Sadly i could not drive one , but had a quick drive in a 1.2 tsi 105 ibiza - great little engine, but can someone confirm the lack of power in first - the guy who took me out said its turbo lag is this correct and present in the monte? it was very noticeable....if this is the norm can it be sorted as part of a remap?

My car is the same, the throttle is restricted in first gear, it's not turbo lag. I would think it could be mapped out It's slightly annoying at first, but you learn the method needed to pull away quickly.

I think at this point that I'd rather have a TSI Monte than the vRS. It'll still be loads of fun down twisties!

Blimey, we’ll get you in a diesel yet

I've always loved the DSG!

I was VERY wary about DSG (being a complete luddite) but now I've forgotten why I have a left leg. I tried to drive a manual for the first time in months the other week and hit the brake pedal to change gear - d'oh! The DSG in a straight line is fantastic; however, I do also miss a manual box on occasion - both my previous cars - Lupo GTi & MKI Fabia vRS had superb 6-speed boxes.

Never had any hesitation issues - was this not remedied by a software update?

I actually thought about a Monty but the vRS wasn't much more dosh (I bought used), so it was an easy decision for me (don't do big miles so economy not a factor).

Monty is just an SE with extras. All same engines as SE

Yeah, but nice extras like sports suspension and seats and wheels

So if you get the more powerful engines, you can actually rip down the twisties pretty rapidly !

Edited 2 April, 201214 yr by Mike Wrightson

I have been looking to change my car for six months, i liked the look of the vrs but have always disliked auto's! Still i decided to give it a test drive,first five mins felt a bit awkward after ten mins i started to get to grips with it and after twenty mins i loved it! my new vrs arrives on thursday cant wait! Its like DR PEPPER try it you might like it!

This 'hesitation' thing ?

All manuals do the exact same thing. You approach the roundabout, drop to 3rd, just as you need 2nd because you've slowed down, you push the clutch in, select 2nd and off the clutch. In all these manual circumstances there is a hesitation between the changes ?

Why it's pointed out as an issue with DSG ?

Manual boxes are far from instant :think:

johny boy has a very valid point!

This 'hesitation' thing ?

All manuals do the exact same thing. You approach the roundabout, drop to 3rd, just as you need 2nd because you've slowed down, you push the clutch in, select 2nd and off the clutch. In all these manual circumstances there is a hesitation between the changes ?

Why it's pointed out as an issue with DSG ?

Manual boxes are far from instant :think:

I experience this all the time now I drive the manual TSI VRS after driving my 1.8 TSI DSG. Gladly we have acquired a Fabia 2 DSG which is incredible with the supercharger kick at 2K on usch as small car as the Fabia VRS.

No modern circiut race cars are manual as far as I know, most other race cars, such as touring car and rally cars use short through sequential gearboxes if not DSG.

Manuals are 20th cenrury technology.

Proper autos need 7 or preferable 8 gears to get the best acceleration and mileage which even F1 cars need to do well.

I bob between Drive setting and Sports on the Fabia VRS and use the paddles too mainly to push box in to higher gears when road ahead is easy going as this help fuel consumption to better than manual on the 7 speeds.

8 speeds please like BMWs, Jags.

Monte is/was better lookiing but now VRS looks better with black grill etc. Fabia 2 shell needs some flaring to the arches to stop looking like Noddy's sister's car. Anybody know where to get some semi subtle IRC stickers as standard ones as a bit too subtle, even on a white car like we have?

Edited 3 April, 201214 yr by lol

8 speeders that BMW, Merc, Lexus, Jag, LR and don't forget VW/Audi Group use are conventional torque converter auto's made by ZF, not really suitable for small cars with small engines. They are silky smooth though and certainly do not suffer from any hesitation that's the big advantage of having a torque converter. The down sides are weight, size, power losses and losses in efficiency until the lockup clutches engage.

Cheers

Lee

Edited 3 April, 201214 yr by logiclee

This 'hesitation' thing ?

