Mk3 VRS TDI DSG Estate - 3rd set of brake discs warped

[smokeyshiva]

Mk3 VRS TDI DSG Estate. 

 

This will be the 3rd set of front brake discs I've gone through due to warping. I always clean the mating faces correctly and check for any inconsistency on the inner faces of the discs. 

 

I've now tried 3 different manufacturers, I was gonna try MTEC as I've got some of their discs on my Saxo but doubt they'll be any different..

 

Anyone else had this problem? Is it just because its an auto and I'm always holding the brake on the hills? 

 

Any potential remedies? 

Cheers

[varaderoguy]

I would be look at the calipers sticking and causing overheating.  You might want to get a rebuild kit if you are getting sticking.  The standard Skoda discs are good and should not cause issues.

[Ecomatt]

It all depends how hard you use your brakes. If you brake hard a lot and then hold the brake pedal down whikst waiting rather than apply the handbrake, then warping can occur. 

I would jack your car up and see if you can hear any brake rub. There will naturally be more drag with the dsg so the wheel will not spin like a manual. Also check to see if the brake disc is blueing can be a sign of pads sticking. Then check to see if the slide pins need greasing or changing as they can make the caliper stick.

 

[Guest]

I’m the same here with my VRS petrol DSG. Mine has done it with Padgid discs and pads and now Brembo. As others have said I assume it’s because I use the brakes a lot and then sit with my foot on the brakes at lights at times but I do try and ensure the brakes are cool before doing it or have at least had a chance to cool down. 
 

I changed my front discs and pads in May, and it’s starting to do it again but only slightly. Do other DSG cars suffer from this?

[smokeyshiva]

Just bought some more discs, juratec ones. 

 

Spoke to a couple of different people and they're basically saying yeah, it's automatic and it's gonna happen. It does get driven hard, often with heavy loads in it. 

 

Oh well! Another expense to add to the new dual mass flywheel!

 

Thanks for the responses guys.

[Guest]

Hope these ones last you a bit longer. I’m going to live with mine until I change the car next year and fingers crossed it doesn’t get worse. 

[OldAndyMac]

are they really warped or are you feeling an uneven disc surface due to pad deposits? The results are the same, ie horrible judder under braking but the following article shows that you might be able to fix it with a cheap set of pads. That has to be better than a new pair of discs? Modern discs, especially from a decent manufacturer are unlikely to warp under normal or even hard driving conditions. Track days would be different but then you would be using different setups etc.

 

https://alconkits.com/technical-info/brake-tech/56-the-myth-of-warped-brake-discs 

[HappySam]

7 hours ago, OldAndyMac said:

are they really warped or are you feeling an uneven disc surface due to pad deposits? The results are the same, ie horrible judder under braking but the following article shows that you might be able to fix it with a cheap set of pads. That has to be better than a new pair of discs? Modern discs, especially from a decent manufacturer are unlikely to warp under normal or even hard driving conditions. Track days would be different but then you would be using different setups etc.

 

https://alconkits.com/technical-info/brake-tech/56-the-myth-of-warped-brake-discs 

 

Agreed. It's not the discs. Nigh on impossible to warp discs. Have you replaced the pads each time? Are they OEM? This would seem the most likely cause.

[MATT0693]

It isn't unheard of for discs to warp, but for it to happen several times would suggest an issue or very poor luck!

If you are fitting decent branded products, cleaning the hub face with a wire brush, cleaning and greasing the slide pins, you should have no issues (providing you give them time to bed in)

 

I have seen cheap pads cause material transfer to the disc when hot, sometimes the material transfer isn't removed under normal braking so the discs are scrap. 

If you are holding the car on the brakes with hot pads, this could be the cause. 

 

If you turn the wheel by hand, the pads should not be rubbing the disc, if they are you have an issue with the caliper/sliders.

A local garage will be able to measure the radial run-out for you, or get a DTI gauge online and check it yourself, if the radial runout is within tolerance then it will be the friction surface is scoring or has 'thermal spotting'.

