The EU is putting the heat on energy policy and German car manufacturing -

https://electrek.co/2018/12/18/eu-deal-cut-emission-new-cars-boost-electric-cars/

 

Time for serious work on clean electricity production.

If you have a few million or even billions to invest you might as well spread it about.  As the smart people are doing. 

Investing in Coal is what the banks have done with Pension Funds etc.

 

 

 

 

On 18/12/2018 at 12:10, teescom09 said:

Trouble is we need 100's more, they have little impact on power requirements, usually used as load lugger when the mains frequency shows signs of strain. 

 

We would not need a hundred more Dinowigs as it is 2 GWs and the whole generation of the UK is only about 60 GWs.

 

http://gridwatch.co.uk/ 

 

Another one or two would be nice and these stations are only to iron out daily fluctuations and not weekly or seasonal.

 

Having lots more wind turbines, off shore preferably, tidal as well combined with Nuclear and several GWhs of storage in our homes replacing our "radiators" in our houses so we also kick out the oil and gas "boilers" in our homes would properly get down the fossil fuel burning for both home and transport use.

  

VW ID still a way off.....

 

 

Are they still building E-Golf & E-UP! currently and selling those in Europe?

The molten salt and delayed distribution system is go, it seems -

https://9to5google.com/2018/12/19/x-graduates-malta-energy-non-alphabet/. 

 

Victoria has a reflector array which, I assume, powers a steam driven generator so maybe a salt conversion is possible.

Edited 20 December, 20187 yr by Ryeman

14 hours ago, Skoffski said:

Are they still building E-Golf & E-UP! currently and selling those in Europe?

 

Expect they will until the ID come along but maybe with an improved battery pack like Renault did with the Zoe where the pack nearly doubled in capacity but had the same shape and only slightly more weight.

6 hours ago, Ryeman said:

The molten salt and delayed distribution system is go, it seems -

https://9to5google.com/2018/12/19/x-graduates-malta-energy-non-alphabet/. 

 

Victoria has a reflector array which, I assume, powers a steam driven generator so maybe a salt conversion is possible.

 

small compared to the Moroccan 2GW project which will sell large amounts of power to Europe via the new continental interconnector.

Edited 20 December, 20187 yr by lol-lol

1 minute ago, lol-lol said:

 

small compared to the Moroccan 2GW project which will sell large amounts of power to Europe via the new continental interconnector.

I’ve always understood that over long distances resistance(?) cause a significant loss, but that doesn’t seem to be an issue with some proposals.

What gives?.

@lol-lol  Battery and hardwear improvement and availability is pretty much the issue for VW as with all the others.

http://cars.com/recalls/volkswagen-e_golf

 

Then this.

http://www.motoringresearch.com/car-news/cancer-causing-metal-volkswagen-cars

 

 

VW & Balls up and promotions is a recurring feature.  Maybe cancer as well.  This ad might come back to bite them in their balls.

*Please see your GP, or maybe your GP and then your No win no fee law firm.*

 

 

 

 

 

Edited 20 December, 20187 yr by Skoffski

Just now, Ryeman said:

I’ve always understood that over long distances resistance(?) cause a significant loss, but that doesn’t seem to be an issue with some proposals.

What gives?.

just use higher voltages to reduce losses is several hundred thousand volts.  Power has to travel a bit across Morocco but the distance across the entrance of the Med is only a few miles as Cannabis smugglers know then you are in to the Spanish high voltage network!

37 minutes ago, lol-lol said:

just use higher voltages to reduce losses is several hundred thousand volts.  Power has to travel a bit across Morocco but the distance across the entrance of the Med is only a few miles as Cannabis smugglers know then you are in to the Spanish high voltage network!

So if an ICE is typically has only 30% thermal efficiency, what % voltage loss is there for, say, 1000kms?

 

1 hour ago, Ryeman said:

So if an ICE is typically has only 30% thermal efficiency, what % voltage loss is there for, say, 1000kms?

 

 

Small if you go up to half a million volts and beyond.....  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_power_transmission#Losses 

 

Transmitting electricity at high voltage reduces the fraction of energy lost to resistance, which varies depending on the specific conductors, the current flowing, and the length of the transmission line.

For example, a 100 mi (160 km) span at 765 kV carrying 1000 MW of power can have losses of 1.1% to 0.5%. A 345 kV line carrying the same load across the same distance has losses of 4.2%.^[23]

... and UK long distance lines typically operate at 250kv or above.

^^^^^^ that’s encouraging seeing we have suggestions of massive solar arrays in particular transmitting around 1000kms and with 3000 odd potential pumped hydro sites it seems it mainly down to the conservatives accepting the need for action.

They are too busy hating each other so once again Labour will have to pick up the pieces.

Just now, Ryeman said:

once again Labour will have to pick up the pieces.

Assuming Corbyn can apologise for lying (allegedly!) about a stupid woman

27 minutes ago, PetrolDave said:

Assuming Corbyn can apologise for lying (allegedly!) about a stupid woman

Theresa May won't be happy being called STUPID by some old bloke who wants to be PM even more than bigot calling Gordon Brown.