All manuals do the exact same thing. You approach the roundabout, drop to 3rd, just as you need 2nd because you've slowed down, you push the clutch in, select 2nd and off the clutch. In all these manual circumstances there is a hesitation between the changes ?

Why it's pointed out as an issue with DSG ?

Manual boxes are far from instant :think:

johny boy has a very valid point!

Think someone pointed this out before. You think there's a delay but it's actually less than putting the clutch in and changing manually. I've never noticed even that!

Because i have one leg and have since 1977 i drive only Automatics.

Every type of automatics over the years that i think i could of.

Back through the years that is the likes of, CVT Daf 's & Volvo 343 CVT's, Transit and a Fiesta Durashift, recently iQ's CVT's , Subaru XV CVT, an Alfa Romeo TCT, Fiat Dualogic, Fiat Speedgear,

Big Fast & little slow autos in 3 speed, 4 speed & 5 Speed, never really ever found a box that was a problem or took getting used to.

That is untill i had an Auto 1.6 TD Hyundai i130,

it was exactly like a vRS twin charger,

you can not just sit at a junction, cross roads etc and wait for a chance to move and put down the throttle and cross quickly.

You need to be very gentle with the throttle & move without spinning the wheels, it seems to sit then go.

A junction of wet broken white lines on the road and you need extra care.

Thats just the way i find it.

One crossroads/junction i have used for 6 years now is taking longer to cross with the vRS, just as it used to with the i130.

You know if you try to take a chance nipping across you are likely to spin the tyres, lag then too fast.

george

Think someone pointed this out before. You think there's a delay but it's actually less than putting the clutch in and changing manually. I've never noticed even that!

Me neither, ever. DSG - Delivering Smooth Gearchanges

Because i have one leg and have since 1977 i drive only Automatics.

Every type of automatics over the years that i think i could of.

Back through the years that is the likes of, CVT Daf 's & Volvo 343 CVT's, Transit and a Fiesta Durashift, recently iQ's CVT's , Subaru XV CVT, an Alfa Romeo TCT, Fiat Dualogic, Fiat Speedgear,

Big Fast & little slow autos in 3 speed, 4 speed & 5 Speed, never really ever found a box that was a problem or took getting used to.

That is untill i had an Auto 1.6 TD Hyundai i130,

it was exactly like a vRS twin charger,

you can not just sit at a junction, cross roads etc and wait for a chance to move and put down the throttle and cross quickly.

You need to be very gentle with the throttle & move without spinning the wheels, it seems to sit then go.

A junction of wet broken white lines on the road and you need extra care.

Thats just the way i find it.

One crossroads/junction i have used for 6 years now is taking longer to cross with the vRS, just as it used to with the i130.

You know if you try to take a chance nipping across you are likely to spin the tyres, lag then too fast.

george

Yep, I too have had 3, 4, 5, 6 and 7 speed conventional torque convertor auto's a couple of automated manuals including Alfa's Selespeed and two versions of DSG. I must say I've never had dsg hesitation off the line from stationary but the dsg does require the use of a smooth throttle or manual override when approaching junctions while rolling.

Every review I read slated the selespeed but I loved it, you just had to get your head around the computer was changing gear in a manual box but quicker than you could ever manage, the twin spark was a meaty, snarly sounding engine and the blips of throttle on down changes when pushing on sounded great.

I think every auto has compromises, the DSG isn't perfect but would I go back to manual? Not a chance.

Lee

Edited 3 April, 201214 yr by logiclee

you can not just sit at a junction, cross roads etc and wait for a chance to move and put down the throttle and cross quickly.

You need to be very gentle with the throttle & move without spinning the wheels, it seems to sit then go.

A junction of wet broken white lines on the road and you need extra care.

Thats just the way i find it.

One crossroads/junction i have used for 6 years now is taking longer to cross with the vRS, just as it used to with the i130.

You know if you try to take a chance nipping across you are likely to spin the tyres, lag then too fast.

george

This is exactly my experience of driving my vRS at roundabouts/junctions!

