Hi All!

 

Past two months I've been trying to troubleshoot the EPC Light with P0011 error code that comes on sporadically, and would greatly appreciate any generic advice on this issue as well as answers to the specific questions I have based on the research I've done so far. Details below (sorry for long explanations - I try to be thorough in case anything pop ups to you as a possible culprit). Thank you in advance!

 

My Car: Skoda Kodiaq 2019, 1.5 TSI DADA engine,  150 Hp, 50k km on odometer, front-wheel drive, DSG, 7-seater.

 

Issue description:

• Occasionally EPC light comes on and car goes into limp mode (with message that computer has reduced max throttle to 3000 rpms to prevent damage to the engine)
• When I use Carista reader coupled with Car Scanner app, I see 4 several error codes pop up, amongst which P0011 (Raw code: 0011, ECU: Engine control unit, Status: Pending, OBDII: Camshaft position (CMP), intake/left/front, bank 1 - timing over-advanced/system performance)
• The issue has pending/intermittent status, which I understand means that this is not an active issue at the time of scanning, but is triggered for some short moment once in a while, and because it has been triggered enough times now it is causing EPC light now to come on (correct me if this interpretation is wrong)
• Shutting down the engine and restarting the car removes the EPC light, and the car continues to drive normally (no limp mode)
• The issue appears at random intervals - sometimes could happen 2-3 times per day, sometimes once per week. I have tried paying very close attention to the conditions when it comes, but I could not pinpoint anything specific, other than it is happening much more frequently on a colder engine (just few minutes from starting and driving a few km up to oil temperatures reaching 60-70 degrees). I did not seem to observe the issue on a well warmed up engine. Also the issue came out in the winter time only (do not know if this makes any difference).
• When I clear the error code and rescan, the tool does not pick up this error again until again few days later an EPC light is triggered (at which times the error codes are visible again with status: intermittent or pending)
• Lately the problem seems to happen more frequently than earlier - i.e. at least twice every 2-3 days, while in the past it could not happen for a a week (but given its sporadic nature this is a perception)
• This comes at the same time with several other active error codes popping up (I don't know if they are related / triggered by the same root cause, or completely separate). I am describing them each in a different thread potentially to troubleshoot each one separately, and will include links here. In summary, the error codes I get are P0011 (camshaft over-advance timing), U1123 (Databus error value received for Adaptive Cruise Control), B108715 (left vent temperature sensor).
• Otherwise, the car seems to be driving normally, no rough idle, no other deteriorated performance noticed and if it's weren't for the EPC light coming up with limp mode, I would not have known about the problem.
• Oil change was done by Skoda Dealer in summer 2021, who for some reason put in VW 5W40 Special G oil (VW 502.00/505.00 which does not seem to be the recommended oil for this car). I replaced oil & filter myself in summer 2022 and put in Castrol Edge 5w30 LL (VW 504.00/507.00) which is "slightly" more OK for this car. Reason why I did not put in 0w20 (VW 508.00) is due to all the negative feedback I've read on various forums about how this oil may not protect the engine well etc (perhaps this was a mistake). The issue happened for the first time about 5 months (5k km) after change to 5w30 oil. Reason why I am mentioning this is that this could be a potential culprit. (see below the troubleshooting section)

 

What I've done so far to troubleshoot it:

• Went to local Skoda dealer to diagnose, who indicated that unless I have an active EPC light at the time I come they might not be able to find anything (with me ending up to pay a lot of money for the hours spent on diagnostics). As I cannot replicate the problem myself to make the EPC light come on at the time I can come to the dealership, it makes it difficult to use their services.
• Based on research that this could be caused by low oil pressure, I've topped up my oil from mid-mark (middle between low & max point) to just a bit shy of max point (that required roughly 0.5L addition) - did not help the problem
• My engine coolant was just barely below the low mark (with cold engine) and roughly in the mid-mark (with warm engine). I topped up engine coolant to mid-mark (cold engine). Likely this has absolutely nothing to do with the problem, but just wanted to rule this out.
• I've seen many videos & posts, like this one
  that P0011 problem could be caused by camshaft position sensor (either the magnet or the solenoid itself or both) getting contaminated due to bad oil / particles or sludge build up etc. Some people recommend simply doing an oil change to the factory recommended VW 508 oil, which might remove the problem. I have service coming due in a few month (with an emission test) and see if I can first clean the camshaft to ensure that if it's clogged and I simply change oil, the clog will not clear itself.
• I've taken off the intake camshaft magnet, noticed that the middle pin moved relatively slowly / had some resistance, hence I cleaned it with sensor cleaner. Post that the middle pin was moving freely & fully just by shaking the magnet in my hand.
• My intent was to take off also the solenoid and clean it, for which I bought a special VW tool with two pins to remove it. To my surprise instead I saw a 24mm normal nut there (see photos).
• I've put the magnet back and tried to see if smth stuck in the magnet was the culprit - it wasn't. After 1 day of normal driving, the issue popped again on the 2nd day.

