VW Emissions Scandal Thread V2

[Sad555]

BBC new today that South Korea have banned the sale of VW cars,well 80 models for now

[Ryeman]

BBC new today that South Korea have banned the sale of VW cars,well 80 models for now

Probably a protectionist measure and an convenient excuse

[Ryeman]

The EU's messy and questionable VW compo situation

http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1105316_eu-consumer-groups-pressure-vw-for-diesel-cheat-compensation-in-europe

[lol-lol]

Probably a protectionist measure and an convenient excuse

 

Since we (well the EU) have a recent trade agreement with South Korea it is a dangerous thing to start putting non-tariff barrier and especially for a firm ie Hyundai/Kia that has been so largely fined in the US for mis-leading fuel consumption figures (and therefore emissions one would think logically). 

Edited 3 August, 2016 by lol-lol

[Ryeman]

The techniques Korea used enabled them to develop their auto industry to one of Japanese comparability........it was state policy rather than the playing off against each other that transnational shareholder owned corporations that we had.

[lol-lol]

The techniques Korea used enabled them to develop their auto industry to one of Japanese comparability........it was state policy rather than the playing off against each other that transnational shareholder owned corporations that we had.

 

The Cheabols (I recall from my Open University course on Asian-Pacific Economics course).

 

http://lexicon.ft.com/Term?term=chaebol  

[Ryeman]

No matter what system is adopted, the rich simply get richer and the wealth gap wider; particularly in Australia which doesn't even have estate/death duties to even reduce the rate of disparity.

Academia won't complain either for their own selfish reasons.

If you're poor, you're on your own.

[TallAds]

Could someone help me to understand? There are lots of news articles out there, but they all seem a bit dated now on the actual emissions issue, more focused on the deal being agreed for the yanks.

 

At the current moment, my car does or does not meet Euro5 standard with the cheating software installed?

 

If it does currently not meet Euro5 standard, when Skoda remove the cheating software and load their new magic software, it will meet Euro5 emission standard, and in no way affect performance, economy or reliability? Anyone think this is actually possible?

 

Has anyone with a car on finance complained to VWFS? From my perspective the vehicle they are supplying does not meet the spec it was sold as and I don't really want to keep it. Skoda have had a more than reasonable opportunity to fix the issue (nearly 12 months now). I haven't heard anything from them in months, and the last thing I heard was a letter tell me to sit tight?

[Ootohere]

It meets Euro 5 Emissions as it was tested, and if it is as it left the factory it is legal in the UK /EU and if there is anything to pay in VED then VWG are paying it to the HMRC.

 

If you do nothing then nothing changes, and if the VWG offer to 'update your vehicle' with a fix to remove a Defeat Device then it is your choice 

if you have it done, and if they offer it and you accept and there is some adverse affect on the vehicle you can hold them responsible.

 

When they ask you to sign anything you ask them to give the terms and conditions and sign the contract with you.

[Ootohere]

http://skoda.co.uk/owners/dieselinfo

If in doubt ask them because their communications department is rubbish and they started off all, 

'Owners are important, our priority', then they they forget customers that paid money out and spend on advertising to get new customers spending buying and being treated like Mushrooms.

Edited 5 August, 2016 by GoneOffSKi

[Breezy_Pete]

Could someone help me to understand? There are lots of news articles out there, but they all seem a bit dated now on the actual emissions issue, more focused on the deal being agreed for the yanks.

 

At the current moment, my car does or does not meet Euro5 standard with the cheating software installed?

 

If it does currently not meet Euro5 standard, when Skoda remove the cheating software and load their new magic software, it will meet Euro5 emission standard, and in no way affect performance, economy or reliability? Anyone think this is actually possible?

 

Has anyone with a car on finance complained to VWFS? From my perspective the vehicle they are supplying does not meet the spec it was sold as and I don't really want to keep it. Skoda have had a more than reasonable opportunity to fix the issue (nearly 12 months now). I haven't heard anything from them in months, and the last thing I heard was a letter tell me to sit tight?

 

As delivered, your car met EU5 standard, but did so by cheating on the test. Whether that means it was/is compliant with EU5 is a matter of whether or not the cheating was or wasn't within the written rules of the testing. As they appear not to have submitted cars for testing without the detection/cheating, we don't really know if they'd have passed without it.

 

You'd imagine that detecting when a test was occurring and running different 'cleaner' software during - and only during - the testing would be against the rules, but AFAIK no EU country is actually mounting a legal case against VW like the US is? So maybe the rules for EU5 testing aren't as clear-cut as the US ones?

It's not clear to me whether the EU as a group of countries has a legal framework to act 'as the EU' against VW, or whether it would be up to each member state.

