Anyone think the new BMW 123d will take apart this new lap time?

Anyone think the new BMW 123d will take apart this new lap time?

Would that be classed as a supermini? I know it feels like one when you're sat inside, but I thought it was more "small family" class...

Rob.

Would that be classed as a supermini? I know it feels like one when you're sat inside, but I thought it was more "small family" class...

Rob.

Good point - mind you they can take 5 adults in adequate comfort living proof.

Possibly the best real world car BMW 123d.

Ph has anyone noticed a recent increase in the premiums/quotes for Fabia vRS's while the Polo GT TDI130 is vastly cheaper to insure.... ditto Seat Ibiza TDI130....

Stop crashing you lot.

Possibly the best real world car BMW 123d.

I guess that depends on what you mean by real world! The boot on the 1 series is woeful for my needs and I'd not like to sit in the back of one for any length of time, unless there was a short driver. 3 series would be much more practical....

Chris

I guess that depends on what you mean by real world! The boot on the 1 series is woeful for my needs and I'd not like to sit in the back of one for any length of time, unless there was a short driver. 3 series would be much more practical....

Chris

Depends on what your used to Im used to a Fiat coupe which swollows 3 sets of gol club bags and 2 trollys.

The biggest boot Ive ever had was the Cavalier - vast but really I hardly ever came close to filling so unnecessary space.

We did a 100mile trip - all passengers are >5'10. No complaints - I was up front though but did have a try in the rear and was surprised at how good it was + unlike a Mondy when I sit in the back my head doesnt touch the roof.

The 3 series you lose the practicality of a hatchback and its not that wide an opening.

3 Serious touring game on though.

So ultimately there's no such thing as the best real world car

Chris

Good point - mind you they can take 5 adults in adequate comfort living proof.

Possibly the best real world car BMW 123d.

Very odd real world you live in Welshy :P Whilst the 123d is a good car, its definitely not a car for 5 adults in any form of regular transport unless, as Chris says the driver and front seat passenger are midgets, and its boot is lousy (also useless for a family!). To me the 123d is a quality alternative to either:

a) small hatchback cars; or

a "warm" sports car.

So ultimately there's no such thing as the best real world car

Chris

Clearly every one has different needs but Id say that if you take the 330D M Sport your getting all the performance you really need, combined economy of 46mpg with m ways at over 60mpg reliability, proper 4 seater & for most people plenty of space.

Downside is the purchase price.

Downside is the purchase price.

And the fact it's a diesel.

Rob.

And the fact it's a diesel.

Rob.

Well 6.7 to 60

155mph limited

1600rpm @70mph

0-100 in 16-18 seconds IIRC

All that and combined 46mpg.

Mine is significantly quicker than those times but the flip side of the coin is just under 3000rpm @70mph (red line 7,250) Official combined 28mpg (however in my ownership I achieve 30 combined with 36-38 on a long run - however a long run in the 330d is well over 60mpg (going by the official figs.).

Well 6.7 to 60

155mph limited

1600rpm @70mph

0-100 in 16-18 seconds IIRC

All that and combined 46mpg.

:ne_nau: I don't care about numbers, it'll still drive like a diesel and I'd rather sacrifice some economy to have a car which doesn't drive like a diesel...

Rob.

Well 6.7 to 60

155mph limited

1600rpm @70mph

0-100 in 16-18 seconds IIRC

That's a lot slower than I was expecting. :( I'll have to carry on saving for the M3 then!

Chris

That's a lot slower than I was expecting. :( I'll have to carry on saving for the M3 then!

Chris

The 335d does the 0-100mph in 13.99 seconds (in touring form) IIRC 0-60 drops to 6 seconds dead.

An M3 will cost 2-2.5 times the cost of insuring a 330D will need refulling every 250miles much higher servicing costs.

In the real world once off the line in gear the M3 would lose out - unless of course your going to be breaking the legal speed limits. If you adhere to the legal speed limits of the UK then by the time the M3 lifts its skirts the 330D will be 3-4 car lengths ahead on the road and at the legal limit.

In the real world once off the line in gear the M3 would lose out

:rofl: I'm sorry but "in the real world" and "in gear" shouldn't be in the same sentence, in the real world you use whatever gear is most appropriate regardless of which car you're driving.

Given that an M3 can do the 0-62 sprint in 4.8 seconds, how are you arriving at the conclusion that the 330d (which takes nearly 2 seconds longer to reach the same speed) will be quicker?!

Rob.

:rofl: I'm sorry but "in the real world" and "in gear" shouldn't be in the same sentence, in the real world you use whatever gear is most appropriate regardless of which car you're driving.

Given that an M3 can do the 0-62 sprint in 4.8 seconds, how are you arriving at the conclusion that the 330d (which takes nearly 2 seconds longer to reach the same speed) will be quicker?!

Rob.

A 330D HAS 500NM of torque at 1,750rpm which in 6th gear is about 75mph, IIRC from idle it has a whopping 230lbf!!! so in a situation on a country road there is suddenly an opportunity to overtake you simply press the throttle in 6th - if however you were in ther M3 you'd need to change down 2 gears (wasting time in the process) and then floor it.

the difference of 2 seconds to 60 is not a "real world" situation - i.e. how many times do you really do full throttle gear changes from the lights? Once/twice in the cars ownership??

