1 hour ago, xman said:

However Octavia 3 does not have EPB, just a conventional handbrake.

As there is a warning light when handbrake is applied, it wouldn't have been rocket science for programmers to release the DSG Clutches.

 

I don't know of any dual clutch box that works that way with manual handbrake.

 

I suppose it's due to the risk of roll back or similar if you are in Drive but on a manual cable brake.

It means that, if your brake assist is unavailable for some reason, you can still do a hill start. 

Also it makes the DSG behave more like an old fashioned auto. What's wrong with that?

33 minutes ago, TDIum said:

It means that, if your brake assist is unavailable for some reason, you can still do a hill start. 

Also it makes the DSG behave more like an old fashioned auto. What's wrong with that?

 

Only convenience. On DSG's with autohold you don't have to sit with your foot on the brake while stationary or select N and use the handbrake.

On most conventional autos you can sit in Drive with the handbrake on or using autohold.

 

Not a biggie but just one of the cost cutting things with the Octy3. The Golf got EPB and autohold as well as the later Leon I believe. 

13 hours ago, xman said:

Only original factory extended warranty bought at time of first registration covers DSG comprehensively. 

As you have said "all components warranty" and your car is 2013 vintage, this looks as if it's the Skoda finance extended warranty, an aftermarket insurance product. Clutches are specifically excluded from the warranty as a wear and tear item.

In the case of your DQ200, the clutch pack is not inside the gearbox, but external in a similar way to a manual clutch, ie between flywheel and gearbox input shaft.

This Skoda Extended Warranty was taken out after the 3 year warranty expired. The wording for what they won't cover is "Renewal of any clutch components due to wear and tear, misuse or incorrect adjustment."

  Wear & tear I accept, but it's much easier to misuse a manual clutch than an auto & incorrect adjustment is something I have no control over. 

Of course I hope I never have to use this insurance.

 

12 minutes ago, logiclee said:

On most conventional autos you can sit in Drive with the handbrake on or using autohold.

 

Well I am glad that I know that now. 

43 minutes ago, TDIum said:

 

Well I am glad that I know that now. 

 

Good.

 

And from the bits of info we have for the Octy 4 it looks like it will get EPB and Auto Hold.

 

VW first used the system with DSG in 2005 I believe so it's taken a while to filter down.

Edited 30 July, 20196 yr by logiclee

GF has them both on her 2015 Mk3 TT that is a manual box.

17 hours ago, ords said:

We're talking about auto boxes. I have a Skoda all components warranty & would expect all parts in the gearbox to be covered.  If we're talking about manual boxes then I accept a clutch would not be covered.

You can expect but I wouldn’t bank on it. If it’s natural wear of the clutch plates, most common fault, you will have a battle on your hands. Ford caved in after refusing clutch pack replacement for a long time. To re establish their reputation after 1000’s of dct failures  legally challenged in Australia they agreed to replace clutch packs in original warranty period.  Don’t know if VAG have done same, apparently wear is still an exclusion say people. Only DCT  I have seen apart is a Golf version which had failed solenoids. That should be covered although that one at my sons place was just out of warranty.  The manufacturers stance seems to be its your fault if you wear the clutches out early through allowing it to drag too much in traffic, towing or standing with hand brake on in gear. I was told you must put it into neutral when handbrake is applied by the supplier of mine who has 100’s of them covering about 160k each.  They send them to auction as none runners through dct  if out of warranty and near end of term even though less than 3 years old. And that's quite a lot of cars. 

If anyone cares to check out the 'Famous DQ200 Clutch Slip' thread in the Fabia Mk3 section you will see where VW had to accept some had issues and then had to act and there are TPI's and Software Updates and Clutch Pack Updates.

Sometimes if you do not ask, ask and ask again and then gather evidence and ask again you get jack sh!t out of VW Group.