 

If your discs are relatively new, it might be worth checking the warranty period and returning them for inspection, even the cheap motor factor brands offer 2-3 years now.

The supplier will either refund you if they are Chinese as it is not worth the costs, or they will return them for inspection and give you a report as to why they have gone wrong.

 

 

[MeteorOcty]

There is definately an issue here. I have the same car (mk3 estate 2014 diesel dsg) and in my ownership have done 27000 miles and the brakes haven't been touched apart from a fluid change. Definitely sounds like it could be a caliper issue.

[Ootohere]

Different people drive differently and might well get brakes much hotter.  Then there is being stopped and foot on brake pedal or even if they are not one that sits with the brake lights on to the rear for extended time and applying just the parking brake you have AUTOHOLD so the car has applied the front and rear brakes automatically while stationary. 

[EnterName]

22 hours ago, smokeyshiva said:

Mk3 VRS TDI DSG Estate. 

 

This will be the 3rd set of front brake discs I've gone through due to warping. I always clean the mating faces correctly and check for any inconsistency on the inner faces of the discs. 

 

I've now tried 3 different manufacturers, I was gonna try MTEC as I've got some of their discs on my Saxo but doubt they'll be any different..

 

Anyone else had this problem? Is it just because its an auto and I'm always holding the brake on the hills? 

 

Any potential remedies? 

Cheers

I remember seeing a video about this problem. (Can't remember where from. 😞 )

Anyway, the gist is, if you brake hard to a halt, then even if you release the brakes, the disk area under the brake pads doesn't get the opportunity to cool as quickly as the disk exposed to the air, and so with the difference in temperature, warping can occur.

As there's very little clearance, I'm inclined to run with the idea that prrts of the disk will cool at different rates, not sure why that causes warping.

The solution was to slow normally but roll slowly to a final stop, giving the disks a little more time to cool as they slowly rotate just prior to stopping.

Only an issue if you've braked pretty hard prior to stopping.

[Octyvrstdi]

have you by any chance been to the same garage every time?

[smokeyshiva]

Just now, Octyvrstdi said:

have you by any chance been to the same garage every time?

No mate I do most of the work on all my cars 

[Octyvrstdi]

24 minutes ago, smokeyshiva said:

No mate I do most of the work on all my cars 

ah, fair enough, was thinking it may have been a workmanship issue with where you were going, i would ask if you are fully winding back the pistons? as this can be fairly difficult to do fully,

i have a manual and do my own brakes, using brembo discs and pads and have never had a problem, and my car is driven HARD at times,

are your discs vented / drilled? and have you seen the warp of the discs, or is it just the juddering that has clued you in?

 

good luck

[MATT0693]

8 minutes ago, Octyvrstdi said:

ah, fair enough, was thinking it may have been a workmanship issue with where you were going, i would ask if you are fully winding back the pistons? as this can be fairly difficult to do fully,

i have a manual and do my own brakes, using brembo discs and pads and have never had a problem, and my car is driven HARD at times,

are your discs vented / drilled? and have you seen the warp of the discs, or is it just the juddering that has clued you in?

 

good luck

 

 

+1 for Brembo discs.

I have run them on track cars with aggressive pads without issue, they last well for a OEM replacement disc.

At around £100-110 for a set of Brembo discs & pads for an Octy, it is a bit of a no-brainer really. 

 

 

[Octyvrstdi]

46 minutes ago, MATT0693 said:

 

 

+1 for Brembo discs.

I have run them on track cars with aggressive pads without issue, they last well for a OEM replacement disc.

At around £100-110 for a set of Brembo discs & pads for an Octy, it is a bit of a no-brainer really. 

 

 

yeah theyr'e bang on, paid £150 pads & discs from euro car parts

[T07]

I had the same issue with brembo discs. Replaced with trw and had no issues 

[tanneman]

Same here. 3rd set of discs on the front and new pads each time. Only lasts a while and then the warping feel is back. Left it as is. The front suspension has been checked over and all was good. On BMW E46 the play in suspension bushes can give the same symptoms.

 

Use of the car is a 50 mile commute each way with about 45 miles on dual carriage way or motorway.