What you do do is lots of overtaking on A&B roads & accelerating down the slip roads - this requires very short time from noticing the gap to overtake and accelerating away.

Also if driving your M3 in that manner all the time your probably going to be getting 10-15mpg which would be about 160miles from a

OK OK yet another thread Welshy's managed to turn into a BMW spamming session. Can we get back on topic please?

Sorry not intentional, but someone mentioned that the vRS TDI by Jabba Luke would beat it but thats not like for like.

So its fair game.

A 330D HAS 500NM of torque at 1,750rpm which in 6th gear is about 75mph, IIRC from idle it has a whopping 230lbf!!! so in a situation on a country road there is suddenly an opportunity to overtake you simply press the throttle in 6th - if however you were in ther M3 you'd need to change down 2 gears (wasting time in the process) and then floor it.

the difference of 2 seconds to 60 is not a "real world" situation - i.e. how many times do you really do full throttle gear changes from the lights? Once/twice in the cars ownership??

What you do do is lots of overtaking on A&B roads & accelerating down the slip roads - this requires very short time from noticing the gap to overtake and accelerating away.

Also if driving your M3 in that manner all the time your probably going to be getting 10-15mpg which would be about 160miles from a

so in a situation on a country road there is suddenly an opportunity to overtake you simply press the throttle in 6th - if however you were in ther M3 you'd need to change down 2 gears (wasting time in the process) and then floor it.

I thought you were an advanced driver? Surely you'll be looking for the overtaking opportunity rather than waiting for one to "suddenly" present itself? Maybe a diesel is more suited to your style of driving

Chris

Now moved. Please use this thread for your thoughts on BMWs, the other one is about Corsas. Thanks.

I thought you were an advanced driver? Surely you'll be looking for the overtaking opportunity rather than waiting for one to "suddenly" present itself? Maybe a diesel is more suited to your style of driving

Chris

Im talking about driving on roads which you have never been on before - given that on roads you know clearly there are places you can & cannot overtake so in the situation where an overtaking opportunity presents itself then you can "Go go go".

TDi's have made the slow petrol driver a much faster driver.

I recall one article in Autocar by Chris Sutton he drives a 1980's Porche 911 Carrera anyway he was following a Honda Accord TD (current shape latest engine) and what he found was that in following him he could get really close in the corners but coming out of the corners the Honda would pull a good 5 car lengths and as he stated up to Uk speed limits there was zero chance of him passing it was only when the speed got above that level was he able to pass.

Also he did mention that after he spoke to his friend in the accord and as it turned out he wasnt driving it hard just "normal" driving in the TDI & this guy is not a fast driver.

Give everyone a 535d Touring and the world will be a much safer, more efficient and quicker place to live in.

Im talking about driving on roads which you have never been on before

So what you're ultimately saying is you rely on local knowledge rather than being able to read the road?! Have you considered some refresher training?

Chris

So what you're ultimately saying is you rely on local knowledge rather than being able to read the road?! Have you considered some refresher training?

Chris

the difference of 2 seconds to 60 is not a "real world" situation - i.e. how many times do you really do full throttle gear changes from the lights? Once/twice in the cars ownership??

Quite a lot - most of my journeys involve merging onto a slip road from a standing start, and full throttle is the quickest way to get up to speed. And if I was in an M3 and the guy next to me was in 330D, I'd reach the end of the sliproad first - or, to put it in another way, in the "real world" (and indeed in any other), it's a quicker car.

So even though the M3 is quicker in some instances the fact that he'd need nearly 3 tanks of fuel & probably 30 mins for those 3 refills means that the 330D beats him hands down - so in the real world M3 loses.

:rofl: So in the "real world" a Citreon C3 1.4HDI would be even quicker, as you'd need even fewer fuel stops. :rofl:

Rob.

Give everyone a 535d Touring and the world will be a much safer, more efficient and quicker place to live in.

Thats a rather naive thing to say, dont you think? How on earth can you make the connection between a 5 series BMW and safety and efficiency?

I dont have any figures to hand but I cant believe that you're any safer or more efficient (I assume you refer to MPG) in that than you'd be in a Renault Megane 1.9 TDCi, or a whole host of other cars.

Just because a car is big and diesel powered it doesnt mean its safe and efficient.

So in this ideal world of yours, where all cars are 535d tourings and everyone drives faster, how do you account for the inevitable rise in fatalities caused by much greater impact speeds in accidents? How can driving faster into a pedestrian, child or cyclist in a bigger car be any safer for them?

Quite a lot - most of my journeys involve merging onto a slip road from a standing start, and full throttle is the quickest way to get up to speed. And if I was in an M3 and the guy next to me was in 330D, I'd reach the end of the sliproad first - or, to put it in another way, in the "real world" (and indeed in any other), it's a quicker car.

Thats not always so though. My Octavia was very slow off the line compared to a WRX Impreza - but from a 30mph rolling start there was very little in it.

Comparing 0-60 times is not always an accurate representation of "real world" driving.