 

Specific Questions I would like to ask for your help with:

• The fact that my solenoid has a 24mm bolt instead of a unique VW connector - is that an indicator that an aftermarket part is used? Or could this simply be a nut, behind which there is still the normal VW connector to take off the solenoid?
• Does anyone have instructions wrt how to take off such solenoid for cleaning? What force to use (if a torque wrench must be used), but also upon removing the nut, how to remove what appears to be some sort of wire lock nut behind it?
• Would you advise just changing oil to 0w20 and NOT cleaning the solenoid - could that alone fix the problem (i.e. perhaps 5w oil is too thick while it is cold and not properly flowing through the solenoid)? But strange why for a year running on VW 5w40 Special G I did not have this issue, while it did occur on 5W30.
• Do you have any other advise wrt how I can troubleshoot the problem?

 

Thank you very much for any help you can offer!

 

 

 

I shall try to help in a small way, please take a read here about anything to do with 1.5 EVO engine and being very careful with anything to do with the timing area, not saying you are in danger because you are touching this area, but you may upset a very accurately timed engine.

 

It's a Karoq, but shares same engine across models

 

 

Now onto the hopefully helpful part...

 

 

Here is the exploded parts diagram.

 

 

Here is the part in a nice image

 

 

Here is the part in the workshop manual for a 1.5 EVO "DADA" engine code

 

 

And the torque value is 140Nm from position 8

@varooom thanks a lot for your response and the detailed diagrams. If this is indeed such a delicate system, perhaps I should not be messing with it... Perhaps this is what I needed to hear

 

Wondering still if anyone had a similar problem and if there might be a simple solution - i.e. could a simple oil change just fix it (thus not requiring to bring it for an expensive diagnosis or service) ?

 

In the meantime, the issue happened again today right as I was looking at live chart in the OBD app, which allowed me to capture the exact moment on screen. As you can see, the actual camshaft adjustment value for intake bank 1 does not match the specified value for just a few seconds. This is the moment that triggers EPC light to come on. Then it goes back to normal and roughly follows the specified graph. Don't know if this is pointing anyone to what could be the possible root cause of such a temporary deviation.

 

 

You might be ok to remove that, but best await an expert on the subject matter to make sure it is safe to do so.  I was just making sure that you are fully aware of the danger of the area you are looking at.

Nice to see you was able to capture it in a live log, nothing worse than an intermittant fault.

 

Hopefully you can get this sorted, cannot be good keep dropping into limp mode.

Hi All,

 

Short update:

1) I've done the maintenance in the car and now put in VW Spec 509 00 oil (0W20)

2) Went to Skoda dealer for diagnosis. After half hour of "diagnosis" all they've done is just read the code from the car, and indicated that my camshaft adjuster for the intake camshaft should be replaced. When I questioned them on why, what is the logic that it is not just a faulty sensor, what is the logic of why I am getting this error not all the time but only on cold engine (if this was a defective camshaft adjuster) - they could not answer any of these questions. Basically they read the code, and their tool just tells them based on this code - replace the entire camshaft adjuster - a bill for me for 1000 Euros...

 

If there was any assurance that camshaft adjuster was indeed faulty - oh well, I would go for this repair. But I am not at all convinced (neither are they :)) Will try to get a 2nd opinion at another dealer.