 

I think the last set is TRW, had Brembo on as well and they all have done it. Will change it again at the next brake fluid change. The 2013 to 2014 VRS models use a bigger brake disc and I suspected that this larger brake disc might be the problem. Looks like the owners on here with the complaint is from the earlier cars.

[Ecomatt]

12 hours ago, tanneman said:

Same here. 3rd set of discs on the front and new pads each time. Only lasts a while and then the warping feel is back. Left it as is. The front suspension has been checked over and all was good. On BMW E46 the play in suspension bushes can give the same symptoms.

 

Use of the car is a 50 mile commute each way with about 45 miles on dual carriage way or motorway.

 

I think the last set is TRW, had Brembo on as well and they all have done it. Will change it again at the next brake fluid change. The 2013 to 2014 VRS models use a bigger brake disc and I suspected that this larger brake disc might be the problem. Looks like the owners on here with the complaint is from the earlier cars.

Have you thought about fitting the RS3 brake ducts? Very cheap and cost about £28. They do actually work and keep the disc and pads nice and cool. The bonus is that they simply zip tie over the arm and are fitted in a matter of seconds.

 

https://www.akstuning.co.uk/shop/home/425-genuine-rs3-8v-brake-ducts.html

[fabdavrav]

On 04/12/2021 at 21:35, Ecomatt said:

Have you thought about fitting the RS3 brake ducts? Very cheap and cost about £28. They do actually work and keep the disc and pads nice and cool. The bonus is that they simply zip tie over the arm and are fitted in a matter of seconds.

 

https://www.akstuning.co.uk/shop/home/425-genuine-rs3-8v-brake-ducts.html

 

Actually they might need to be modified for full clearance of the caliper at full lock in certain suspension loads..they were made for the Audi's which have bigger calipers which are further away from the hub centre.

 

3 .5yrs ago I did the original write up/how to guide here:-

How to retro-fit the front brake air guides from the Audi RS3 (2017->) | GOLFMK7 - VW GTI MKVII Forum / VW Golf R Forum / VW Golf MKVII Forum

 

To the OP I reckon you are suffering from a sticking caliper.....not the piston in the caliper housing, but of the pad ears sticking in the guides & the guide pins (in the rubber boots) between the caliper & the carrier sticking also.

 

You need to strip the caliper of the carrier, (via guide pin bolts), remove the pads, clean up all mating faces & the guides where the pad ears are..then re-grease with Loctite LB8009 (heavy duty) or VAG "hot bolt paste" all the pad back to caliper & pad ear to guide faces..& then remove the guide pins/boots, clean & re-grease the pins..TRW make a specific grease for their calliper guide pins called PFG-110.

 

I had loads of problems before & wrote off a set of discs/pads......now I don't!

 

So info in my posts on this page..

 

VW Golf MK7 Estate, GT spec, Tungsten Silver, 1.4TSI | Page 6 | GOLFMK7 - VW GTI MKVII Forum / VW Golf R Forum / VW Golf MKVII Forum

Edited 6 December, 2021 by fabdavrav
clarity

[Guest]

On 04/12/2021 at 09:18, tanneman said:

Same here. 3rd set of discs on the front and new pads each time. Only lasts a while and then the warping feel is back. Left it as is. The front suspension has been checked over and all was good. On BMW E46 the play in suspension bushes can give the same symptoms.

 

Use of the car is a 50 mile commute each way with about 45 miles on dual carriage way or motorway.

 

I think the last set is TRW, had Brembo on as well and they all have done it. Will change it again at the next brake fluid change. The 2013 to 2014 VRS models use a bigger brake disc and I suspected that this larger brake disc might be the problem. Looks like the owners on here with the complaint is from the earlier cars.

exactly the same here with my VRS. 3rd set, first we’re padgid discs and pads, then it’s done it with the 2 sets of brembo discs and pads I’ve put on. I do mostly motorway miles. I do like a hard drive at times and can be hard on the brakes now and then but not to the extent that I’ve knackered 3 sets of discs and pads. Think I have a further issue here.