Those who had SKY HD before F1 went on to SKY got F1HD free

 

I'm on that at the moment, anyone know if I'm due to lose it at some point? If so, I think I'll be waving bye to Sky, it's the only thing keeping me with it tbh.

 

yeah, what did Rosberg do to get booed today?

 

I dunno, the crowd sounded a bit rowdy overall tbh. Boo-ing isnt fair, even more so when they've not done anything wrong. 

There is always a panto style villain in F1. Schumacher, Vettel, Rosberg.

There is always a panto style villain in F1. Schumacher, Vettel, Rosberg.

True, but I just can't see what connects them all.

It was good to see Kimi back on form with radio communications, I think he was my driver of the day.

How long is MV going to be allowed to drive like this?

 

Sooner or later he's going to chop someone at 200mph and the accident will finish in the next county.

 

And the victim may not be as lucky as K-Mag.

 

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/125917/EUR~dangerousEURTM-verstappen-reminds-wolff-of-senna

 

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/125913/raikkonen-verstappen-will-have-massive-crash

Edited 28 August, 20169 yr by camelspyyder

How long is MV going to be allowed to drive like this?

 

Sooner or later he's going to chop someone at 200mph and the accident will finish in the next county.

 

And the victim may not be as lucky as K-Mag.

 

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/125917/EUR~dangerousEURTM-verstappen-reminds-wolff-of-senna

 

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/125913/raikkonen-verstappen-will-have-massive-crash

Well the first article isn't off to a great start because lap 1 turn 1 wasn't his fault, but yes, he's not the first to drive in a risky fashion and he won't be the last. He is very young and in a maturing phase, he will learn. If course I hope that his learning curve isn't at the expense of a big accident, but by the same token you can't punish someone for something that might happen. Have to allow people to race so they can develop. Grosjean came through his year of shunt making just fine and caused a lot more damage than Max has ever done. I think Max will reflect on his late defensive move and take it on board. Like I said earlier it was marginal, but the stewards took no action.

Kimi has his view.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/37210411

They let Crashanado race for long enough.

And Ralf Schuntmaker

At a previous Spa GP Grosjean almost decapitated Alonso.

 

I don't see how "wait until the accident happens and see how bad it is" is a valid way to treat Max right now.

At a previous Spa GP Grosjean almost decapitated Alonso.

I don't see how "wait until the accident happens and see how bad it is" is a valid way to treat Max right now.

So what pray tell do you ban him for? Pushing the limits and being aggressive and competitive? He's a racing driver, it's a dangerous sport by definition.

Grosjean didn't get banned either did he? And he actually caused more than one serious accident...something Max is yet to do. Monaco was a fair shunt but that was his misjudgement, nothing to do with weaving in braking zones or being inherently dangerous. You can think of the early years of many a driver and there has been worse. For all of his (near) mistakes and over defending he's definitely a driver worth having on the grid.

While we're here why don't they not start the next race just in case someone causes an accident? It just can't work like that can it.

Edited 28 August, 20169 yr by YellowCar

So what pray tell do you ban him for? Pushing the limits and being aggressive and competitive? He's a racing driver, it's a dangerous sport by definition.

Grosjean didn't get banned either did he? And he actually caused more than one serious accident.

Grosjean was banned for one race in 2012 for causing a big accident at Spa.

Verstappen is young and talented, but weaving in the braking area in open wheel cars is extremely dangerous, because as we have seen before it can launch cars into the air. More worrying is Verstappen's comments regarding this practice, saying "It's a big lie, I'm just defending my position and if somebody doesn't like it, it's his own problem.

Horner said it was firm. It was on the edge. He got away with it. I'm sure he'll have a good look at it and maybe learn a bit for future races.

Regarding the first corner incident, Horner needs to sit him down and remind him of the first two rules of racing.

1) To finish first, first you have to finish.

2) You can't win a race in the first corner, but you sure can lose it.

Edited 29 August, 20169 yr by moley

I thoroughly enjoyed that race, there was an awful lot going on.

I was somewhat surprised (but very pleased) to see Magnusson climb out, that was a massive shunt.

