So Vettel & Riccardo will start, say 13th and 14th? Oh, I do hope so!!

Eric Boullier at McLaren has stated this week that he disagreed with Red Bulls argument regarding the fuel flow sensor. Bouillier's view is that all the teams have been issued with this sensor, it might not be perfect, but it's the same for all the teams. Red Bull were clearly trying to maximise the engine performance and ignored the stewards instructions, which is a real no no.

Of course McLaren will benefit from an unsuccessful appeal from Red Bull. 

I'd be very surprised if there weren't more teams tinkering to affect its operation in their favour.

The FIA sensor is a nonsense anyway; fuel leaving the tank and fuel arriving in the cylinders are not the same thing in any moderately modern engine. And, to (mis)quote from Autosprout letters "how can you complete a 90 minute race on 100kg of fuel and still consistently flow more than 100kg/hr"?

Did we ever establish whether the rules are regarding whether the limit is an average one or an immediate one?

The FIA sensor is a nonsense anyway;

But it's the same for all of the teams.

And, to (mis)quote from Autosprout letters "how can you complete a 90 minute race on 100kg of fuel and still consistently flow more than 100kg/hr"?

 

Failure to understand averages I'd say. 'Consistently' could basically mean "for the same stretch of the back straight on every lap", perfectly easy to comprehend having a flow rate of over 100kg/hr for a couple of hundred meters in a lap and still use less than 100kg during the whole race.

Failure to understand averages I'd say. 'Consistently' could basically mean "for the same stretch of the back straight on every lap", perfectly easy to comprehend having a flow rate of over 100kg/hr for a couple of hundred meters in a lap and still use less than 100kg during the whole race.

Someplace up-thread the original rule text is quoted. There's nothing in that about extrapolating your peak flow rate per hour from a spot reading.

 

There are a number of issues here:-

1. I think that the rule is badly worded.
2. The base concept that fuel flow from tank has anything to do with flow into engine went out with the carburetor.
3. Much as I dislike Vermillian Male Bovine, they did not break the rule as it is written.
4. Someplace else upthread, I've rewritten the rule to say more or less what the FIA intended.

 

Someplace up-thread the original rule text is quoted. There's nothing in that about extrapolating your peak flow rate per hour from a spot reading.

 

 

Quite correct and I've said myself in this thread that the wording is not specific enough, there are a number of ways that you can sample and extrapolate the flow rate, the two most obvious ones being length of time taken for {x}grams of fuel to flow through the sensor, or number of grams of fuel to flow through every {x}seconds.

 

I would personally say that stating "We've used less than 100kg of fuel across a 90 minute race so obviously haven't had a flow rate over 100kg/hour" is simply an idiotic argument, but I suppose when it comes to lawyers discussing wording of rulings idiotic doesn't necessarily mean invalid.

The wording is not specific enough, 

Rule 5.1.4 Fuel mass flow must not exceed 100kg/h. 

The wording looks clear enough and I don't see how it can be misinterpreted. Red Bull are not saying that they exceeded this flow rate, they are saying that the FIA sensor was giving an incorrect reading and that their own fuel flow measuring system was correct. The bottom line is that the Renault engine is down on power per unit of fuel compared to other engines in F1.

 

Now Adrian Newey has waded into the argument by moaning about the new regs. I wonder if he would be have been complained if the Renault engine was as powerful as the Mercedes unit?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/26895974

 

 

Now Adrian Newey has waded into the argument by moaning about the new regs. I wonder if he would be have been complained if the Renault engine was as powerful as the Mercedes unit?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/

 

Of course he wouldn't - just the usual RB mud slinging ahead of a hearing, they are on the back foot and don't like it but then again any team would do the same. Head of Ferrari (Luca De M) has also been critical. 

I'm not a big fan of the new regulations for F1, but it's not like they have just been dumped on the teams. The change to 1.6 turbo engines for 2014 was set up a couple of years ago. All of the teams and engine manufactures knew what was coming, if they didn't like the changes they had the option of leaving FI, Honda however have taken the decision to come back and supply McLaren with engines from 2015.

