VW Emissions Scandal Thread V2

[Ootohere]

http://fortune.com/2016/09/05/eu-volkswagen-emissions-tests

Lets see how the VW Group or the CEO can spin this in a positive way.

He can tell us how they are going Electric, Green and honest and they have learned a lesson and have just done

nothing much in nearly a year other than attempt ro pay off and appease the USA

Edited 5 September, 2016 by GoneOffSKi

[Tony R]

http://fortune.com/2016/09/05/eu-volkswagen-emissions-tests

Lets see how the VW Group or the CEO can spin this in a positive way.

He can tell us how they are going Electric, Green and honest and they have learned a lesson and have just done

nothing much in nearly a year other than attempt ro pay off and appease the USA

Thanks for the above, I have sent the link to the lawyers ( Leigh Day ) to see if they know about it, and what they intend to do. I have not heard from them for 6 months and wrote a few days asking what has been happening.

[Ryeman]

Post Brexit, are you required to go it alone or as still a member state?.

[Ootohere]

A member state of what the EU?

Post BREXIT will be something like 2 years after artice 50, so that might be 2019.

BREXIT is the UK leaving the European Union  but right now the question appears to be , what does BREXIT mean.

[Tony R]

Post Brexit, are you required to go it alone or as still a member state?.

Brexit has not been effected yet and probably won't be for another 2 years yet, so we are still in, but it would appear lawyers and groups in E U countries are acting as a country and not an E U ensemble. Germany is well ahead apparently, surprisingly.

[Ryeman]

Aussie action by the consumer organisation

http://www.goauto.com.au/mellor/mellor.nsf/story2/0EA48DDEBD949F44CA2580200082D129

[moley]

Renault might stop using diesel engines in cars because it doesn't believe new regs are achievable. 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-37287129

 

 

 

According to French road tests on 100 vehicles, Renault and Nissan cars emit more than eight times the current limits for nitrogen oxide

[Ryeman]

My Pug 1.2 with (soon) a DPF will be the replacement for diesel for Peugeots I suspect.

[lol-lol]

Renault might stop using diesel engines in cars because it doesn't believe new regs are achievable. 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-37287129

 

Absolutely.  I tried both the 1.5d and 0.9 TCE 90 hp engines and I could see no economic, environmental or driving pleasure reason to buy the diesel.

 

This is not so the case on mainland Europe where diesel is a much cheaper fuel so the mainland European governments, and possibly here too, need to make diesel 10-20% more expensive than petrol, by making the excise duty on petrol about 55ppl but raise it on diesel to 65 ppl  to push people over to petrol vehicle usage.

 

Unless one tows, here in the UK, I could not see the point of having a diesel unless one does 40-50k miles per year or tow occasionally.   

 

Even VW tried to move to petrol with more R&D on the TSIs rather than the TDIs but they are always fighting lower costs of diesel on the continent.

 

It must be done to improve air quality in the major cities and whilst fitting SCR, which Skoda have done on the Yeti but not all other Skoda diesels, is still looking like only a partial reduction of NOX/PMs and again seems to not always work fully at the lower ambient temperatures oft experienced in Northern Europe.

 

Government scrappage funded by extra diesel fuel tax seems way forward to reduce the carnage on public health in urban areas. 

[Ryeman]

Bosch in the frame

http://www.thecarconnection.com/news/1105987_lawsuit-bosch-demanded-legal-protections-from-volkswagen-for-developing-defeat-device#src=10065

[Ryeman]

No need for EU compensation VW says

http://fortune.com/2016/09/08/vw-eu-consumer-rules/

[Ootohere]

As VW find out eventually the decision is not theirs.

Also it is odd how the German Authorities get so much say when it should be Brussels and the EU getting on with 

investigations and any actions required against a Manufacturer from a member state.

 

So the fix has been approved for 2 litres and 1.2 litre cars but not for the 1.6 TDI's that seem to be the VW Engine vehicles that owners really are having EGR valve issues with still do not have an approved fix.

I hope owners of these that are having major or even minor issues with Regens and warning lights and costly diagnosis and repairs are keeping receipts and a diary of the issues for when they might get compensation from VW, Skoda, Seat or Audi.

Or at least buy back deals funded by the VW Group.

Edited 9 September, 2016 by GoneOffSKi

[ernieb]

 

Also it is odd how the German Authorities get so much say when it should be Brussels and the EU getting on with 

investigations and any actions required against a Manufacturer from a member state.

 

 

Easy the Germans have the money and they own parts of the VW company one way or another.

[PaveyArk]

The EA189 engineer has pleaded guilty. The court papers (linked within the article) make interesting reading in the extensive cover up:-

Volkswagen engineer charged in emissions probe

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-37320113

Edited 9 September, 2016 by PaveyArk

[Ryeman]

Real world discrepancies

http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1106014_study-suggests-every-european-diesel-maker-cheated-on-eu-tests

[lol-lol]

Real world discrepancies

http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1106014_study-suggests-every-european-diesel-maker-cheated-on-eu-tests

 

And it is real world that we must know the real answers to ie what are the emissions with Mr Fat bloke ie 100 Kgs of me, plus by 25-50kgs of my luggage plus the real world bad traffic conditions as this is the tail pipe emissions going in to our air that we have to breath and not a false lab result which is as relevant as a chocolate teapot.

[Ryeman]

The writing is on the wall with such an emphasis on taking on-road figures seriously.

Diesel was never going to survive once VW brought public attention to the industry's dirty little secret.

[Ootohere]

The Civil case in the Republic of Ireland raised by a diesel car owner against Volkswagen is an interesting one.

