Superb 272 Tuning Thread / JB4

[RedLineZ]

Hi,

 

New here, new to Skoda , not new to the MQB EA888 platform :)

 

I have read most threads i could find about tuning the superb here but i need some order as many threads go off-topic and many are incomplete. Most start talking about completely other things. ( My favorite was exhaust valves and their impact on performance... lol)

 

 

272 / 280

 

Does anyone know the exact differences?

Mechanical differences, the "facelift"  details are not relevant to the topic.

 

GPF + DSG7? that's the only difference basically?

They are the same car otherwise?

 

JB4:

 

https://burgertuning.com/products/jb1-jb4-group-1-vag-tuner

 

Same one as on 280? You run the same standard MAP and just tweak it if you get any issues?

Is there any specific firmware or you just get the latest for the JB4 module via their sync software?

 

 

Stage 2 beyond MAP 2 on the JB4

 

All you need is:

1. Intercooler
2. intake

 

That's it? You can go 400hp on this only? That's crazy

No downpipe needed even?

 

 

Results to expect?

Some people write they get 4.6 sec 0-100 and 16.6 sec 0-200. Is this true? That's what i am aiming for with the JB4.

 

Anything else good to know?

 

 

Thanks guys, you seem like a really nice bunch!

[RedLineZ]

No Edit button on this forum?!

 

I also wanted to ask about the differences between 272 Sportline / L&K, it's only the lower suspension?

In general is this the same suspension in Passat? What other cars have the same suspension?

 

Thanks again!

[ApertureS]

51 minutes ago, RedLineZ said:

No Edit button on this forum?!

 

I also wanted to ask about the differences between 272 Sportline / L&K, it's only the lower suspension?

In general is this the same suspension in Passat? What other cars have the same suspension?

 

Thanks again!

The superb mk3 is a MQB platform car so the suspension is shared with passat, golf, leon and a load of other cars. That being said there are variants such as weight, handling, ride height and such. All depends on what the car left the factory with and how it was set up, but the actual parts themself will look the same on the outside.

 

Sportline and L&K are more styling packs and optional extras than full on changes - the ride height is the same on both and on all superbs infact except for Scouts. 

[RedLineZ]

18 minutes ago, ApertureS said:

The superb mk3 is a MQB platform car so the suspension is shared with passat, golf, leon and a load of other cars. That being said there are variants such as weight, handling, ride height and such. All depends on what the car left the factory with and how it was set up, but the actual parts themself will look the same on the outside.

 

Sportline and L&K are more styling packs and optional extras than full on changes - the ride height is the same on both and on all superbs infact except for Scouts. 

 

Thanks.

I thought the sportline was lowered and had stiffer springs or something.

Interesting to know they are exactly the same, styling aside.

L&K has significantly more options by default right?

 

[ApertureS]

17 minutes ago, RedLineZ said:

 

Thanks.

I thought the sportline was lowered and had stiffer springs or something.

Interesting to know they are exactly the same, styling aside.

L&K has significantly more options by default right?

 

Yes it does. For stiffer suspension you would want dynamic chassis control which allows it to be adjusted 

[Redboy]

2 hours ago, RedLineZ said:

 

Thanks.

I thought the sportline was lowered and had stiffer springs or something.

Interesting to know they are exactly the same, styling aside.

L&K has significantly more options by default right?

 

The  L& K is fully loaded with DCC, Canton, heated front screen, steering wheel, ventilated & heated leather front seats, heated rear seats, dynamic shaping headlights, digi dash. I was lucky, my unmapped 272 also came with sunroof & spare wheel. In DCC sport mode it handles reasonably well on twisting A roads for a big car. Having had 2 VRS Octavias and a GTI  I had to give myself a talking to regarding the styling when considering its purchase, however it's really grown on me. I don't regret it. It is 2-3 mpg thirstier than my previous 2.0 TSI on my usual routes, which is a small price to pay for the quieter more comfortable drive. It's a good Q car. At a roundabout you can just stamp on the throttle to take advantage of a gap in the approaching traffic, there's no drama, spinning  wheels or short shifting to get moving, it simply takes off. My only wish would have been for it to be dragon green but I think only Sportline's had that paint option. 

Edited 20 February, 2022 by Redboy
Predictive mis-spelling again!

