On 03/08/2021 at 13:55, stever750 said:

£399 for an APR map sounds suspiciously cheap. Best I can find for my Octy is £650 for APR and £700 for Revo. I can't be bothered at the moment at that price.

Flipping eck really? Revo website is showing £399 + VAT for mine, and then APR is the same. 

 

Only issue is with Revo being a bit further away for me

On 04/08/2021 at 17:11, fabdavrav said:

I have the 1.4lt 140PS version on a manual gearbox & had the revo stage 1-B remap which is for 98RON/99RON fuel...it will run on 95RON as an emergency as required..

 

The Bosch maps for these engines are 95RON with 91RON as an emergency...& we don't get 91RON, so basically the timing is NOT ideal for the UK!

 

They quote circa 190BHP & 312Nm....but its a way better curve & the car can tricky along at 800rpm no problems in a all gears & pick up....before it would virtually stall...plus the electronic wastegate is operating less so its quieter above 3000rpm...

 

Car should have been like this from the factory.

 

P.S. with the latest rules on E10 fuel, which requires the "main" unleaded to be 10% bio...super unleaded isn't required to be ..& remains E5 (5%) bio...

That's great to know. I take it you just run it on 99RON?

 

Interesting to know about the stock map too, so basically it's not worth throwing a tank of super-unleaded in it?

 

Tom

Royal Dutch Shell and Greenery that supply Tesco Momentum and Esso Super Unleaded in much of the UK are partners in importation and storage and distribution in the UK.  As to the additives, detergents and anti foamers etc there is so much nonsense and hype about that and the super unleaded. The 99 or 97 octane with others is the minimum figure you are buying.   Any tanker delivery can **** up deliveries but then it is thousands of litres and hundreds of customers might get fueled wrongly.   As to Royal Dutch Shell as bad fuel there has not been as bad a co-ckup as when they introduced the new Formula and wrecked many an engine.  The bio added will be up to the max figure and not above.      If anyone ever worried about bad fuel being purchased these days there is social media and finding other customers that used the same filling station as you is dead easy now.  Tracking of fuel and any filling stations where the wrong octane goes in tanks is easily found out.  After all the filling stations pay the tax and duty as the fuel is delivered and then the customers are paying tax and duty to them.    I know of  one filling station that during a fuel shortage  sold 95 Ron as Shell V-Power Nitro +, it was not very long until some drivers with cars that so not like running on 95 were back as t the station and demanded refunds, compensation and basically the balls of the greedy aid that owned the place. 

 

EDIT / 2022 update now on E5 Super Unleaded.

 

Edited 8 July, 20223 yr by roottoot

Useful rant. Thanks root.

9 hours ago, TomfromWirral said:

That's great to know. I take it you just run it on 99RON?

 

Interesting to know about the stock map too, so basically it's not worth throwing a tank of super-unleaded in it?

 

Tom

 

Whatever Shell say their V-power is as thats all I have used in my cars since 2002....

 

 

The car on the stock map can make use of the better fuel to a very slight extent as the ECU can adapt within the allowed software limits for the 91/95 timing as remember the camshafts are variable on the 1.4lt..(both on the 140/150PS...mainly though its the fact the car always responds better at higher rpm even if the timing is not 100% ideal for the fuel octane.

 

Basically to get the most out of the engine & the petrol, the timing (spark ignition) needs to be started earlier in the compression cycle the higher the octane rating, which is why revo offer 3 different maps for 3 different main fuels....also they increase the fuel pump settings as the factory software strangles it & yet it will cope with higher demand....

 

Lastly they increase the turbo boost, by not operating the electronic wastegate/rc valve as much...

 

Most tuners only do the last bit & crank up the turbo boost pressure which is useless when the fuel pump & timing are not ideal..

 

 

My old 1.4lt AUB Fabia had 98/95RON on the flap & was factory tuned for super unleaded 98RON..& would take 95RON in an emergency, but with reduced power output. The EA211 1.4lt is 95/91 RON tunned....my revo map is 98/95RON...just like the Golf R & CCS & others..

 

APR for the 1.4lt 140/150PS only map for 95RON & do a high & low torque map offer...nothing for 98RON...

 

For the 122/125PS they offer maps for 95RON or 98RON....

 

Thats another reason to go revo..

Fuel buyers in the UK are often so unaware of what they are buying.  Which depots or ports or refineries it come from. If it is base fuel arriving in the UK or from UK refineries with Cracking Plants.

They might not know when the Spring / Summer formulation is delivered to filling stations in their area or if they have Winter grade which is less hygroscopic and might be higher than the minimum Octane.

