14 hours ago, Thefeliciahacker said:

It's prohibitive to use oil below 10W on Felicia.

Totally i have used 3 times 5W-40 in my Felicia, the 2 times i wasn't happy with the noise of the engine and the 3rd time wasn't happy with the oil pressure light staying on a little longer than normal.

So the 5W-40 is ''Finished'' for me.

21 minutes ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

Totally i have used 3 times 5W-40 in my Felicia, the 2 times i wasn't happy with the noise of the engine and the 3rd time wasn't happy with the oil pressure light staying on a little longer than normal.

So the 5W-40 is ''Finished'' for me.

Time to use 10W50 then

From Amsoil site.

There is a 10 'C difference between 40 and 50 grade.

In gr 43C summer is usual

Depending on how viscous the oil is and subject to it being suitable and applicable to your engine and use of engine a good oil in 10w-50, 15w-50 or 20w-50 would be suitable. You seem to have milder winters and hot summers where you are than where I am and for more old British cars I used 15w-50 or 20-50, yet with the same engine in the Midget (without oil cooler) the current owner uses 10w-40 and he knows about engines. Just use a good appropriate oil.

It's pdf is huge (13 pages) but crucial information are missing, that's not good for me.

https://www.ravenol.de/storage/app/uploads/share/SDB/Sdb_RAVENOL%20HVE%20High%20Viscosity%20Ester%20Oil%20SAE%2010W-50_1115101_en_ALL.pdf

Flash point 258 °C

Density 854 kg/m³ at 15 °C

Kinematic viscosity 129 mm²/s at 40 °C

I have to make a comparison with some other 10W-50 engine oils.

12 minutes ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

I have to make a comparison with some other 10W-50 engine oils.

please do

15 hours ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

Flash point 258 °C

Density 854 kg/m³ at 15 °C

Kinematic viscosity 129 mm²/s at 40 °C

I have to make a comparison with some other 10W-50 engine oils.

Are you a chemist or fire-safety expert then, normally you compare with technical rather than safety data sheets. Following is link to the technical data sheet and pdf (2-pages), note what is on the webpage for the oil "All indicated data are approximate values and are subject to the commercial fluctuations." -

https://www.ravenol.de/storage/app/media/product-pdf/Tds_1115101_en.pdf

Tds_1115101_en.pdf

@nta16 my main concern in cases like this (engine oil in GR climate conditions) are these parametres:

Viscosity at 100 °C

Viscosity Index

Yes but that is for warm and hot running engine you are also concerned about MPG in the cold of winter and presumably don't want to be changing oil for the cold weather (winter) and hot weather (summer) like many decades back.

With figures and comparisons you do have to compare apples with apples, the figures need to use the same perimeters of testing to get the results (API / ACEA, ASTM) and bear in mind any figures relate to fresh oil not used in your engine for x-miles. Better oils will offer greater margins for longer and remain nearer their fresh figures for longer. Unless you can find results for how long this might be you can't really know and have to go on your common sense and experience and be timely with your oil changes. But much engine wear is just about the journeys you make where the engine doesn't warm enough for long enough to fully protect the engine. So it's not just about how quickly the engine warms from cold start but that the engine warms fully. Part seconds and seconds at lower oil pressure, as long as the this goes to normal after, are less important than the many minutes (and accumulated many hours) the engine is below this or never achieve it on journeys.

Old engines have proven potential to run for hundreds of thousands of kilometres with just usual and timely servicing and maintenance on "standard" engine oils.

2 hours ago, nta16 said:

Are you a chemist or fire-safety expert then, normally you compare with technical rather than safety data sheets. Following is link to the technical data sheet and pdf (2-pages), note what is on the webpage for the oil

incorrect the only way to find composition is to look at the (german) sds

3 hours ago, Thefeliciahacker said:

incorrect the only way to find composition is to look at the (german) sds

No you are incorrect in that I was not refereeing to the composition but was refereeing to comparing viscosity with previous oils figures in this thread which were gained from TDSs and web pages. (I forgot VI and will go back to that now.)

6 hours ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

Viscosity Index

Be careful on this as some VI figures can be a bit wooly not all follow the German DIN or ISO and then I don't know how useful this figure and standard really is for what it measures, perhaps or technical expert can say.

9 hours ago, nta16 said:

presumably don't want to be changing oil for the cold weather (winter) and hot weather (summer)

No way !

.............

Fuchs Titan Race Pro S 10W-50 Ester Fully Synthetic Engine Oil

Kinematic Viscosity at 100ºC 18.17 mm2

Kinematic Viscosity at 40ºC 116.5 mm2

Viscosity Index 174

Specific Gravity at 15ºC 0.869

Pour point -33ºC

Flash Point 210ºC

___________________

TotalEnergies QUARTZ RACING 10W-50

Kinematic viscosity at 40°C 127.5

Kinematic viscosity at 100°C 19.8

Density at 15°C 0.8531

Viscosity index 178

Pour point (to be measured)

Flash point 224ºC

The quest continues...