[ApertureS]

16 minutes ago, Redboy said:

The  L& K is fully loaded with DCC, Canton, heated front screen, steering wheel, ventilated & heated leather front seats, heated rear seats, dynamic shaping headlights, digi dash. I was lucky, my unmapped 272 also came with sunroof & spare wheel. In DCC sport mode it handles reasonably well on twisting A roads for a big car. Having had 2 VRS Octavias and a GTI  I had to give myself a talking to regarding the styling when considering its purchase, however it's really grown on me. I don't regret it. It is 2-3 mpg thirstier than my previous 2.0 TSI on my usual routes, which is a small price to pay for the quieter more comfortable drive. It's a good Q car. At a roundabout you can just stamp on the throttle to take advantage of a gap in the approaching traffic, there's no drama, spinning  wheels or short shifting to get moving, it simply takes off. My only wish would have been for it to be dragon green but I think only Sportline's had that paint option. 

A lot of them things are still extras even on the  L&K, such as the virtual cockpit and SLA headlights

[boydeee]

Multi point injection was replaced with direct injection only when moving from 280 to 272.

 

As you already mentioned, the gpf and DQ381 are the other differences. 

[RedLineZ]

1 hour ago, boydeee said:

Multi point injection was replaced with direct injection only when moving from 280 to 272.

 

As you already mentioned, the gpf and DQ381 are the other differences. 

 

Both those are better than the old versions tho.

 

So JB4 mapping would be the same on both 280 and 272?

 

BTW you can still buy a 2022 272 in the UK?

[Redboy]

10 hours ago, ApertureS said:

A lot of them things are still extras even on the  L&K, such as the virtual cockpit and SLA headlights

I was obviously lucky then! 

[Legion]

You have a JB4?

 

I should be getting my wireless connector shortly and then I'll be able to set it up.

 

Firmware - Depends which camp you sit it. Some like the most up to date firmware. Others sit in the if it aint broke don't fix it group. I'll probably see how old my firmware is and then make a decision.

 

The firmware is on the N54 forum. There is also a F#ckface group. 

 

I'd expect 272 and 280 to be similar on JB4.

 

Have you seen any 400hp JB4s?

 

Autoinstruct had a Golf R with 234kw and 460Nm at the wheels. I understand that the 8 injectors max out at a bit over 400hp.

 

This is from a dyno day before Autoinstruct got their car up to 234Kw. So JB4 is similar to OTS tunes.

 

 

 

Map 0: This is a stock map with JB4 logging ability. It is also the starter map for cars that are running flash tunes and are stacking the JB4.

Map 1: Tuned map with a average of 4.0psi over stock. This is the shipped map and is compatible for both 91 and 93 and can be used with cars on hardware.

Map 2: Tuned map with 5.0psi peak boost over stock. 93AKI/98Ron recommended Map 3 Peak boost 6psi 93AKI/98Ron recommended Map 4 Peak boost 6psi (Golf R and Audi S3 7speed DSG specific), it has a taper at higher rpm so will also work well for all on 93 in hot climates Map 5 Absolute map peaking 25 tapers to 20psi. E30 with bolt ons needed. (not to be used on 1.8T or 2.0T MK6 Jetta/Passat) Map 6: User adjustable boost map. The map comes preset with a 5.0psi over stock peak and is ready to use on any car running 93 octane. The preset map is also suitable for manual cars with clutch longevity in mind.

The mapping can be done in two manners. If the value at 1500 is kept below 10 it will work as a boost adder map. If the value at 1500 is higher than 10 it will work as a absolute map. This means actual total boost targets will need to be entered.

Map 7: Meth integration map using our FSB Meth controller Map 8: This is a valet map/safety map where 50% of the boost is cut. It will give the ability to log the car via the JB4. This is also the safety map, so in any circumstance the JB4 detects a unsafe condition regardless of map it will default to this map. This includes knock detection, lean AFR or the boost safety value being triggered due to lack of boost control.

 

Obviously you start on Map 0 which should be a pass through Map and your car will be stock. If your car runs normally jump into 1 or 2 and start mapping. Or have fun with 1 & 2 as it is.

 

Before you spend any money on tuning crap jump over to Jeff's webpage -  My Golf Mk7 | My experience with a Volkswagen Mk7 GTI/R 

 

I'd say you probably don't need an intercooler upgrade or intake to start.

 

 

 

[Esseesse200]

I have just come from a mapped diesel sportline 4x4 estate to a late 2018 272.  7 speed with opf/Gpf. 
Certainly a come down In Terms of low down grunt, the previous diesel was 540nm. However I am seriously considering the tvs stage 2+ dsg map and the stage 2 ecu map they do.. that should take to 520ish nm and 380-390bhp. Quite excited at the prospect. I am off to Austria boarding in April so may make the stop in hollandd at their HQ for the work. 😉 

I have already fitted turbo elbow, muffler delete and silicone hose coupled to a pikey r600 mod with a bmc filter 

[Legion]

7 hours ago, Esseesse200 said:

However I am seriously considering the tvs stage 2+ dsg map and the stage 2 ecu map they do.. that should take to 520ish nm and 380-390bhp.