Not that i fully understand from media reports where things are going.

 

Obviously VW do not want representatives in court that would need to answer technical and engineering questions.

There was very odd behaviour from who ever the legal representatives were for Volkswagen.

 

Any ruling in a case there going against VW could really put the car among the pigeons.

A European court and a EU Country.

 

As to the wider legal cases around the world, conspiracy, fraud and giving false evidence and trying to destroy evidence 

might just get some senior people in court if there was any of that happening.

Whistle blowers and those doing deals with prosecutors to help reduce any sentences they get will likely 

have more higher up telling all.   We will find out if the early resignations and golden handshakes and being kept on 

as advisers has managed to have them now pleading memory loss, ill health and all the other type of nonsense.

Edited 10 September, 2016 by GoneOffSKi

[lol-lol]

The writing is on the wall with such an emphasis on taking on-road figures seriously.    Diesel was never going to survive once VW brought public attention to the industry's dirty little secret.

 

It might be possible to survive but it needs to be downsized in the same way petrols have it adopt engine capacities under 1 litre, one, two or three cylinder and then be complemented by lecky.

 

If a diesel is able to operate in the relatively narrow temperature range where it can operate where it emissions are acceptable. Air intake pre-heaters, keeping up a level of power output where the emission are OK, ie high enough that the emission systems work and not too high that NOX is produced and it may have a future if it can be done at a reasonable price. 

[Kandy]

Diesel doesn't have a dirty little secret - it is what it is, city air quality is better than it has ever been in the developed world since the middle ages - lowering air quality limits to a point where no cost effective tech. can meet them doesn't make them dirty or bad - that is just the political game being played where objective assessment of the risks no longer matters and is replaced with vacuous irrational emotional appeals and the promulgation of lies/factoids. Ban private diesel cars outright and the air quality limits will still be missed because their emissions are a minority contributor.

 

Neodymium has a very dirty radioactive waste secret, all current EV batteries are nasty, solar PV panels have a toxic wasteland dirty secret, turbines have a bird chopping bat lung exploding dirty secret, solar concentrators have a dirty bird incineration secret. Describing any of these things as green or environmentally friendly is the height of hypocrisy.

[seboni121]

My 1.6 tdi golf mk6 105bhp runs really well, I for one will not be changing it any time soon, no regen issues or dpf either its run on shell vpower nitro+ and mobile esp 1 oil

[lol-lol]

Diesel doesn't have a dirty little secret - it is what it is, city air quality is better than it has ever been in the developed world since the middle ages - lowering air quality limits to a point where no cost effective tech. can meet them doesn't make them dirty or bad - that is just the political game being played where objective assessment of the risks no longer matters and is replaced with vacuous irrational emotional appeals and the promulgation of lies/factoids. Ban private diesel cars outright and the air quality limits will still be missed because their emissions are a minority contributor.

Neodymium has a very dirty radioactive waste secret, all current EV batteries are nasty, solar PV panels have a toxic wasteland dirty secret, turbines have a bird chopping bat lung exploding dirty secret, solar concentrators have a dirty bird incineration secret. Describing any of these things as green or environmentally friendly is the height of hypocrisy.

 

What we have learned in the last couple of years is that light diesels produce levels of NOX and PMs several times higher than measured in their certification tests.

 

Despite a marginal improvement in air quality of the last few decades these pollutants, of which light diesel are a very significant contributor, to around 30,000 premature deaths, 10,000 in London, 500 in Birmingham etc.

 

Scientific consensus has determined the policy to change to Real life emissions measurement rather than lab measurement and Euro7 emissions will be set accordingly to safeguard public health.  

[lol-lol]

My 1.6 tdi golf mk6 105bhp runs really well, I for one will not be changing it any time soon, no regen issues or dpf either its run on shell vpower nitro+ and mobile esp 1 oil

 

What will transpire is a gradual adoption of cities not to allow those diesels which do not meet the Low Emission Zone criteria, either at critical times of air pollution or all times.

 

London is leading the way and then other cities will follow Birmingham, Bristol, Cardiff, Liverpool, Manchester etc then cities in the mid-sized category.  

 

Scrappage schemes I expect will encourage them to be chopped in and replaced by clean vehicles for all city air breathers.  Working at London-Heathrow West London area the air quality monitoring show horrendous results which nobody should have to endure and hundreds of thousands live there and matters need to be urgently addressed.          

Edited 11 September, 2016 by lol-lol

[Ryeman]

Diesel doesn't have a dirty little secret - it is what it is, city air quality is better than it has ever been in the developed world since the middle ages - lowering air quality limits to a point where no cost effective tech. can meet them doesn't make them dirty or bad - that is just the political game being played where objective assessment of the risks no longer matters and is replaced with vacuous irrational emotional appeals and the promulgation of lies/factoids. Ban private diesel cars outright and the air quality limits will still be missed because their emissions are a minority contributor.

 

Neodymium has a very dirty radioactive waste secret, all current EV batteries are nasty, solar PV panels have a toxic wasteland dirty secret, turbines have a bird chopping bat lung exploding dirty secret, solar concentrators have a dirty bird incineration secret. Describing any of these things as green or environmentally friendly is the height of hypocrisy.

And AGW is a "factoid" I suppose?

[Ryeman]

The EA189 engineer has pleaded guilty. The court papers (linked within the article) make interesting reading in the extensive cover up:-

Volkswagen engineer charged in emissions probehttp://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-37320113

More on that from the U.S. source

http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1106036_first-volkswagen-engineer-pleads-guilty-to-diesel-emission-fraud