1 hour ago, KenONeill said:

... and UK long distance lines typically operate at 250kv or above.

 

275 kV or 400 kV in the UK apparently.  

 

France acts as Europe's major over-producer.  I gather only Canada, Japan, Russia and USA use the 765kV or 1MV. 

 

https://www.rte-france.com/en/article/resolutely-committed-construction-robust-electricity-system-based-solidarity

4 hours ago, Ryeman said:

I’ve always understood that over long distances resistance(?) cause a significant loss, but that doesn’t seem to be an issue with some proposals.

What gives?.

No not really. To overcome that the output from the power stations is transformed up to 400.000 volts which results in very low currents, it's current that creates resistance, that's why the bulk of the Power Stations are in the Midlands and North, a) to pollute there instead of London and b) to give countrywide distribution. 

19 hours ago, lol-lol said:

 

We would not need a hundred more Dinowigs as it is 2 GWs and the whole generation of the UK is only about 60 GWs.

 

http://gridwatch.co.uk/ 

 

Another one or two would be nice and these stations are only to iron out daily fluctuations and not weekly or seasonal.

 

Having lots more wind turbines, off shore preferably, tidal as well combined with Nuclear and several GWhs of storage in our homes replacing our "radiators" in our houses so we also kick out the oil and gas "boilers" in our homes would properly get down the fossil fuel burning for both home and transport use.

  

VW ID still a way off.....

 

 

Nobody is going to replace gas, not for at least 100's of years and nobody is going to replace gas for heating. Coal will likely make a comeback if carbon capture is the answer for gas, it is for coal. The providing of enough electricity for 35 million cars is so pie in the sky but now you suggest heating homes with electricity, we would need power stations and infrastructure beyond all comprehension along with trillions of £s. The whole scenario is absolutely pathetic and embarrassing to discus. Maybe in 100's of years alternatives will be around or might not matter as will may have been nuked by then. It won't be ridiculous cables trailing around all over the place, that is a certainty! Oh we've got a reprieve, the south pole is in danger of expanding due to the exceptionally cold summer down there!!!! 

3 hours ago, teescom09 said:

now you suggest heating homes with electricity

Current kWh pricing would make that uneconomic for the vast majority of home owners.

 

Our present dual fuel tariff charges 4p/kWh for gas but 12p/kWh for electricity... so even taking into account the efficiency of a gas boiler converting from gas central heating to electric radiators is going to have higher running costs.

2 hours ago, PetrolDave said:

Current kWh pricing would make that uneconomic for the vast majority of home owners.

 

Our present dual fuel tariff charges 4p/kWh for gas but 12p/kWh for electricity... so even taking into account the efficiency of a gas boiler converting from gas central heating to electric radiators is going to have higher running costs.

 

you can get Economy 7 and even Economy 10, which charges about half that for the electricity in the cheap period with a higher rate of 15p kWh for the day time so if you use half your power during the nighttime charging one is quid in.

I have been back and fore to hospitals quite a bit over the last few weeks and i have seen the Electric Charging points occupied with the same vehicles from early in the day and throughout the day.

The charging at work thing seems to be getting taken advantage of if people just taking a parking place do the charging and never bother moving the car when charged 

or the charging takes all day.

54 minutes ago, lol-lol said:

 

you can get Economy 7 and even Economy 10, which charges about half that for the electricity in the cheap period with a higher rate of 15p kWh for the day time so if you use half your power during the nighttime charging one is quid in.

15% + increase in electricity charges is happening now while petrol is getting cheaper by the day   

 

The poky little batteries in leafs etc are 40 kw/h when new? Assuming at least 35 kw/h to charge it up less 15% inefficiency thats  40 x 15 p (about cheapest around today, just in the middle of a switch) = £6 a charge, or with economy 7 at least £3 if you can get it charged in 7 hours, short I reckon. But you will pay over the odds for the daytime main consumer electricity so its not really £3, be back towards the £6!  To go about 100+ miles in the real world if you dare. And don't forget your petrol tank will need changing in a few years at massive cost wiping out and more, any fuel savings!!!!  Batteries gradually deteriorating, so the 100 miles will become a thing of the past while you stress out driving around in the dark, freezing to death in the winter and roasting in the summer 

32 minutes ago, Skoffski said:

I have been back and fore to hospitals quite a bit over the last few weeks and i have seen the Electric Charging points occupied with the same vehicles from early in the day and throughout the day.

The charging at work thing seems to be getting taken advantage of if people just taking a parking place do the charging and never bother moving the car when charged 

or the charging takes all day.

Mostly empty around North east since the councils started charging a £1 per charge, tight arsed or what! They've got a shock coming when the fuel duty starts getting weighted onto them. 

Australia is seemingly covered in charging stations already -

https://myelectriccar.com.au/charge-stations-in-australia/

 

the appearance of the odd electric car might help too. Apart from the odd hybrid, mainly Toyota, I don’t think I’ve seen one on the road.

Kona and Niro are going to light the fuse I suspect.