TSI VRS Estate?

[gorgerak]

Hi all, I'm looking at getting a Petrol Vrs for the next car but need an estate for the practicality. Several people have warned me that an estate should be diesel powered if you want any decent resale value out of it, as Estates are supposed to be mile-munchers.

Do you reckon this is something to be concerned about or is it not really a big enough difference in the grand scheme of things (would be looking to keep the car for 3 years i expect?

Similarly would it be an idea to look at the DSG? I've always had manuals up until now.

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[M12MKD]

Ask yourself these questions

1) How many miles do I do?

2) What is my typical driving pattern?

Yes historically the diesel version has always held its value more than the petrol, but if you are changing every 3 years I'm guessing it's on a PCP in which case what does it matter as both will have the GFV in the agreement.

As for DSG....drive one and make your choice.

[Neily03]

What a load of rubbish, the estate is the better looking car and IIRC is the bigger seller, the engine is irrelevant. Go with the TSI if that's what you want.

[butchvrs]

It's not something that would concern me to be honest, but then I'm a petrol head, always have been and always will be.

 

Even when I was doing 20K miles plus a year I still ran petrol cars, one of which was a Sapphire Cosworth 4x4 which when driven like a Granny could achieve the the heady consumption of 24mpg  :S .

 

My Mk3 Tsi VRS is pretty good on fuel, I routinely see 30'ish around town and on a motorway journey low 40's, oh and that's with a DTUK tuning box fitted which allegedly gives me around the 300bhp mark!

 

I also think "stuff" what everybody else thinks, it's your money and your choice.

 

As for the DSG, I can't comment because I went for manual.

 

What ever you order, enjoy.

[Tim1631]

What a load of rubbish, the estate is the better looking car and IIRC is the bigger seller, the engine is irrelevant. Go with the TSI if that's what you want.

Each to there own I'd say

[RobbySpurs]

If you want/need a diesel get a diesel. If you want/need a petrol get a petrol. Can't agree that getting the estate means you have to go diesel...

[Gaz]

I've a TSi estate.  The DSG is well coupled to the engine 

 

I've had diesel estates before.  If you look at it from the 'usual' perspective, I have no business having either as I rarely do great distances, and I'm rarely lugging loads.  Both of which are irrelevant to me out of personal choice.

 

My wife had a diesel Golf for five years and it rarely did anything other than 1.5 miles to work, and then 1.5 miles home again.  It was a great car.  Should she have really had a Leaf? Probably.  But it's not what she wanted.

 

Horses for courses.  Don't lose sleep over whether it should be a diesel or petrol lump, or what the residuals will be like in a few years.  I really like the way the petrol vRS drives.  But I also really miss my Superb coz of the lazy diesel oomph.  None of it for the worry of what I 'should' have or any warnings, no matter how well meaning.

 

Gaz 

[gorgerak]

Sorry I should've stated in the original post - I do about 12,500 miles a year - about 9,000 of which are on 70mph dual carriagway. I get the benefit of diesel economy on my current car, but I'm pretty sure i could stomach the increased running costs of a petrol.

Honestly I could live with either engine - i know a diesel is relatively cheap to run and comes with plenty of torque, but the petrol is significantly more powerful and usually makes a nicer noise.

I agree with the comments about needing to test a DSG box, i have read that its not as good when combined with the diesel engine and driving around town????

It sounds like there isn't really a huge amount in it when it comes to resale value - yes it will be on a PCP - so yes there is the GFV to ward off haggling over part exchange figures - but i wanted to see if there was a feeling of 'estates should be diesels in this day and age - what are you thinking getting a petrol estate you raving loony'

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[pipsyp]

In fairness the diesel will probably still prove to be a better resale bet in that it will always be more economical and cheaper to run than the petrol...most people looking for a car of this kind will still preference that over raw performance IMHO.

The TSI is overall the better performance car and taking any other factors out of the equation would be what Id choose, but the 184 TDI is excellent, offers massive real world pace for supermini running costs...over the petrol sure there is a slight performance compromise but for me personally the fact it returns 40-odd MPG even under hard driving swings it for me.