Are you guys experiencing hesitation from standstill, ie press the pedal then nothing happens or are you just pulling away in 1st with too much throttle and introducing wheel spin?

A torque convertor auto will smoothly feed in power and smooth out throttle inputs. Automated manuals engage the clutch and you need to control how much torque you send to the wheels with the throttle exactly the same as you would in a manual.

I've not experienced hesitation off the line in a dsg but it easy on higher torque models to overcook the amount of torque you send to the wheels in first and introduce wheelspin.

If you are getting hesitation from standstill then something isn't right.

Cheers

Edited 3 April, 201214 yr by logiclee

1st DSG i drove were BMWs then a Seat Diesel. Fine.

Then a roadstest in a 122bhp A1 with DSG which behaved like any other car just coming easily away from a halt, to cross a junction..

Then the Cupra 1.4 TSi

& VW Polo GTi 1.4TSi Demonstrators behaved exactly like the vRS Estate & the hatch i drove before the actual one i bought.

So that is 5 different 180bhp twinchargers i have driven that all behave exactly the same.

I forgive each and everyone because of the way it goes when you do want it to shift. SOAS!

But for a gentle drive a ,'city/calm' it mode might be worth it for the first time on any car i have ever liked.

Even old Corsas & Fiats had a snow button that was handy for greasy surfaces & even gravel starts.

george

EDIT PS

One situation is does not happen in is at a slight uphill halt were it decides to go into 'hillhold' and you feel it hold, then it comes off from the start a little bit slower.

Edited 3 April, 201214 yr by sk4gw

This sounds like a mapping issue between the 1.4TSi twin charge and the 7 speed DSG then, the 7 speed DSG doesn't have any hesitation issues from standstill on the two cars we have it fitted to. 1.2TSi Fabia and 1.6TDi Golf.

Ive never suffered this hesitation though.

A possible way around this would be to use the paddles to hange down gear.

Ive never suffered this hesitation though.

A possible way around this would be to use the paddles to hange down gear.

He's talking from standstill so will be in 1st

still stands though, in manual the clutch stays engaged and the revs are raised so its should be lag free. ALternately, when your about ready to go you can raise the brake pedal to the point where you feel the clutch trying to engage. That should also stop any lag.

Wander why some cars suffer with this lag, yet others dont??

LOL, with 2 feet you can do 2 pedal automatic driving.

With only one foot you just drive autos 1 footed. That is Foot on brake and then onto throttle.

I am never really a hand brake on person while stopped at junctions..

Some amputees that race or do sprints and other motorsports have a Hand Throttle or hand brake, or manuals with an air shifter, or even 'servo clutch')

I used to have an 'Airshifter' on my bikes.

Really if it was a major problem i would deal with it, its just being mentioned because others have also experienced it

george

Me and my wife love DSG now, she wouldn't have another car without. Only time i've had a hesitation issue is when i've deliberately tried my best to create it. I came down a slip road off a motorway in D and while the car was declerating from 20-30 and still in 4-5 I intervened and paddled down a number of times. I successful managed to confuse it and found when I got to the giveway it was showing 1 but I had no gear when I hit the throttle. Only took about 2-5 seconds for the DSG to catch up though and I didn't need a restart that I know some people have.

Only thing we conciously do is still treat the car as a manual more than an auto. In a manual you always wait and want the clutch to bite before putting down the power I feel. With an auto, especially on a luxury brand, it's tempting to forget all about it and just let your torque convertor do all the work.

Edited 4 April, 201214 yr by RobL

DSG every time for me. I have no hesitation pulling away, infact the only problem is getting the front wheels to get traction without lighting them up. I test drove the Monty before the VRS and there is no comparison, the Monty is nippy and has good fuel economy the VRS is frighteningly fast and the DSG is a revelation....having drove cars with manual gearboxes for 30 years+ I wouldn't go back. Ron.

I think that DSG is so good that it's human nature to have a pop at it. Bit like Steve Davis when he was the very best at snooker