Whenever new regs or rule changes are introduced some teams are not as competitive as they hoped they would be when the season starts so they have to work on ways of improving the car within the rules. Currently Red Bull realize that their main problem is the lack of power from the engine and to comply with the 100kg/h rule the engine will only rev to around 11000 rpm, the engines are allowed to rev to 15000 rpm. So getting rid of the fuel flow rate rule would allow them to rev the engine higher for more power.

So:

Horner has criticised the rule and the sensor.

Newey has criticised the new regs

Renualt has criticised the engine note because the engine revs are too low and the design of the exhaust can't be changed

Vettel has criticised the sound of the engine

 

Ferarri are also unhappy with the new regs, because like RB they are 'off the pace'

Rule 5.1.4 Fuel mass flow must not exceed 100kg/h. 

The wording looks clear enough and I don't see how it can be misinterpreted.

 

When measuring volume flow / time you must sample and extrapolate, you can do that over an entire hour therefore meaning that no matter what you do on your engine if you finish a 90 minute race with a couple of litres of fuel left you obviously haven't exceeded it, or you can sample over shorter periods or per unit of volume taken from the fuel cell, which will give a very different result.

 

The wording is not specific enough. It should absolutely detail the parameters on which their officially sanctioned sensor operates.

 Honda however have taken the decision to come back and supply McLaren with engines from 2015.

 

It's also being said by a lot of people that Renault would have walked from F1 had the formula not been changed to put a greater emphasis on efficiency.

When measuring volume flow / time you must sample and extrapolate, you can do that over an entire hour therefore meaning that no matter what you do on your engine if you finish a 90 minute race with a couple of litres of fuel left you obviously haven't exceeded it, or you can sample over shorter periods or per unit of volume taken from the fuel cell, which will give a very different result.

Rule 5.1.4 Fuel mass flow must not exceed 100kg/h. 

The fuel flowing through the FIA sensor must not flow at a rate greater than 100kg/h at any time.

Sat down with a cuppa to SkyF1's build up

Rule 5.1.4 Fuel mass flow must not exceed 100kg/h. 

The fuel flowing through the FIA sensor must not flow at a rate greater than 100kg/h at any time.

 

I'm not saying I agree with Red Bull, I'm just saying that technically they could have a valid argument depending on how good their lawyers are.

Sat down with a cuppa to SkyF1's build up

 

I'm at my bro's place watching it ... What did you make of the feature about Mercedes' turbo layout? I thought it was pretty interesting myself.

Yeah thought that was very very good, thinking outside the box for sure. I doubt well see it on our road cars any time, maybe on super cars in years to come.

I wasn't paying 100% attention to the feature, was it just Mercedes who've done this, or all the Merc teams?

All the Merc teams have the turbo layout but Merc knew about it well in advance of the other teams (they proposed the idea to the engine builders) so have better built their car around the tighter packaging.

I think F1 was right to move on the technology, and I don't mind the sound either.. but the new formula has really yet to deliver any exciting racing. Hoping this will change tomorrow!

I think F1 was right to move on the technology, and I don't mind the sound either.. but the new formula has really yet to deliver any exciting racing. Hoping this will change tomorrow!

 

The original proposals for the revised formula included ground effect floors (banned in the early 80s) on the cars, with less downforce generated by the wings, to try and solve once and for all the 'dirty air' issue that makes it almost impossible for cars to close up to each other and really battle it out .... but the teams told the working group to knob off because it would cost too much money to develop. http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/13412925

it was interesting to watch the 3 guys on the podium during the National Anthems. During our National Anthem Lewis fidgeted and chatted, but during the German National Anthem, he seemed to take the whole thing a bit more serious. Only a small observation, but it made me wonder if Queen and Country was second to the tune (no pun intended) of the big bucks and manufacturing, of Mercedes  :( Hope I misjudged that one

I listened to the race on the radio. Brilliant. Really cheered me up after the first two races of the season.

Hope it continues like this.