Definitely if you are going to be doing a few miles a year Id say go diesel, otherwise probably just go petrol and enjoy it.

[JPH0091]

Around 20000km a year, I'd say go and enjoy the petrol.

Resale value of diesel cars in the coming years will be significantly reduced by the improving and widespread knowledge of their environmental impacts.

[Gaz]

I think the better resale of a diesel was a given - until fairly recently.

 

I don't hold much truck with all the recent palaver over emissions.  I expect once it's all blown over, petrol will get the next bashing.

 

Why not just try all four variants, petrol, dirty diesel, manual, DSG and then decide which you like the best from there.

 

And on the diesel DSG relationship, I drove a 1.6TDi (Black Edition) just before settling for the vRS, and don't really see what people are getting at as, in my experience (albeit only a 30 min test drive), it was very good indeed.

 

Gaz

[Richf]

I'm averaging about 36mpg out of TSI DSG estate I reckon it will always be about 10mpg worse than the diesel but by the time you add up the difference in fuel its not as much as you think

 

Based on 37500 miles over 3 years you'll spend approx £5678 on petrol or £4076 on diesel (based on 36mpg and 46mpg) so about £1500 difference or £41 pm. The petrol is cheaper to buy so and all other things are about the same ie servicing and road tax.

 

If you are really concerned about resale why not buy a pre reg or year old one ?

 

Personally if i was in the market for a diesel (God forbid! ) I'd be looking at the scout rather than the VRS

[JPH0091]

I was not refering to the recent VW affair.

Already in France, the diesel sales are dropping since beginning of this year.

They remain above 50% (diesel were up to 78% in past years) only because of company cars sales.

 

Private sales are already petrol sales in majority, which is very questionable for the welfare of diesel used car market in 2 to 3 years.

 

It's becomming public knowledge even before the VW affair that pollution by diesel cars is highly underestimated in homologation protocols, and many cities have started a policy of progressively forbid access to diesel engines.

As for petrol cars, except for the well known since years CO2, I don't see a potential for a bashing.

[Gaz]

Sorry JPH - I was agreeing with you, not contradicting you.

 

By saying 'better resale', I was quoting Pipsy's post #9 - just above yours.

 

G

[Ootohere]

What about the Excellent Seat Leon Cupra 290 ST?  Not enough room?

 

Bargains on there way no doubt at Skoda & Seat Dealership before October is out.  Even more so at VW & Audi UK Dealerships.

Worth just holding off a little.

 

...............................

This might be a diesel, but it should be a good one.

An Estate would be Good,

but Seat , VW & Audi already have them, and they might well become better value as the VWG need to reduce prices.

http://blogs.praguepost.com/technology/49954-skoda-announces-new-4x4-octavia-rs-diesel-model

 

[Gaz]

What about the Excellent Seat Leon Cupra 290 ST? 

 

 

Judas!  :p

 

Gaz

[pipsyp]

I was not refering to the recent VW affair.

Already in France, the diesel sales are dropping since beginning of this year.

They remain above 50% (diesel were up to 78% in past years) only because of company cars sales.

Private sales are already petrol sales in majority, which is very questionable for the welfare of diesel used car market in 2 to 3 years.

It's becomming public knowledge even before the VW affair that pollution by diesel cars is highly underestimated in homologation protocols, and many cities have started a policy of progressively forbid access to diesel engines.

As for petrol cars, except for the well known since years CO2, I don't see a potential for a bashing.

I cant see that being a total diesel ban.....it will be older diesels without modern emissions control equipment that wouldnt meet a certain EU criteria I expect.

Anyway trains are generally diesel electric as are the majority of modern buses and some lorries. All that will happen is diesel tech will improve to the point where they emit less NOx and barely any soot...then everyone will stop moaning.

I personally get cross whenever I see an older diesel car on the road throwing out lots of smoke/soot as its these things that are the real source of the problem.....though it could be argued these people are probably burning much less fossil fuels than the petrol burning equivalents.