1 hour ago, teescom09 said:

You can expect but I wouldn’t bank on it. If it’s natural wear of the clutch plates, most common fault, you will have a battle on your hands. Ford caved in after refusing clutch pack replacement for a long time. To re establish their reputation after 1000’s of dct failures  legally challenged in Australia they agreed to replace clutch packs in original warranty period.  Don’t know if VAG have done same, apparently wear is still an exclusion say people. Only DCT  I have seen apart is a Golf version which had failed solenoids. That should be covered although that one at my sons place was just out of warranty.  The manufacturers stance seems to be its your fault if you wear the clutches out early through allowing it to drag too much in traffic, towing or standing with hand brake on in gear. I was told you must put it into neutral when handbrake is applied by the supplier of mine who has 100’s of them covering about 160k each.  They send them to auction as none runners through dct  if out of warranty and near end of term even though less than 3 years old. And that's quite a lot of cars. 

After xman said clutches aren't covered by warranty I did read the exclusions & it says "Renewal of any clutch components due to wear and tear, misuse or incorrect adjustment."

So if the clutches were worn due to incorrect adjustment I could argue that I have no control over the adjustments. Unless they are checked when the car is serviced & I'm advised to have them adjusted.

Hopefully they'll last another year before I sell it.

22 hours ago, logiclee said:

 

The wet clutch box has completely different clutch control and will always have differing levels of drag in Drive. VAG say the wear and heat is negligible if the brakes are fully engaged or in autohold for models with the feature.

 

 

They would say that though lee.......They are not the ones paying the bill when one of the clutch packs wears out are they, lol.

 

 

3 minutes ago, Tilt said:

 

They would say that though lee.......They are not the ones paying the bill when one of the clutch packs wears out are they, lol.

 

 

I've never had an issue with a wet clutch box in 160k miles, 3 cars and 9 years.

Dry clutch box 5 clutch packs replaced in 8 years and all less than 30k miles.

 

Wet clutch box clutch pack failure is rare on the forums.

12 hours ago, logiclee said:

On the wet clutch boxes these will happily slip even when the brakes are fully released, in slow moving traffic they can actually slip in 2nd rather than changing to 1st for smoother progress. This is perfectly OK for lubricated wet clutches.

 

Premature failure of DSG clutchpacks is very rarely down to wear and tear in traffic etc. I've had 5 clutchpacks replaced and all these were under 30k miles.

 

I agree that the gearbox slipping 2nd rather than changing down into 1st is smoother in very slow traffic, certainly it is in my car.

 

Re the premature failure, if not down to wear and tear in traffic then what would be the cause please?? and are you referring to 'wet' or 'dry' clutches, or both.

I had a worry at one point that mine was slipping unintentionally, but that was a few years ago and been ok since...

 

@logiclee Do you agree most folk with a 6 speed wet clutch DSG requiring a new DMF probably do not need new clutches at the same time??? Cheers.

1 hour ago, Tilt said:

I had a worry at one point that mine was slipping unintentionally, but that was a few years ago and been ok since...

 

@logiclee Do you agree most folk with a 6 speed wet clutch DSG requiring a new DMF probably do not need new clutches at the same time??? Cheers.

 

Probably not but if the box is out and stripped and the clutches have to be removed to change the flywheel then I suppose it makes sense to change them.

 

On my Octy 3 DQ200 they approved a flywheel change when they changed the clutch pack but they didn't when they replaced them on the Fabia or Yetis. The replacement clutchpack was intermittently loosing comms and ended up damaging the mechatronics.

I believe the flywheel had been damaged due to the slipping clutchpack.

1 hour ago, logiclee said:

I've never had an issue with a wet clutch box in 160k miles, 3 cars and 9 years.

Dry clutch box 5 clutch packs replaced in 8 years and all less than 30k miles.

 

Wet clutch box clutch pack failure is rare on the forums.

It’s a Getrag DCT box in a Galaxy but mine just had wet clutch packs under warranty  at 95k. And the company where it came from have had many dozens fail. Apparently the newer version has proved far more troublesome than the earlier pfl model. So much so that they are now going elsewhere for cars.  Also due to the fact Ford has dropped the business warranty from 120k 4 years to 60k !! 

