Car rear ended by disqualified driver - advice required

[biglunn]

Hi there,

I don't post on here too often, but I would like some opinions and advice from fellow skoda drivers.

Yesterday I was driving with my wife and 15mth old boy along a busy 3 lane road (A4 Great West Road in Hounslow towards London) and on approach to the traffic lights I slowed down and as I almost came to a standstill my car was rammed hard from behind. I was the first car at the lights, and car rolled forward a considerable distance before I stopped it - luckily no other car was crossing the junction.

The van which hit me stopped - all parties in shock. I called an ambulance to check the little one out (both wife and child were taken to hospital for checks) and when exchanging details with driver he was very distressed asking if he can make a 'deal'.

Meanwhile the ambulance called the police who arrived promptly, and they weren't to bothered until they ran some checks on the driver - found that he was disqualified from driving!

The driver had hired a hertz van - he wasn't disqualified when he hired it months ago but had been since. Now... I'm concerned what happens to me from an insurance point of view? Have I been hit by an uninsured driver? Will Hertz pay up or will my insurance cover it? Will I be entitled to hire a suitable car (big enough for baby/pushchair) or will I have to settle for tiny courtesy car?

I am fully comp insured and also have have Skoda Ensure so that if car is repaired it is done 'properly'. I have a sneaky feeling the car may end up being a write off - 1.5yr old fabia estate serious rear end damage with rear door jammed and rear quarter warped.

Lots of questions - any advice about what might/will happen.

[Huskoda]

I would have thought Hertz would have to comply with their insurance obligations, being the registered keeper of the van (which is why the DVLA make such a fuss about the RK holding insurance, right?)

 

If its been hit hard enough that the frame is bent, I wouldn't want it back anyway, so don't think of the writeoff as being a bad thing.

[Toxicvrs]

I would have thought Hertz would have to comply with their insurance obligations, being the registered keeper of the van (which is why the DVLA make such a fuss about the RK holding insurance, right?)

If its been hit hard enough that the frame is bent, I wouldn't want it back anyway, so don't think of the writeoff as being a bad thing.

I'd agree with this and having been hit by someone who was in effect an uninsured driver due to not declaring mods their insurance still pays up from what I gathered.

[trundlenut]

I'd agree with this and having been hit by someone who was in effect an uninsured driver due to not declaring mods their insurance still pays up from what I gathered.

With undeclared mods you are still covered for 3rd party losses I thought.

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

[ruffday]

This could be a bit tricky if he is disqualified.

Have you got Motoring Legal protection with your policy and protected NCB.

If you have then the quickest way to deal with it may be to claim on your own insurance and let the legal team sort out claiming it back.

This way you should be back on the road quickly.

[Toxicvrs]

With undeclared mods you are still covered for 3rd party losses I thought.

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

Ahh that must've been it, I just let the insurance company get on with it

[littleade]

As above Hertz will still have 3rd party insurance so you should claim off them. The most logical thing would be for Hertz to supply you with a car from their rental stock free off charge until your car is either repaired or replaced, rather than you hire one then have to try and claim it back. It might be worth contacting them and asking what their policy is in such instances, not forgetting to speak to someone further up the pecking order if you don't get the answer you want. Good luck and let us know what sentance the scroat gets. Hopefully the court will stamp on him as he's clearly taken a concious decision to carry on driving the hire van, thinking he'd get away with it.

[Titanium_Man]

Worst case scenario you will have to take your claim (or at least your insurers should) to the M.I.B (not Will Smith and Tommy, the Motor Insurers Bureau!) as there is a pool of money that insurers contribute a small amount to that will cover people for claims against uninsured drivers for uninsured losses. If he is disqualified he won't be insured. (processes and particulars may have changed in the 12 odd months since I stopped dealing with private insurance, but Im sure the basics of it is still in force)

 

There will be ~£350 XS but worth chatting to your insurer if things start to get sticky. 

[StevesTruck]

Was he actually on hertz ' insurance? Could well be that he or hours employer were providing their own cover.

[Llanigraham]

Having been hit and had a car written off by a banned driver, leave it all to your Insurance company. 

As JARS says in the worst case it will have to go through the MIB, but when that happened with mine my insurance company (Frizzell LV) paid out straight away and then claimed back their expenses from MIB.

I paid no excess.

Hope everyone is OK.

[biglunn]

Hi all, 

Thanks for your comments - the situation is a bit more complex than normal, but I guess I just have to go with it and go ahead with the claim. Seems like an increase in premium is most likely gonna happen and I may have to pay the excess - now not that bothered as health of me my wife and the little one is most important.