Also lets face it....remember the days it was still acceptable to burn leaded petrol.....really wasnt so long ago and has probably served to kill its share of people as have the dangerous hydrocarbons petrols still emit. Petrol v diesel is really a futile argument, they are both bad for us and the planet and in many respects as bad as eachother.

Improvements in electric vehicle range, biofuel development or hydrogen cell tech will at some point bury both petrol and diesels but that time is still some way off.

Leon Cupra 290 ST...nice car, still 30-odd K, arguably not quite so nice as an R estate and will be worth alot less after 3 years....each to their own though.

Edited 27 September, 2015 by pipsypreturns

[JPH0091]

I cant see that being a total diesel ban.....it will be older diesels without modern emissions control equipment that wouldnt meet a certain EU criteria I expect.

Anyway trains are generally diesel electric as are the majority of modern buses and some lorries. All that will happen is diesel tech will improve to the point where they emit less NOx and barely any soot...then everyone will stop moaning.

I personally get cross whenever I see an older diesel car on the road throwing out lots of smoke/soot as its these things that are the real source of the problem.....though it could be argued these people are probably burning much less fossil fuels than the petrol burning equivalents.

Also lets face it....remember the days it was still acceptable to burn leaded petrol.....really wasnt so long ago and has probably served to kill its share of people as have the dangerous hydrocarbons petrols still emit. Petrol v diesel is really a futile argument, they are both bad for us and the planet and in many respects as bad as eachother.

Improvements in electric vehicle range, biofuel development or hydrogen cell tech will at some point bury both petrol and diesels but that time is still some way off.

Leon Cupra 290 ST...nice car, still 30-odd K, arguably not quite so nice as an R estate and will be worth alot less after 3 years....each to their own though.

 

This is 30 years now we are told that diesel engines will be improved.

 

I don’t know if this will be effective or not, but started this September, diesel vehicles are progressively forbidden in Paris. This should be completed in 2020 for all diesel cars, whatever the homologation class.

 

Electric vehicles…  except in France where we have 75% of nuclear electricity, and maybe in northern countries with their hydro-electricity,  this is only displacing the CO2 emission from the car exhaust to the power plant producing the electricity. And the final balance is worse than a petrol car… at least until we get rid of petrol gas and coal for power plants.

 

I guess other solutions will come with time, as you mentioned.

 

In the meantime, I do believe the statement that diesel and petrol are both bad, is just a way to hide that one is far worse than the other.

[Ootohere]

Seat Leon Cupra Estate DSG with real money under £27,000  & they will be getting cheaper.

Seat Leon X-perience DSG under £25,000 and likewise it is what you can buy them for, not what the RRP says.

[Richf]

This is 30 years now we are told that diesel engines will be improved.

 

I don’t know if this will be effective or not, but started this September, diesel vehicles are progressively forbidden in Paris. This should be completed in 2020 for all diesel cars, whatever the homologation class.

 

 

I understood only the worst most polluting diesels were being restricted and then on a rolling scale by 2020 only post 2011 cars on the road , of course its being reported in various scaremongering ways

 

http://www.mnn.com/green-tech/transportation/blogs/paris-bans-diesels-and-restricts-traffic

[Skodev]

Can't comment on the financials as it depends on private buyer, PCP, finance etc etc. But from personal experience, my TDI manual estate has been an absolute joy since delivery 5 weeks ago. You'll not need much more for "real world" driving. But agree, neither Powerplant will leave you wanting. Personally a manual is still the only way to go for a more involved drive. But that's JUST me, before any DSG'ers take offence. Ha ha!!

[JPH0091]

I understood only the worst most polluting diesels were being restricted and then on a rolling scale by 2020 only post 2011 cars on the road , of course its being reported in various scaremongering ways

 

http://www.mnn.com/green-tech/transportation/blogs/paris-bans-diesels-and-restricts-traffic

 

The Mayor clearly mentioned all diesel, when she spoke in different instances. But indeed, it can be questionned if it will go that far.