Stop/Start

[wyx087]

I don't think Keith's car is faulty. I've driven FL model 1.6 TDI DSG with same behaviour: cutting out just before coming to a stop.

 

 

TBH, this whole stop/start business is a bodge. It is a bodge to try to reduce emissions. Same with most hybrid cars, bodge together 2 systems trying to make it work for the marketing team. Only hybrid cars not a bodge are Toyato hybrids where the whole gearbox is completely re-designed for hybrid.

[Ootohere]

Do you include the VW Golf GTE & Audi E-tron models in that?

Just a bodged up VW Parts special!

 

Edited 11 October, 2017 by Headinawayoffski

[fabdavrav]

One of the first things I did with VCDS was alter the operating parameters (temp or voltage) to make it N/A....

 

Hate it, got to keep foot on clutch all the time...

 

Autohold reacts quick enough but the S/S..no way...well it is trying to start up again..

 

Plus its a good way to knacker the starter & electrical systems....

[Ootohere]

?

Are the failures of the starter and electrical systems of the earliest vehicles with Stop / Start and even later vehicles now a common occurrence, 

as common as Water Pumps premature failings with VW Group engines?

Edited 11 October, 2017 by Headinawayoffski

[lux4zg]

For me, worst thing ever, mainly because it can't be good for engine, especially for turbos...  Best thing for turbine is to leave it to cool down after you drive at higher revs for longer period, before turn off engine ... And start stop systems does completely opposite and turn engine off immediately when you stop at traffic light or parking... 

 

So i think that turbines can't last long with S&S function ON

 

13 hours ago, fabdavrav said:

One of the first things I did with VCDS was alter the operating parameters (temp or voltage) to make it N/A....

 

Hate it, got to keep foot on clutch all the time...

 

Autohold reacts quick enough but the S/S..no way...well it is trying to start up again..

 

Plus its a good way to knacker the starter & electrical systems....

 

Is it safe to change this parameters??  For sure they effect to some other parameters and functions in car, not only for S&S 

[Ootohere]

Sales reps,  commuters and light delivery goods vehicles have had turbo petrol and diesels for decades and get where going and stop and turn off the engine. In town deliveries even with light goods vehicles. Luckily modern engines and turbos are designed for drivers getting on with life, and not just for taxis and sitting with engines running waiting for a fare..  But then the Octavia does have that covered as well. 

Edited 12 October, 2017 by Headinawayoffski

[fabdavrav]

2 hours ago, lux4zg said:

 

Is it safe to change this parameters??  For sure they effect to some other parameters and functions in car, not only for S&S 

 

Yes, mine is ok after nearly 3yrs....

 

Many people around the world have done this mod with VCDS on Octavia & Golf..no problems....no fault codes

 

[Trebor77]

I turn it off immediately after starting the engine

[io1901]

Never turn it off - but the Octavia is a manual so have more control - the BMW is an auto but if you push the selector to (S)port it disables the stop/start and I use this for those places where a stop  would be undesirable. e.g. at a junction where you will have to "nip" out.

[lux4zg]

3 hours ago, fabdavrav said:

 

Yes, mine is ok after nearly 3yrs....

 

Many people around the world have done this mod with VCDS on Octavia & Golf..no problems....no fault codes

 

 

Great, i think that will be my first mod when car comes... 

 

Thanks!

[MattChr]

Mine does cut out, when I am decelerating and for the last metre or so. Was a little odd losing power steering, but something I got used to pretty quick.

 

TBH I wish I could disable the camera detecting cars moving in front before I do. A strange habit here where the braindead are constantly nudging forward but nowhere to go (red light, queue not moved ahead etc). Damn irritating they move a tiny bit forward, which starts my engine again but nowhere to move to!

[Keith64]

On 11/10/2017 at 19:41, dunc69 said:

Keith, I suspect yours was faulty.

 

Mine, with DSG, doesn’t do this. 

Quite possibly, but I'm not taking any chances now. Car is a pleasure in traffic now its disabled.

[alancha]

I'm glad it's not just me.  I always turn it off when I start - if I remember - or the first time it kicks-in en route.  

 

I've nothing against having the engine stopped while stationary, but I don't the rattly sound of the engine restarting (vRS diesel).

 

But the worst thing, which happened a few times before I got into the habit of disabling it, is that it can get confused in a situation where I've just come to a halt but then need to move off immediately before the engine has stopped.  In this situation, even though I've pressed the clutch and selected 1st gear, start/stop seems determined to go ahead and stop the engine ("I've started, so I'll finish"), leaving me to wait for the engine to stop and start again before I can move off.  I suppose it's only a couple of seconds' delay, but it's very frustrating and could perhaps be dangerous if I was trying to pull out into a small gap in heavy traffic.