 

How much is the turbocharger for that? Have they told you the specs?

[UndertheRadar]

12 hours ago, Legion said:

 

How much is the turbocharger for that? Have they told you the specs?

That wouldn’t involve an uprated turbo to achieve those figures. 

[Esseesse200]

14 hours ago, Legion said:

 

How much is the turbocharger for that? Have they told you the specs?

That is just a tcu and ecu map. No other mods.. 

[Donweather]

On 21/02/2022 at 02:32, ApertureS said:

Sportline and L&K are more styling packs and optional extras than full on changes - the ride height is the same on both and on all superbs infact except for Scouts. 

I believe the sportline is lower as standard, although this may be just with DCC?  But I think DCC is standard on all sportlines (at least in Aus it is).

[Legion]

On 21/02/2022 at 02:32, RedLineZ said:

Results to expect?

Some people write they get 4.6 sec 0-100 and 16.6 sec 0-200. Is this true? That's what i am aiming for with the JB4.

 

Anything else good to know?

There are quite a few videos on YouTube.
 

 

The golf r can roll off 3.7 0-100. The superb would be about 0.25 slower due to the extra 124kg. That’s under 4 seconds and quicker than M2 competition which is quick. Then you just need to work out how to make it go around corners.

[Esseesse200]

Yea as above but also compare a 380-390bhp superb estate to a 450bhp Audi S6 and per ton you are 5-10hp up per ton on an S6. For less than 30k. That’ll do me thank you 😊 

[Donweather]

Burgertuning believe the JB4 can get around 460-480Nm of torque. 
 

anyone think this will cause long term issues with the DQ250 DSG without a TCU tune?

[travs]

What differences are there between Superb and Golf engine? Given the latter is 300 to start with.

Also, they started with 280, then went to 272…but then went back up to 280? That’s what mine is on a 2021 plate…

 

Def agree on the q-car thing. Love that. 
 

Enjoy the new car @RedLineZ

[fencer]

 

The additional torque will not affect the DQ250, it is a strong unit. However, out of the box it is electronically limited to 400Nm and so will top-out at that value without a TCU tune. 

[Esseesse200]

18 minutes ago, travs said:

What differences are there between Superb and Golf engine? Given the latter is 300 to start with.

Also, they started with 280, then went to 272…but then went back up to 280? That’s what mine is on a 2021 plate…

 

Def agree on the q-car thing. Love that. 
 

Enjoy the new car @RedLineZ

Only difference is the map.. everything else is exactly the same. Turbo, injectors etc. 

I think the reason it went to 272 was the addition of the Gpf’. 
lots of tuners thought the Gpf would restrict power but a few now seem to be realising this is not the case… Revo have done a blog on tuning the Gpf cars 

[Esseesse200]

4 hours ago, Donweather said:

Burgertuning believe the JB4 can get around 460-480Nm of torque. 
 

anyone think this will cause long term issues with the DQ250 DSG without a TCU tune?

As fencer has said. Box will have torque limits set at 400 but if mapped it will take 500 no bother.. most tuners limit the dq250 torque at 500 but some running more than that.. my diesel superb (before My 272) went to racingline for some development and that ended up running 234bhp and 540nm with no long term probs. I did 110k miles in it and 80k of those were at 540nm.. 

[RedLineZ]

 

 

On 23/02/2022 at 17:04, Legion said:

There are quite a few videos on YouTube.
 

 

The golf r can roll off 3.7 0-100. The superb would be about 0.25 slower due to the extra 124kg. That’s under 4 seconds and quicker than M2 competition which is quick. Then you just need to work out how to make it go around corners.

 

Do we really buy that?  i doubt 0.25 sec difference is reality, that would be amazing if it is true.

 

I want to see videos of stage 1 jb4 doing sub 4.

Best i could find is 4.7 sec, which is great.

Seems like i will have to install the JB4 and dust off my draggy to post my own video.

Can't find proper Superb JB4 draggy videos anywhere and no one seems to be documenting performance.

 

Thanks for all the input guys but we need some hard facts

I will try to supply these once the car is ready.

[RedLineZ]

Is there really no edit button on this forum? Very odd.

 

Check this video out:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9bbI0y0IzMM