Bosch Battery life - 5 years?

[mrdomskoda]

I have a Skoda Octavia L&K 2017 Automatic with Start & Stop.

 

Recently been having trouble with the battery, i'm not sure if it's to do with a dashcam I had hard wired by Halfords that is caused my woes or not.

 

I had a dashcam blackvue with a magic pro box fitted to the car in 2019, the magic pro is suppose to keep the camera active when the ignition is switched off and then turn the camera off before the car battery voltage drops too low, this has kind of being working really without much issue over the years, although I would sometimes find the car struggle to start a little bit when the ignition was turned on if the car was left sat idle for a week or so but it would always start. Until November this year in the cold weather, I had start rescue come out and jump start the vehicle. they tested the alternator and found no fault, so it's either the battery that has had it, which is really not that great the car from first registration which wasn't me, would have been June 2017, so if there was a battery warranty not sure if there was then it expired June 2022 .  I've disconnected the dash cam so it's not using power and i've driven the car a bit about 120 miles over a couple of days, but i'm finding that if it's left sitting for 4 days or so it's really noticeably struggling to start again, so I suspect it's the battery.

 

I tried to check the battery status on the maxi dot and that doesn't seem to work with my car model, think skoda disabled it 😞 

 

I can't disconnect the magic pro or check the wiring, I need to go back to halfords as they can't remember where they installed it, but I would like to check their wiring on it, to make sure it's not doing something strange which I plan to whenever they call me back, they are a nightmare to get hold off.

 

although to be honest I think the dashcam has worked since they installed it back in April 2019 and never caused the car not to start,  so it's unlikely to be the magic pro at fault but I need to rule this out before I shell out for a new battery, I rang my local skoda today for a replacement OEM battery / bosch and it was quoted an eye watering £358! WTF !!???!!!

 

or unbranded £256.

 

Dealer said I could bring my car in leave it over night for £60, they would charge the battery up full then check the status of it the next day to confirm if it is battery issue or not, but i'm thinking I could probably buy a battery charger for that price and do that test myself.

 

i'm just wondering is this normal for the start and stop / AMG battery to have such a limited life, I know they have an estimated 360,000 start and stops within them, but that means before the start and stop system no longer functions, the battery should still hold charge.

 

I had a skoda previously not start and stop and never encountered any issue with the battery.

 

How long realistically should a bosch OEM battery retain charge for on average? ( regardless of stop and starts )

 

 

 

[varooom]

Battery life can vary so much, depends on many factors.  Some get 3-4 years, and other beyond this on exactly same battery.

 

What's fitted right now, as we can point you at cheaper source no doubt. (Take a photo if possible)

 

Have you got a basic voltage meter to check?

 

 

You might have 096 sized AGM, dimensions available here... https://www.tayna.co.uk/car-batteries/varta/e39/

 

278mm length, Varta and Bosch are made in same factory, Varta being an OEM choice for VAG.

Edited 19 December, 2022 by varooom

[Warrior193]

Hello Mr D, be aware that there can be an issue with unexpected electrical loads while the ignition is switched off - it is possible that not all of the vehicle systems 'go to sleep' / shut down correctly, resulting in a current drain considerably larger than the dash cam load.

Do you have facility to fully charge, then test the present battery? 

[J.R.]

Have you had a towbar or replacement stereo fitted before the problem manifested?

[KenONeill]

4 hours ago, mrdomskoda said:

i'm not sure if it's to do with a dashcam I had hard wired by Halfords

I think I may see a possible explanation!!!

[mrdomskoda]

6 hours ago, Warrior193 said:

Hello Mr D, be aware that there can be an issue with unexpected electrical loads while the ignition is switched off - it is possible that not all of the vehicle systems 'go to sleep' / shut down correctly, resulting in a current drain considerably larger than the dash cam load.

Do you have facility to fully charge, then test the present battery? 

No I don't but I'm thinking for the price Skoda want to check it out, it might be worth me buying a charger, charging it  outside the vehicle then let the battery sit overnight or even a few days then re-test  it before it goes into the vehicle to rule that out.

 

what kind of charger do I need for this type of battery.

 

If I put my reg in on the Kwik fit site it recommends the following battery:

 

Start Stop AGM - Bosch S5A08 - 5 Year Guarantee

Which is at a good price compared to Skoda at £225 which includes fitting and 5 years warranty.
 

and it just flashed me a 20% off discount code, which is like making me think this is a good idea.

 

 

[mrdomskoda]

1 hour ago, KenONeill said:

I think I may see a possible explanation!!!

Now it might be yes, I was a bit naive when I bought the product I just paid for them to install it all, and it worked, I asked the question where is the magic pro was can't remember where it was , the fact that it all worked  and they said I wouldn't need to touch it. Big mistake!!, they gave me the box the product was in I should have read the instructions and gone straight back and told them to move it.

 

But as problems started happening , I've done research on the magic pro and how it works and how it's suppose to be configured  it's a box which is meant to be installed in the dash, so the driver can disable it so it turns the cam off if the ignition is off or run it until battery level are too low, it has an on or off switch button for this, and a LED light, which should go out when the engine is turned off, if it stays on it means wiring error and it's draining the battery, so that is the first thing I want to check, then next thing is it grounded properly as that can also cause issues.

 

The fact this box is suppose to be usable via the driver and then some Halfords monkey installed it somewhere in the trim which makes it totally inaccessible does  makes me think, what other stupid things did that installer do and are they really competent when it comes to installing magic pro boxes.