 

Earlier this year I had a rental car in the US - a Chevrolet Impala - that had start/stop, and I must say it was absolutely fine.  Maybe it's better on automatics, or at least torque-converter autos, or maybe their implementation was better, but I was quite happy with that one.

[themanwithnoaim]

Hmmmm, I told the dealers to get the PDI mech. to turn off both the sound generator & the stop/start, glad to say he was more than competent.

[juan27]

On 13/10/2017 at 13:09, alancha said:

 

But the worst thing, which happened a few times before I got into the habit of disabling it, is that it can get confused in a situation where I've just come to a halt but then need to move off immediately before the engine has stopped.  In this situation, even though I've pressed the clutch and selected 1st gear, start/stop seems determined to go ahead and stop the engine ("I've started, so I'll finish"), leaving me to wait for the engine to stop and start again before I can move off.  I suppose it's only a couple of seconds' delay, but it's very frustrating and could perhaps be dangerous if I was trying to pull out into a small gap in heavy traffic.

 

 

I find it pretty much a conscious decision to take the car out of gear to make the engine stop on the manual car. I wouldn't really take the car out of gear and take my foot of the clutch unless I know I'm going to be stationary for a bit, traffic light turned red for example. I can't imagine the small gap scenario you describe...are you saying you always take the car out of gear at a T junction /roundabout before even looking if there's an opportunity to pull out? Are you coasting up to the give way in neutral? Sorry if I'm missing something. 

 

Early days but for me it does what it says on the tin on the manual gearbox, and I've found S/S much more of an issue on automatics where the car literally makes all the decisions.  For me that is where I find the car stopping the engine just when you wouldn't have, (like the pulling out at a junction scenario).

 

Batteries on S/S cars are expensive and judging by the 3 year warranty on a £300 Bosch I priced up, not expected to last long. That seems the most compelling reason to avoid using S/S for me.

[Ootohere]

The Long Term costs of replacing vehicle hardware or consumables like a battery will be different for those spending a lot of money buying a car as a keeper / long term ownership 

or those just spending a few thousand a year renting the car for 2 or 3 years and handing it back.

Then there are those that buy and pay for fuel and those that drive vehicles for their job and the employer pays the fuel.

[S00perb]

14 minutes ago, Headinawayoffski said:

The Long Term costs of replacing vehicle hardware or consumables like a battery will be different for those spending a lot of money buying a car as a keeper / long term ownership 

or those just spending a few thousand a year renting the car for 2 or 3 years and handing it back.

Then there are those that buy and pay for fuel and those that drive vehicles for their job and the employer pays the fuel.

Major difference indeed.

We just replaced a car we bought for £4500 16 years ago (less than £24 a month!). It was 3 years old when we bought it. Cost apart from fuel was 2 batteries, oil, a few filters, brake pads, sparks plugs, 2x cam belt and tyres

I did all the servicing (usually way longer between its service schedule than it should have been)

Never broke down. It changed its own oil in the last few years (well I had to top it up!)

Only got rid due to emissions. Just couldn't get it through its MOT

Honda Civic 181,000 - petrol 1998-2017 RIP

 

[alancha]

5 hours ago, juan27 said:

 

I find it pretty much a conscious decision to take the car out of gear to make the engine stop on the manual car. I wouldn't really take the car out of gear and take my foot of the clutch unless I know I'm going to be stationary for a bit, traffic light turned red for example. I can't imagine the small gap scenario you describe...are you saying you always take the car out of gear at a T junction /roundabout before even looking if there's an opportunity to pull out? Are you coasting up to the give way in neutral? Sorry if I'm missing something. 

 

Well it hasn’t happened for a long time as I almost always remember to turn S/S off these days.  But , from what I remember, I think what happened was that i came to a red traffic light, stopped, put the car in neutral and then released the clutch.  At this point start/stop would make the decision to stop the engine, but at just this moment the lights start to turn, so I press the clutch and select first gear ready to move off.  I would expect that pressing the clutch would cause it to abandon its decision to stop the engine, but it seems it doesn’t - at least not always.  In this scenario, i would have to wait while the engine stopped and restarted before i could move off.

 

Youre right - it wouldn’t have happened at a give-way junction or roundabout as i would always be in gear ready to move off as soon as there was an opportunity.