Rosberg did what was required and drove well, as he often does without someone breathing down his neck. Alonso and Hamilton's drives from the back also excellent.

But Max ... That move to block Kimi on the straight was straight out of a computer game and I believe against the rules that say a defending driver has to pick his line and stick to it. He cannot wait until the following driver makes his move and then block. I believe Kimi was entirely justified in his criticism and Vettel said they would be having words in private. It seems Max has already been on the receiving end in the driver's briefings and I expect he willing get another grilling at Monza.

Speaking of Monza, that should be a straight battle between Rosberg and Hamilton and I am thoroughly looking forward to it.

Grosjesn was banned for one race in 2012 for causing a big accident at Spa.

Verstappen is young and talented, but weaving in the braking area in open wheel cars is extremely dangerous, because as we have seen before it can launch cars into the air. More worrying is Verstappen's comments regarding this practice, saying "It's a big lie, I'm just defending my position and if somebody doesn't like it, it's his own problem.

Horner said it was firm. It was on the edge. He got away with it. I'm sure he'll have a good look at it and maybe learn a bit for future races.

Regarding the first corner incident, Horner needs to sit him down and remind him of the first two rules of racing.

1) To finish first, first you have to finish.

2) You can't win a race in the first corner, but you sure can lose it.

I'm not saying it's not risky to weave in the braking zone. He made his one move, albeit late with an extra twitch. But no harm was done and the stewards cleared it. Seems we both agree that he will look at it and learn from it as I said earlier.

1) and 2) aren't 'rules' of racing, they're approaches. FIA make the rules, and they didn't even investigate turn 1 lap 1. Check the replay again, it wasn't Max's fault anyway, it was Vettel's. Who let's be honest drove like a real plumb for most of the race and nobody is saying anything about that. Let's not jump on the young aggressive driver who still has a lot to learn, but is no doubt extremely talented and smart enough to learn sooner rather than later. I say again, you can't punish someone for something that might happen, or hasn't happened yet. Races are dynamic things with many variables, I suppose there always has to be a scapegoat, Lewis also went through a phase of being branded too aggressive and wreckless and the stewards took action when something actually happened. None of the punishments were based on prediction or assumption and nor should they be. Somebody else could easily do something more dangerous next race and Max does nothing, what will we talk about then?

I'm not saying it's not risky to weave in the braking zone. He made his one move, albeit late with an extra twitch. But no harm was done and the stewards cleared it. Seems we both agree that he will look at it and learn from it as I said earlier.

1) and 2) aren't 'rules' of racing, they're approaches. FIA make the rules, and they didn't even investigate turn 1 lap 1. Check the replay again, it wasn't Max's fault anyway, it was Vettel's. Who let's be honest drove like a real plumb for most of the race and nobody is saying anything about that. Let's not jump on the young aggressive driver who still has a lot to learn, but is no doubt extremely talented and smart enough to learn sooner rather than later. I say again, you can't punish someone for something that might happen, or hasn't happened yet. Races are dynamic things with many variables, I suppose there always has to be a scapegoat, Lewis also went through a phase of being branded too aggressive and wreckless and the stewards took action when something actually happened. None of the punishments were based on prediction or assumption and nor should they be. Somebody else could easily do something more dangerous next race and Max does nothing, what will we talk about then?

Correct they are not 'rules' of racing, but without knowing them you're going no where.

I don't blame Verstappen for the first corner incident, as it was Vettel who was at fault, but Verstappen had put his car into a vulnerable position by diving up the inside of Kimi onto the kerb, Kimi gave him room, but Vettel squeezed Kimi. Had Verstappen stayed back he would not have damaged his front wing and would have still been in the race for a podium.

Verstappen started 2nd and finished 11th. Ricciardo Started 5th and finished 2nd. 

Correct they are not 'rules' of racing, but without knowing them you're going no where.

I don't blame Verstappen for the first corner incident, as it was Vettel who was at fault, but Verstappen had put his car into a vulnerable position by diving up the inside of Kimi onto the kerb, Kimi gave him room, but Vettel squeezed Kimi. Had Verstappen stayed back he would not have damaged his front wing and would have still been in the race for a podium.