5 minutes ago, teescom09 said:

It’s a Getrag DCT box in a Galaxy but mine just had wet clutch packs under warranty  at 95k. And the company where it came from have had many dozens fail. Apparently the newer version has proved far more troublesome than the earlier pfl model. So much so that they are now going elsewhere for cars.  Also due to the fact Ford has dropped the business warranty from 120k 4 years to 60k !! 

 

Ford know they have a heat dissipation issue on the Getrag wet clutch box. They have tried and tried to solve it but high loads for long periods can cause major issues and premature clutch failure.

The box has an appalling reputation amongst the towing/caravanning community. Well known as the judder of death on this box.

 

As you have said in other markets Ford have had to offer extended warranties.

 

Ford are phasing DCT out though.  Most petrol models from Focus upwards have not had DCT for some time and new models will have the new 9 and 10 speed conventional autos.  

17 minutes ago, logiclee said:

 

Ford know they have a heat dissipation issue on the Getrag wet clutch box. They have tried and tried to solve it but high loads for long periods can cause major issues and premature clutch failure.

The box has an appalling reputation amongst the towing/caravanning community. Well known as the judder of death on this box.

 

As you have said in other markets Ford have had to offer extended warranties.

 

Ford are phasing DCT out though.  Most petrol models from Focus upwards have not had DCT for some time and new models will have the new 9 and 10 speed conventional autos.  

Are you sure, all models above new Focus still seem to be Powershift including Transit. 

They don't.

9 hours ago, teescom09 said:

Are you sure, all models above new Focus still seem to be Powershift including Transit. 

 

I said all "new" models above Focus not current models.

 

"Ford are phasing DCT out though.  Most petrol models from Focus upwards have not had DCT for some time and new models will have the new 9 and 10 speed conventional autos.   "

 

The new focus will be conventional auto.

 

Currently the Mondeo etc. gets DCT for Diesel and  conventional auto on 1.5 and 2.0 ecoboost. DCT will be dropped totally for the new model and maybe even for the next facelift.

 

New Ranger will be 10 speed conventional auto.

 

Ford are very open about their plans, DCT will be phased out as production of their 10 speed (Longitudinal) and 9 speed (Transverse) conventional auto ramps up.

Suits me I will never buy another slush box or dct unless cornered ever. a) manual is far better b) manual is far far far more reliable and ad a massive bonus it’s cheaper 😁😁

 

 

Edited 31 July, 20196 yr by teescom09

28 minutes ago, teescom09 said:

 a) manual is far better

 

 

 

Depends what your priorities are though.

 

A stop/start commute for an hour each way and you may redefine that statement.

 

And you also have to be careful with the cheaper statement as a manual in some executive/luxury segments can be a depreciation disaster. Buy with care.

17 minutes ago, logiclee said:

 

Depends what your priorities are though.

 

A stop/start commute for an hour each way and you may redefine that statement.

 

And you also have to be careful with the cheaper statement as a manual in some executive/luxury segments can be a depreciation disaster. Buy with care.

Priorities are a better more pleasurable,  reliable, economical and cleaner car, and  as I said, unless cornered. Managed well enough up to now. 

3 hours ago, teescom09 said:

Suits me I will never buy another slush box or dct unless cornered ever. a) manual is far better b) manual is far far far more reliable and ad a massive bonus it’s cheaper 😁😁

 

 

I will never go back to manual

It will be increasingly difficult to get a manual car, thanks to WLTP forcing manufacturers to heavily rationalize power trains, options etc. Hybrids/EV will be exclusively Auto only. 

 

Add to that the millennial generation that want to text while they drink their latté while they watch the latest love island clip. No hands left for gear changes.

 

VW will like it because their cars will be scrapped much earlier, dealers will love the multi thousand pound repairs for the few that decide to bite the bullet.