The guy who caused the accident was pretty distraught - soon after the accident he firstly was concerned about us, and then was really worried and suggested that I settle outside of insurance which I refused - should have twigged that something was not right. Police removed his van off the road, and in the end it was just me (waiting for the RAC) and him standing on the footpath. He was apologizing, worried for himself and his family (he was not from England), telling me how he is using the van for his Amazon delivery work, talking about how unfortunate he had been with the points he had been getting on the license, and what might happen happen next. I stressed that the most important thing is that everyone seemingly got away unharmed (I was up all night worried about my little one) and it is just an 'accident' despite the license issue.

He walked off home (I almost offered him a lift!) and an hour or so later received a call from a withheld number with him apologizing and a 'mate' telling me I wont get any money through insurance and urging me to do a 'deal'. I felt a bit uncomfortable through this and politely declined.

The insurance company will be getting in-touch with me tomorrow morning and hopefully I can get things moving as quickly as possible. What a pain - a ruined weekend, and carless today. But it could have been a lot worse.

 

 

 

I would have thought Hertz would have to comply with their insurance obligations, being the registered keeper of the van (which is why the DVLA make such a fuss about the RK holding insurance, right?)

 

If its been hit hard enough that the frame is bent, I wouldn't want it back anyway, so don't think of the writeoff as being a bad thing.

 

I had a look today and the accident is a lot worse than at first glance.

 

 

 

 

On the last picture, the passenger door behind the drivers cant be closed properly (and its bloody raining aargh!). Rear quarter has popped out, and when the door is opened, you can see a kink in the lower sill and the post where the door latches.

 

Also, the frame behind the bumper just 'popped' - impact went straight into the boot, a lot of creasing and bending on the underside of the car. Officer at the scene was surprised this has happened - possible weakness in design?

 

The car is 1yr 8mths old - less than 10k mileage - super condition and would have been worth about £8000. Not sure if it is a write-off but now hoping so.

 

This could be a bit tricky if he is disqualified.

Have you got Motoring Legal protection with your policy and protected NCB.

If you have then the quickest way to deal with it may be to claim on your own insurance and let the legal team sort out claiming it back.

This way you should be back on the road quickly.

 

I didn't specify Motoring Legal protection on renewal - doh! I have got Skoda Ensure protection, and it is listed as included there - Ill ask tomorrow if that is covered. Luckily I have protected NCD

 

Was he actually on hertz ' insurance? Could well be that he or hours employer were providing their own cover.

 

This could be interesting. With Hertz Im pretty sure that their insurance covers it. But I can't be sure yet. It will come out in the wash - no doubt another surprise in the making!

 

 

The police and ambulance staff were fantastic - in a way I think it was lucky the police turned up as they have made a proper report now. I wouldnt have known about the driver license issue if they hadnt come, so god knows how the claim would have proceeded. I also had a witness who checked us out immediately after the accident - I might ring him and thank him.

[Raf_]

Don't forget not to use the lil one's car seat, you can claim for a new one on the insurance

[Jon_woo]

If i was turning upto the scene of that and a disq driver has hit someone in a collision i would be arresting them for the offence to confirm his details and get a proper interview done on him. As well as doing that i would have filled in a collision booklet and detailed every aspect of the incident including all the drivers details etc etc.

 

That way when it all goes to court they can also discuss his comp he has to pay you, this would be a double wammy as the traffic report would be investigated by our collision admin team who in turn speak to you insurance and they would pursue him for their costs for more compo.

 

If we stop a disq driver without any form of collision we dont arrest them, we seize the car and report them for the offense.

 

With regards to your insurance this will be a battle between your insurance and the rental company, if he was disqualified after taking out the rental agreement then i would presume your insurance will claim from the rental company and they in turn will go after the driver, or they could both go after the driver.

 

If you have legal protection then sit back and let them deal with it.

 

If you want any advice etc drop me a PM

[loskie]

I would have thought ( although I am no expert) that Hertz if rented to the disqual driver and not someone else have failed in their "due diligence checks" and therefore could be held liable.

 

Your insurance co will take the easiest route out of it, but remember they are working for you and "should" act upon your instructions.

 

Seek legal advice, if not included in car insurance you may have it in house insurance, union membership or similar.

If not engage a solicitor and your costs should be recoverable.

 

Glad none of you are hurt.

Police should have arrested driver IMHO.

[Dr Zoidberg]

I would have thought ( although I am no expert) that Hertz if rented to the disqual driver and not someone else have failed in their "due diligence checks" and therefore could be held liable.

 

The OP says that the driver had been banned some time after hiring the van.

The hire company aren't in the wrong.

[loskie]

The OP says that the driver had been banned some time after hiring the van.

The hire company aren't in the wrong.

I see I misunderstood that to mean he had hired a van previously when not banned then hired again when banned and checks had not been made. Poor show the police not arresting him.

[biglunn]

Raf - Thanks for the reco on the baby seat though - I'd taken it out today with the intention to keep it!