Verstappen started 2nd and finished 11th. Ricciardo Started 5th and finished 2nd.

Don't worry I fully understand what happened at turn 1, and as you say you don't blame Max I'm not sure why you actually still are. What Max did was not a problem until Vettel turned in, and he turned in too much. You need to move on from turn 1. Yes he finished 11th due to damage incurred in a racing incident that wasn't his fault. Bad luck. It happens to them all at some point and us no way a negative reflection of his overall talent. Can't blame him for not staying back, he was alongside Kimi, I don't know many drivers who would have backed out of that. If ifs and buts were candy and nuts we'd all have a merry Christmas.

Don't forget it's often the drivers who are branded as aggressive in their early years that go on to be multiple champions and the drivers we all remember.

Apart from Max's weave in the braking zone he didn't actually do much else wrong. Certainly no worse than Vettel. Be careful not to start being over critical and scrutinising his every single turn of the wheel. Yes he shouldn't have moved late, but the stewards overlooked it. Give the young guy a bit of a break.

It isn't a contact sport.

 

Regardless of fault, he hit one of the Ferrari's more than once, and then when it came up behind him tried to run it off the road more than once (as Kimi noted on the radio).

 

I don't want to see anyone hurt, but there is simply no-one else on the grid driving so over-aggressively, although Gutierrez is also a menace for his inability to move over for faster cars.

Mark Hughes (30 year Motorsport and Grand Prix journalist) writing in MotorSport today:

 

 "In fact amid a flurry of incidents he committed the single most dangerous piece of driving seen on track since the days of Schumacher, switching lines on Räikkönen’s Ferrari at over 200mph, forcing Kimi to swerve and brake on a flat-out piece of straight to avoid an accident that would have been long and extraordinarily violent. Remarkably the stewards didn’t see fit to investigate the incident. Less surprisingly, Verstappen admitted no fault."

 

"A few places behind, Verstappen was repelling Räikkönen’s advances very robustly. On the 12th lap Kimi tried for the outside into Les Combes at the end of Kemmel straight, got alongside but was then forced to leave the track as Max banged wheels. After cutting across the run-off apron and emerging ahead, Räikkönen was obliged to give the place back but on the next lap was trying again, getting on the DRS on the Kemmel straight. With a big speed difference, the Ferrari devoured the gap to the Red Bull. Just as we saw in Hungary, Verstappen hovered in the middle of the track and simply waited for Räikkönen to choose a side – and only then chose to go that way too. It was a horrifically dangerous move, forcing Räikkönen, travelling in excess of 210mph, to brake and jink left to avoid what would have been an enormous accident. It didn’t actually break the letter of any regulation and as such wasn’t investigated by the stewards, just underlining how misguided it is trying to encompass every racing situation into a catch-all regulation. It was every bit as lethal as the very similar move Michael Schumacher put upon Mika Häkkinen a few yards further up this piece of track in 2000. “I’m fine with good hard racing,” said Räikkönen, “but if I have to brake on the straight at 340kph so as not to hit someone, then something is not correct. For whatever reason the stewards said it was OK. There will be a massive accident some day. Maybe he needs an accident before things are more clear to everyone.”"

Edited 29 August, 20169 yr by camelspyyder

Don't worry I fully understand what happened at turn 1, and as you say you don't blame Max I'm not sure why you actually still are. What Max did was not a problem until Vettel turned in, and he turned in too much. You need to move on from turn 1. Yes he finished 11th due to damage incurred in a racing incident that wasn't his fault. Bad luck. It happens to them all at some point and us no way a negative reflection of his overall talent. Can't blame him for not staying back, he was alongside Kimi, I don't know many drivers who would have backed out of that. If ifs and buts were candy and nuts we'd all have a merry Christmas.

Don't forget it's often the drivers who are branded as aggressive in their early years that go on to be multiple champions and the drivers we all remember.

Apart from Max's weave in the braking zone he didn't actually do much else wrong. Certainly no worse than Vettel. Be careful not to start being over critical and scrutinising his every single turn of the wheel. Yes he shouldn't have moved late, but the stewards overlooked it. Give the young guy a bit of a break.