 

My intent is to drive the car around now on new oil (have it for only 2 days since oil replacement), warm up the engine, let it out on the highway, switch to manual and rev up the engine a bit to let the oil pressure "unclog" the solenoid in the camshaft adjuster if it is indeed clogged. Does that make sense to you?

 

@varooom: on the picture of the exploded parts diagram that you shared earlier (the 1st one), would you be so kind to share it again but scroll up on the list on the right hand side, so that I can see descriptions & part numbers of other parts? I am guessing what they are suggesting to replace is part 13 on that diagram. Different question - in my engine I see there is some sort of corkwire plug surrounding the valve, I don't see that anywhere in the diagram. Any chance that the diagram is for a slightly different engine spec? I see you selected 2021 Kodiaq, I have a 2019 Kodiaq - likely does not matter, but just in case

1 hour ago, andriyvp said:

@varooom: on the picture of the exploded parts diagram that you shared earlier (the 1st one), would you be so kind to share it again but scroll up on the list on the right hand side, so that I can see descriptions & part numbers of other parts? I am guessing what they are suggesting to replace is part 13 on that diagram. Different question - in my engine I see there is some sort of corkwire plug surrounding the valve, I don't see that anywhere in the diagram. Any chance that the diagram is for a slightly different engine spec? I see you selected 2021 Kodiaq, I have a 2019 Kodiaq - likely does not matter, but just in case

Here is the rest of the parts in PDF

KOD 2019(K) 109-060.pdf

 

Perfect, thank you so much @varooom. Do you happen to also have repair/replacement instructions? I.e. what is the procedure of taking that whole unit apart? For example, if I want to only get to the control valve (to take it out for cleaning or replacement), do you have instructions of how to get to it? Thanks again in advance for all your help!

3 minutes ago, andriyvp said:

Perfect, thank you so much @varooom. Do you happen to also have repair/replacement instructions? I.e. what is the procedure of taking that whole unit apart? For example, if I want to only get to the control valve (to take it out for cleaning or replacement), do you have instructions of how to get to it? Thanks again in advance for all your help!

Take a look at the PDF on this page, see if the pages are relevant.

https://www.briskoda.net/forums/topic/510175-karoq-cam-belt-change-start-saving-now/?do=findComment&comment=5731407

 

@varooom this is helpful, but I think I need section that is on page 188 of that manual. Basically I want to only remove & clean the camshaft control valve (marked with number 3 on the below diagram), and if I understand correctly it is described in section 3.4.1 on page 188. Hard to judge if there are other sections also relevant as steps to be performed before you can remove control valve.

 

Link via PM to document on the web

 

For anyone else, search for this "D4B8078C002-1_5_110_kW_TSI_EVO_Engine" or just "D4B8078C002"

Edited 15 March, 20233 yr by varooom

Update:

- Went to several VAG-specialized garages locally. All gave me the same response - they have no clue, nor any way to diagnose. They would just start replacing components one by one until the problem is solved. So a bit of a blind trial & error, starting with cheapest one to replace

- As already stated, I changed oil & filter. Then I cleaned camshaft adjuster magnet/solenoid (again), and yesterday cleaned the camshaft adjuster oil control valve. Neither appeared visually to be clogged up, hence I didn't have much hope that this will solve the problem. Still I cannot rule out that they are not faulty (and if nothing else comes to mind I will start with replacing the magnet and the oil control valve to also rule them out completely)

- I did not clean the oil control valve that sits directly inside the camshaft adjuster. Based on my analysis, in order to do so, I would need to take off the timing belt cover and lock the camshaft or crankshaft in place to unscrew the oil control valve. I don't have the experience to do so, hence decided not to mess with this yet (although appears not that difficult to do).

- I've recorded a lot of live data to capture how camshaft adjuster works. Would like to compare it to other people's data to understand what is considered normal vs. faulty - maybe that would point to a more reasonable direction for troubleshooting. To keep the discussion clean, I started this in a separate thread: https://www.briskoda.net/forums/topic/511804-intake-camshaft-adjustment-correct-vs-faulty-p0011-problem/

 

as always, any advice or hint in which direction to look would be highly appreciated.

 

On 23/03/2023 at 17:04, andriyvp said:

Update:

...

Hi andriyvp,

have you found already solution of the problem?