why you feel the need for them.

 

Stuff like lowering springs and alloys (even sometimes exhaust systems) get seen as an inevitable mod on certain cars, but they're usually your 'boy racer' type cars and attract an immediate higher premium anyway.

 

Don't know if you watch fast n' loud, but (and I can't remember which car it was) they threw a relatively new engine into an old yank tank and it caused nothing but trouble. Not as severe in this case, but it can still be seen by the ecu and other monitoring bits as a square peg in the round hole.

[eddiejonesus]

 Funny how drivers instinctively suspect Your VRS for a police motor! I work with young offenders and generally they tell me if they see a police VRS or BMW they don’t bother speeding off even when they’re trying to “borrow” some powerful German machines. 

I’ll defo start by upgrading my 1.6, sounds like more fun than getting a standard 2 litre. I’ll grin and bare the insurance premiums which are robbery at the best of times but thanks all for great tips

[Ootohere]

Your issue is your DSG.

A DQ200 DSG.   

 Have you even needed the Service Campaign '34H5' that some 2023-2015 require, a Software Update?    Best check if your car needs this.

 

The DQ200 in a Petrol like a 1.4 TSI / TFSI Twincharger that is supposed to be limited to use in a 250 Nm engine does OK at around 320 Nm with a Engine mapped to around 220ps IME.

[eddiejonesus]

Is the DSG In a TDI identical to the TSI/ TFSI? Mine is a TDI. I will find out if I need the software update too. Would u advise an upgrade of the DSG if figures are a bit tight on the limits? Don't want it failing and causing further damage. Thanks a great deal for all yo wise words again. I'll share all knowledge as I get it from far and wide. 

[Ootohere]

Looks identical,  it is a DQ200,  same code number, but

different software,  there are 48 various applications the DQ200 7 speed Twin Dry Clutch DSG is used for.  Models / engines / bhp-ps.

 

ŠKODA AUTO produces two-millionth DQ 200 dual-clutch transmission at Vrchlabí plant - ŠKODA Storyboard.mhtml

ŠKODA produces 1.5 millionth DQ 200 dual-clutch transmission at Vrchlabí plant - ŠKODA Storyboard.mhtml

[eddiejonesus]

Is the DSG In a TDI identical to the TSI/ TFSI? Mine is a TDI. I will find out if I need the software update too. Would u advise an upgrade of the DSG if figures are a bit tight on the limits? Don't want it blowing up if I can just change it

[eddiejonesus]

Fabulous, I'll make sure I'm accurate with the 320Nm limit. I suspect it's hard to measure or predict how much more Nm an upgrade/ kit  can produce so I guess you suggest I upgrade the gearbox too? 

[Ootohere]

You are talking apples and pears with a diesel and a petrol.

You might need to get upgraded clutch packs.

 

Whatever you do is going to cost money, why not just buy a more powerful car and then modify that....

 

Has your Octavia had the VW Fix,

so new engine management and the flow device in the intake, or are you keeping the car well away from them touching it?

[logiclee]

You could spend thousands upgrading the 1.6's engine, gearbox, suspension and brakes.

 

Then it will cost you more to insure a modified car and any reliability issues.

 

And then your resale vale will plummet as the market for a modded Octavia is tiny.

 

if you are not going to be happy with a simple remap then just part exchange it for a VRS. It will cost less money in the long run and you will have  a reliable car with more performance and better resale.

 

Lee

[skidpan]

Done more than a few engine swaps in the past and they were simple. First was an Anglia 1000, fitted a 1500 from a Cortina, took a day. Simply remove engine and fit new one, connect auxiliaries, turn key and drive.

 

Last one I did was to replace a Ford x-flow with a 2 litre Zetec. Needed lots of special parts but once fitted to the engine starting Saturday morning the x-flow was out and the Zetec bolted in before mid afternoon. Fueling and ignition were simple, junk Fords injection/ignition and fit the Webers off the x-flow together with a Weber ignition ECU with a special Zetec loom. All that was fitted by Sunday morning and the engine started first turn of the key, bloody loud though, no exhaust.

 

Then my knee went, hospital and physio visits, diagnosed as osteoarthritis.

 

Once the exhaust manifold was eventually made (engine cost me £100, manifold £500!!!!) the car was back on the road. About 170 bhp.

 

Well worth the effort, not worth the pain though.

[eddiejonesus]

18 minutes ago, Offski said:

You are talking apples and pears with a diesel and a petrol.

You might need to get upgraded clutch packs.

 

Whatever you do is going to cost money, why not just buy a more powerful car and then modify that....

 

Has your Octavia had the VW Fix,

so new engine management and the flow device in the intake, or are you keeping the car well away from them touching it?

Keeping the car well away from dealers mate!! I'm defo looking at all my options including buying a 2.0TDI or part X for a VRS. I've always been lazy buying expensive stock like Audi S3 so I wanted to try other means at cheaper cost.... it's proving tricky to negotiate for sure. Do u have any idea how much more power a simple remap can give?