I am not saying that the turn 1 incident was Verstappen's fault, what I am saying is that he put his car into a position that was likely to cause damage to his own car. He needs to play the percentages and learn that it's not always important to win every corner, sometimes back off, come out of the corner unscathed and take the fight to the other driver. Kimi had passed Verstappen due to his poor start, which is why Verstappen tried his luck up the inside. Had he hung back I believe he would have finished second in the race.

My only criticism of Verstappen is the weaving approaching Les Coombes. He did force Kimi wide in Les Coombes on an earlier lap, but I would put that down as a racing incident. 

Aggression is OK as long as the driver does nothing dangerous and gives the other driver enough room.

Mark Hughes (30 year Motorsport and Grand Prix journalist) writing in MotorSport today:

 

 "In fact amid a flurry of incidents he committed the single most dangerous piece of driving seen on track since the days of Schumacher, switching lines on Räikkönen’s Ferrari at over 200mph, forcing Kimi to swerve and brake on a flat-out piece of straight to avoid an accident that would have been long and extraordinarily violent. Remarkably the stewards didn’t see fit to investigate the incident. Less surprisingly, Verstappen admitted no fault."

100% agree with this.

I guess this item will be raised at the drivers briefing at Monza. If Verstappen pulls a similar stunt on a Ferrari and causes a crash in Monza he might need an armed guard to get out of the circuit.

I winced when Max blocked Kimi on the kemmel straight that would have been a huge crash. Glad to see K-Mag get out unscathed, just shows how safe those cars really are. Roll on Monza and just once i would love to see Rosberg starting at the back to see how far up he can get. I wonder if Max v both Ferraris will continue, he seems to be seeing a lot of them recently

It's a fine line. People moan that F1 is boring, no one overtakes, it's not exciting, etc but then you have Max pulling moves off where people say "you can't do that" and he does and gets away with it. It's great to see and the most refreshing thing to happen since Lewis's first year at McLaren. His strength and weakness is his youthful confidence. Great when it works but can look a muppet when it doesn't. He'll learn eventually what he can and can't do but so have all the greats. To stifle and stop him now would be wrong. They are all adults and know the risks. For most if there was no element of risk they wouldn't bother. His move on the straight was borderline as were other moves but all the greats who had the air of ruthlessness about them were like. This isn't new.

Max is 18. Lots are over critical of him. He's doing a lot better than most expected which could be where some of the negativity is coming from. When I was 18 I was still getting to grips driving a 1.4 Astra down country lanes.

I was at Spa and looking at the 40 foot screens it looked that Vettel turned in on his own team mate and Max.  

 

It is Vettel who is beyond the ragged edge and blaming everyone but itself.

 

Surprised me that Kimi did not blame Seb more but then he know his future gravy train would be in doubt if he did with Ferrari.

 

 

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2016/08/28/vettel-blames-verstappen-for-turn-one-collision/

 

The race stewards did not deem the incident to be worthy of investigation and neither Verstappen nor Vettel was punished for the contact. 

Edited 30 August, 20169 yr by lol-lol

I was at Spa and looking at the 40 foot screens it looked that Vettel turned in on his own team mate and Max.  

 

It is Vettel who is beyond the ragged edge and blaming everyone but itself.

 

Surprised me that Kimi did not blame Seb more but then he know his future gravy train would be in doubt if he did with Ferrari.

 

 

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2016/08/28/vettel-blames-verstappen-for-turn-one-collision/

 

The race stewards did not deem the incident to be worthy of investigation and neither Verstappen nor Vettel was punished for the contact.[/size] 

Like I said earlier Mr. Angry (Vettel) drove like a plumb all race, was at fault for turn 1 lap 1, and for a man of his experience was very sketchy and nobody has said naff all about it.

The Old Boys Club supposedly respect the other old boys and their racing errors now that they are all older and lucky in some cases to still be in F1.

Many still there because they made so much money when they were just as new and fresh and really trying and with better reactions.

 

Time some more moved on from F1 and let the real talent get racing the latest technology.

Kimi protests too often and those out bursts should be towards Sebastian quite often.