The winter grade petrol can sometimes be in the UK filling station tanks later in the spring than in parts of Continental Europe.

 

ESSO Super Unleaded delivered in the UK is not the same formula all over the UK.

 

 

Edited 6 August, 20214 yr by e-Roottoot

All this fuel chat is genuinely interesting and all, but is it just me or do ESSO love ❤ a Vauxhall in their marketing / promos?

 

Like who in their right minds makes the decision that putting a Mokka in the promotion of anything positive in the automotive industry is a good idea...

^^^ They probably know their UK customer base and Mokka were one of the highest sellers or first registration cars, leased to lots of people and owned by Motability and leased out for 3 years.  As are many Vauxhall models.  Millions must drive them and many might go to Esso but do not think BP, Shell, Gulf etc are for them and they would never buy supermarket fuel that is produced by the same supplier as ESSO fuel.

 

Edited 8 July, 20223 yr by roottoot

On 05/08/2021 at 01:41, fabdavrav said:

I have the 1.4lt 140PS version on a manual gearbox & had the revo stage 1-B remap which is for 98RON/99RON fuel...it will run on 95RON as an emergency as required..

 

The Bosch maps for these engines are 95RON with 91RON as an emergency...& we don't get 91RON, so basically the timing is NOT ideal for the UK!

 

They quote circa 190BHP & 312Nm....but its a way better curve & the car can tricky along at 800rpm no problems in a all gears & pick up....before it would virtually stall...plus the electronic wastegate is operating less so its quieter above 3000rpm...

 

Car should have been like this from the factory.

 

P.S. with the latest rules on E10 fuel, which requires the "main" unleaded to be 10% bio...super unleaded isn't required to be ..& remains E5 (5%) bio...

That is the first time I have seen anyone confirm in this forum the 1.4tsi 140bhp fuel standards as 95 RON and 91 RON emergency.

Australian fuels  are a somewhat unique mix. We have a 91RON (max 150ppm sulphur), 95 and 98 RON (max 40ppm sulphur), E10 and E85 and in the outback a special 91 RON substitute called 'Opal'.

The manual and filler cap of my car just says 95RON minimum recommended but I was advised by the dealer early in the ownership to run it on 98RON. I tried a few concurrent tanks of 98 but did not detect any improvement in response or economy so I went back to using the cheaper 95 RON which mine is happy on. I shudder at the thought of putting our 91 RON in.

 

The E10 is a couple of cents a litre cheaper than 91RON and used to be advertised as having a 94RON rating, which would make sense with the ethanol added to the 91RON, but this advertised rating has been dropped. I recently had a look at an E10 bowser and it had a small sticker attached saying that Ethanol content could vary between 0 and 10%!!! Pretty much a backyard operation it seems.

Ironically our government has deemed our last two or three remaining refineries to be strategic assets and have agreed to pay the owners an extortionate amount to stay open and upgrade their facilities to meet EU 10ppm sulphur content standards. It could also mean that 91RON is dropped and 95RON is achieved with 10% ethanol as per the EU and UK. 

Very few road cars can run the E85 ( it was a short fad for Holden, one of our now closed car manufacturers) and they are not optimised for it so they cannot really use the 105RON rating effectively and consumption is reported as being unusually bad although power seems not to be a problem. There are a couple of local racing categories that specify it and the engines are tuned solely for  it.

'Opal' is a BP product with a low 5% aromatics (Tuolene etc) content to combat the incredibly damaging effects of petrol sniffing in aboriginal communities, and it has worked. Expensive to produce but it is subsidised at 33c/litre by our Government. I've seen literature suggesting that engines running it develop far less carbon deposits than standard  91RON but it is not available in metropolitan areas otherwise I'd put some in my 25 year old lawnmower.

 

Edited 6 August, 20214 yr by Gerrycan

1 hour ago, Gerrycan said:

That is the first time I have seen anyone confirm in this forum the 1.4tsi 140bhp fuel standards as 95 RON and 91 RON emergency.

 

 

 

The VAG ERWIN repair manuals for the EA211 engines state it.

 

It may also explain why the base "95RON" stage 1 remap offered by tuners gets a nice hike without increasing the turbo boost by much as the timing gets altered correctly to remove the capability (reduced) of running on 91RON. 

 

 

Edited 6 August, 20214 yr by fabdavrav

On 05/08/2021 at 22:45, TomfromWirral said:

Flipping eck really? Revo website is showing £399 + VAT for mine, and then APR is the same. 

 

Only issue is with Revo being a bit further away for me

If it was iy £400 I might get it done!