 

Presumably  ( ) ,  the re-programmed cars meet the test specification without having to detect the test and run a special mode, otherwise the 'governing body' (whoever that is) of the testing wouldn't say that the cars had now passed the standard and that VAG could use this new software in cars on the road?

 

 

To sum up: "nobody knows except VAG and the testing authorities".

 

I personally don't think it likely that all 3 of "performance, economy or reliability" could remain unaffected by the re-program; but certainly on the last one, only time will tell (by bulk comparison of cars with/without re-programmed ECUs).

[Ootohere]

A bit like peoples understanding of UREA but different,

VW confusing with spin and lots of P155.

Edited 5 August, 2016 by GoneOffSKi

[Ryeman]

The German magazine Bild claims VAG's 3L had a 22 minute cheat (the test was measured to last 20 mins) .......you get the drift?

Yep, it switched off after 22 mins running.

http://www.autonews.com/article/20160808/VIDEO/308089934/first-shift-triple-cheat-at-audi?cciid=email-autonews-firstshift

Edited 8 August, 2016 by Ryeman

[Ootohere]

And they report that Lower Saxony are not going to sue them selves for being in on the fact that they earned lots from being part of the '3 monkeys' and be deaf dumb and blind to any corruption within a Corporation they have major shareholdings in.

Bavaria seems to be happy enough to go along to the courts though.

 

In the UK the Transport Minister that was as much use as a Chocolate Teapot gets a Knighthood and is also now the 

Chairman of the Conservative and Unionist party.

So that about sums up the UK response to VW cheats and liars, act just like them, carry on regardless, put the incompetents in charge, those that miss what happens around them, never ask the important questions, it all will blow over.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patrick_McLoughlin

Edited 8 August, 2016 by GoneOffSKi

[punyXpress]

Do you mean: " B.M.W. seems to be happy enough to go along to the courts though. " ?

[Ootohere]

I mean the Bavarian Federal State in Germany are talking sueing VW.

Maybe they will sue BMW if they have cost them money, but i doubt that.

[Ryeman]

U.S. consumer advocates want more buyback money per car

'analysts' expect fix will involve lower power and economy

http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1105421_consumer-reports-urges-higher-vw-diesel-buyback-amounts

[lol-lol]

U.S. consumer advocates want more buyback money per car

'analysts' expect fix will involve lower power and economy

http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1105421_consumer-reports-urges-higher-vw-diesel-buyback-amounts

 

More money might be due because of the emotional distress that many people might ha e bought the VW cars for eco-friendliness on the back of the US Clean Diesel campaign and then found that its emissions were far worst than initially thought due to the VW cheat at the emission tests and therefore the emotional distress caused by this could/should be another chuck of money additional to any valuation of pure loss of resale value.  It would certainly bother me if I had be conned in that way and I would expect thousands of dollar in addition to the straight forward valuation adjustment so I could then go and buy a petrol-hybrid or EV car or make up for the true environmental and public health damage that had occurred by me driving a VW diesel over however many miles.   

[Ryeman]

They are well into emotional distress compensation alright.

[lol-lol]

They are well into emotional distress compensation alright.

 

 

I would want at least an amount equal to the perceived valuation drop as an emotional damages portion so if it was $7K for the value then another $7K of that so I could put it against a Ford Fusion, Chevy Volt  or sadly a Japanese petrol-hybrid which dominate the US market as it does here.

 

 

  

[2SkodaFamily]

A couple of people at work have had their cars "fixed", but it's too soon to tell yet if it affects power or economy in real world situations.

[Drspankle]

I think this is the way forward - it's a petition to make VW UK pay up.

 

https://you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/make-vw-pay-for-their-corporate-fraud

 

They have already in the US to the tune of $10k!  I don't see why they should get away with it in the UK ...

 

Regards,

 

Dr Spankle

[Ryeman]

Apparently the U.S. FTC has had to warn VW dealers not to mislead owners about buyback offer amount.......!

http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1105521_ftc-warns-vw-dealers-not-to-mislead-owners-about-buybacks

FTC

https://www.consumer.ftc.gov/blog/vw-owners-get-facts

[Tony R]

I took up the offer from a firm of solicitors FOR COLLECTIVE ACTION but have not heard from them for ages, so much so I can't even remember who they are! Has anyone heard from their solicitors on the question of compensation now that the supposed corrections are underway from V A G. My solicitors haven't even given advice re the pros and cons if the " corrections " are carried out, which I have not agreed to yet despite having received THE letter from Skoda.

[Ryeman]

My bet is that every vehicle had the cheat but it was only needed for the U.S. test .

VW said (ISTR) that the illegality was confined to the U.S. and that's why owners, in other markets, won't actually need or qualify for compensation, meaning no effect on performance or economy.

Time will tell though.