Fuchs Titan Race Pro S 10W-50 Ester Fully Synthetic Engine Oil

• Kinematic Viscosity at 100ºC - 18.17 mm2

• Kinematic Viscosity at 40ºC - 116.5 mm2

TotalEnergies QUARTZ RACING 10W-50

• Kinematic viscosity at 100°C - 19.8 - - -

• Kinematic viscosity at 40°C - 127.5 - - -

RAVENOL HVE High Viscosity Ester Oil SAE 10W-50

• Viscosity at 100 °C - 17.15 mm²/s (DIN 51562-1)

• Viscosity at 40 °C - 115.0 mm²/s (DIN 51562-1)

Above, just figures that give some limited comparison information of the oils when fresh and unused. If you add to this list the name and figures of the oil you are currently happily using it will give some limited idea of of these figures as a comparison.

Millers Oils EE Performance 10W50

This product is for a performance engine oil featuring NANODRIVE low friction technology for vehicles requiring an A3/B4 or A3/B3 10w50 specification, predominantly for European and Asian extreme high performance vehicles.

PERFORMANCE PROFILE:

• Manufactured to far exceed the requirements of API SL/CF and ACEA A3/B4

• Suitable for operating at 125oC with peak temperatures up to 150oC

DATA SHEET NO: 7955

DT: 04/01/17

• For fast road use or track days in engines where a 10W40 is normally specified

Specific Gravity at 15°C 0.869

Kinematic Viscosity at 100°C 20.0

Kinematic Viscosity at 40°C 139.9

Viscosity Index 165

Pour Point °C -42

Flashpoint °C 240

Motul Specific Abarth 0101 10w-50 Fully Synthetic

Density at 20°C 0.854

Viscosity at 40°C 121.3

Viscosity at 100°C 17.8

Viscosity Index 163.0

Flash point 244.0 °C

Pour point -45.0 °C / -49.0 °C

Millers Oils you may remember is a favourite of mine, I used to use 15w-50 and 20w-50 Motorsport Classic High Performance oils (under presentations) in the MG Midget and currently use EE Performance Engine Oil C3 5w30 in my wife's Fabia, not that the car deserves anything special (other than a lump-hammer).

The viscosity of 20.0 at 100°C would be nearer the top than bottom of the 50 weight range so more margin in that respect from dropping into 40 weight range. How much that would suit you and your various exacting summer needs is a different matter, possibly you might prefer the engine noise from it but who knows if it might go a slight notch or partial notch into the less desirable parameters you set and possibly read from your dash gauges. I stopped spending lots of money on buying hi-fi equipment when I finally realised I was listening far too much to the equipment and nowhere near enough to the music. Now I have no hi-fi what so ever and am more than happy listen to music on mostly any equipment that everyone else has lo-fi or hi-fi or expensive hi-fi. You can't beat the most limiting factors, in your case it's your car and you.

Edited 30 March, 20251 yr by nta16

3 hours ago, nta16 said:

Millers Oils you may remember is a favourite of mine

Yes i do, now only 20W-50 and 0W-20 can be found here

https://www.skroutz.gr/c/1228/Ladia-Autokinhtou/m/22964/Millers-Oils.html

and in some other stores but for Industrial or Truck-Bus use.

On 29/03/2025 at 18:03, nta16 said:

No you are incorrect in that I was not refereeing to the composition but was refereeing to comparing viscosity with previous oils figures in this thread which were gained from TDSs and web pages

Ah i though composition sorry

Keep in mind that VI sadly can be increased by using Viscosity Modifiers and does not always represent base stock.

Cheap VI improvers like OCP break down easily and leave you with a much more thermaly unstable oil

Ravenol HVE

At least the Viscosity Index (VI) is shown as DIN ISO and not just DIN. As I put before I would not give too much weight (regard) to VI numbers, the other information is shown already.

@D.FYLAKTOS I can't remember, I think you have access to Red Line and Amsoil products have you contacted them to see what they recommend for you, if not why not give them a go.

10 hours ago, nta16 said:

@D.FYLAKTOS I can't remember, I think you have access to Red Line and Amsoil products .

I have use in the past Amsoil, excellent product.

Red Line were and are far the more expensive engine oils in the GR market, for example 1 bottle of 10W-40 (basically is 946 ml) costs 25,00 € so the cost for 5 of them is 125 € plus the oil filter plus the work from the mechanic and the cost for an oil change is skyrocket.

Motul Specific 0101 10W-50 110282 VOLKSWAGEN

Density at 20°C 0.854

Viscosity at 40°C 121.3

Viscosity at 100°C 17.8

HTHS viscosity at 150°C 4.6

Viscosity Index 163.0

Flash point 244.0 °C

Pour point -45.0 °C / -49.0 °C

Q8 Formula F1 10W-50

Pour point -33°C

Flash point 210°C

Viscosity at 40°C 119

Viscosity at 100°C 17.6

Density 0.86 g/cm³ at 15°C