Jon - I'm not sure if he was arrested or not, but he was in the back of the police car for a long time. The officers did fill in a booklet - I'm guessing this is the collision booklet you mentioned as I was formally asked details of the incident and asked to sign. The van was seized and taken away and he was free to go. Thanks for the offer - I may PM you for further advice :-)

Loskie - I'm actually not sure if he got disq before or after he hired the van - its what the driver told me afterwards but I don't know if I can believe him. I don't even know if Hertz or someone else is insuring the other vehicle - I guess I will find out sometime soon. I have legal cover with my home insurance but don't know if it covers road traffic incidents. I'm hoping the Skoda Ensure (free) cover that I got with the new cover provides legal assistance in this case. They are calling me tomorrow morning and hopefully they can manage all the parties on my behalf. Otherwise I'll have to find a solicitor.

I was clearing out the car and found the back seat wet - both doors are not shutting properly. And the boot floor is a huge warped mess! Looking more likely to be a writeoff - in which case I hope I get a decent payout.

Can't help feeling a bit sorry for the driver that hit me - he is now jobless, probably hasn't got much money, and is going to be in big trouble. Thank god for everyone's sake nobody got hurt! I just hope things move quickly and I get a car so that I can take minimal time off work.

Once again thanks for all the advice - can't tell you how much it helps just discussing the issue.

[samj2013]

 

Also, the frame behind the bumper just 'popped' - impact went straight into the boot, a lot of creasing and bending on the underside of the car. Officer at the scene was surprised this has happened - possible weakness in design?

 

Surely that's just the crumple zones doing their job?...

[biglunn]

Surely that's just the crumple zones doing their job?...

Im not sure... The bar fell off the car with barely a scratch or dent on it like it just fell of the mounting bolts. No deformation at all. The soft underside and sides took it all. I'll take pics in the morning.

[samj2013]

Im not sure... The bar fell off the car with barely a scratch or dent on it like it just fell of the mounting bolts. No deformation at all. The soft underside and sides took it all. I'll take pics in the morning.

Without being an automotive engineer, I couldn't tell you exactly what the bar is actually supposed to do, but sounds to me like the ideal parts of the car took the force of the impact (the boot, the underside), and left you, your partner and your little'un safe! I think it's probably pretty safe to say it's a write off, and that's no bad thing to say it did what it was meant to do and kept you guys safe

[Ratboy]

Don't feel sorry for him. If he has been disqualified then he's continuously shown poor driving or a disrespect to the laws of the road.

He's made his own bed - look at it this way, he could have seriously injured you or your family - or even worse killed either one of you!!!

Hertz insurance will be liable for the third party risk. It might take a while to settle right enough.

[FlyingGecko]

...Don't feel sorry for him. If he has been disqualified then he's continuously shown poor driving or a disrespect to the laws of the road.

He's made his own bed - look at it this way, he could have seriously injured you or your family - or even worse killed either one of you!!!

....

Hundred percent agreement here - and that repair'll cost a couple of grand or more, easy. Leave it with your insurers.

[loskie]

Lets hope it is written off for your peace of mind.

[BossFox]

That damage may look bad, but being such a new car it'll have to cost over £4k or so before they write it off.

 

As for the other driver, he is a complete tool.

He clearly knows he is in the wrong and is trying to use a bit of emotional blackmail to get a deal done.

He will lie about anything to try and help his case.

 

Just let your insurance company and the police do their job.

That's what they are there for.

 

If you feel sorry for the other driver, think how he lost his license.

Did he get enough points to lose it by accident or was he actually breaking the law, then knowing he probably had three points to go before his job was at risk he kept on... then he made a decision to drive round in over two tonnes of vehicle with no license and drive badly enough to crash into someone hard.

Guy's a tool.  Shouldn't be on the road.

[cheezemonkhai]

Just so you know, the uninsured driver won't allow you to claim from the uninsured drivers fund, because you have comprehensive insurance, so they'll make you do that (Been there).

 

What you could do however, would be to sue Hertz, for allowing a drive who was disqualified to rent a van and also the driver in the same case in a civil case.

That way somebody will be found guilty and you at least have a judgement against them that can be enforced.

 

It might take a while, but eventually you'll get something back.

 

That all of course hinges on what Hertz insurers say before hand.

 

As for the damage, yes I think that's a write off, but I'm not an qualified repair person.

Can you get the spare wheel out?

 

Knackered boot floor, the crash bar is what he hit and you can see, but combined with the rear doors not shutting, I'd be very surprised if it's fixed up.

Don't forget white van probably weighs close to twice what your car does and if you were stopped and he was doing (lets be generous and say 30) that's a lot of energy to transfer and disperse.

 

Looks to me like the crumple zones did their job well, tbh.

Edited 24 November, 2014 by cheezemonkhai