 

There are also some config dip switches you can set to determine if you want the cam to remain on a timer for a number of hours or just run until battery levels are low and of course can't get to this. with the cost of a new battery which is quite frankly outrageous I though it time to look at this setup and rule it out.  Halfords might have done a good job apart from putting it in an inaccessible place, and it's going to be an interesting argument to see if they will move it after all this time without charging, but in the mean time I just need to see it.

 

 

[mrdomskoda]

6 hours ago, varooom said:

Battery life can vary so much, depends on many factors.  Some get 3-4 years, and other beyond this on exactly same battery.

 

What's fitted right now, as we can point you at cheaper source no doubt. (Take a photo if possible)

 

Have you got a basic voltage meter to check?

 

 

You might have 096 sized AGM, dimensions available here... https://www.tayna.co.uk/car-batteries/varta/e39/

 

278mm length, Varta and Bosch are made in same factory, Varta being an OEM choice for VAG.

Thank you for that link, that looks even better.

 

Do you know if I can just switch out that battery and replace or does the car need a re-code? to accept the different battery?

 

[varooom]

11 minutes ago, mrdomskoda said:

Thank you for that link, that looks even better.

 

Do you know if I can just switch out that battery and replace or does the car need a re-code? to accept the different battery?

 

Please check the dimensions, or post image of existing battery.

 

If dimensions are spot on, you should be able to order one ASAP.

 

 

Take a look here for some guideline's in a post I made beforehand.

 

[varooom]

52 minutes ago, mrdomskoda said:

If I put my reg in on the Kwik fit site it recommends the following battery:

 

Start Stop AGM - Bosch S5A08 - 5 Year Guarantee

Which is at a good price compared to Skoda at £225 which includes fitting and 5 years warranty.
 

and it just flashed me a 20% off discount code, which is like making me think this is a good idea.

Fitting the battery you can do yourself very easily.

 

Also same battery is cheaper at Tanya once again.

 

https://www.tayna.co.uk/car-batteries/bosch/s5a08/

[Warrior193]

17 hours ago, mrdomskoda said:

Thank you for that link, that looks even better.

 

Do you know if I can just switch out that battery and replace or does the car need a re-code? to accept the different battery?

 

Provided you exchange with same battery type (AGM or EFB) and Amp-Hour capacity you MAY not have to adapt the new battery into the vehicle system - although I consider it best to at least change the battery serial number (adaptation) because the vehicle charging system may be limiting the charging rate to compensate for faults detected in the old one.

A smart charger (I use a Ring 8 amp - Ctek is another good brand) is best for AGM/EFB batteries, look for one that can handle all three usual battery types.  

[mrdomskoda]

22 hours ago, J.R. said:

Have you had a towbar or replacement stereo fitted before the problem manifested?

No, just the dashcam.

[Jocko]

5 years from a battery is good going. Personally I would have no qualms about replacing it.

[SuperbTWM]

Having the dashcam sapping power is probably one of the reasons why your tired battery is causing issues, have you tried disabling the feature where it continues to run on or disconnecting it to see if your battery starts coping better?

 

Would be interesting to know what voltage your camera cuts out at, i'm willing to bet its probably a lot lower than is ideal.

 

For reference I had to replace an AGM battery on our Ford at 5 years old. It was starting the car fine but it wasn't letting us power up the front heated windscreen

 

Edited 20 December, 2022 by SuperbTWM

[mrdomskoda]

Went to Halfords, after dismantling my glove box because the little switch thing that allows it to drop down away from the fuse box doesn't work,  I wonder if this was caused by halfords when they did the install, who knows, could have always been that way. 

 

Anyway after removing the glove box still couldn't see where the magic pro was installed, so another guy came out and said it's probably in the passenger door under the trim, to which point the guy said oh I was looking for a battery??! 

 

Anyway he lifted off the trim on the passenger side and there was the box, hanging free, inside the dash / passenger side. 

 

Checked to see that the light goes off when ignition goes off which it does, so that ruled out.

Noticed it's set to kill the power when it drops to 12v, I said I would like that changed so it's 12.5v, which was then met with well...you know.... I wouldn't do that because it could cut off the camera while driving if you battery is knacker, the alternator may pause the battery charging when you are breaking etc and it could drop below 12.5v and cut the camera out while driving. 

 

I'm starting think he doesn't know what he is talking about, he already spent 10 minutes thinking a magic pro, was a battery backup.

 

The camera is powered by car battery when you switch the car on, when you switch the car off, the camera goes into a parking mode and it is at this point the magic pro is checking voltage drop and disabling the camera if it goes below either of the limits you can set it.

 

 

Anyway he made the change and repeated his warning, then put the cover on. I said to him the magic pro is suppose to be installed within driver reach so I can switch the device on or off to make it easy to disable.

 

His answer was, well all you need is a credit card and you can just pop the side of the dash off and then access the box and switch it off, there is nothing holding the side paneling in apart from clips slide a credit card in and it won't scratch anything. This I found ridiculous workaround for something that has been installed in the wrong place, I will write to halfords about that, the staff are idiots.

 

 

Anyway, I'm trying the setting out on 12.5v now, I noticed that as soon as I turned the ignition off the blackvue camera went off, because battery was low, I think the blackvue magic pro is installed correctly  and doing what it should when it should and I actually have by the sounds of it a battery that is on the way out, since the battery ran flat i've not been able to get the start and stop to become active despite putting some miles on, so that I guess is a tell tale sign, so I think give till after xmas if things don't improve after a few more drives it's new battery time. The link that was posted on here for the bosch battery is probably the best and a great price!, so thanks for everyone's help on here.

 

 

 

[varooom]

At least you know where to look for that in the future.

When stop/start doesn't work, or rarely does shut down engine.. battery is often near the end (but they can still work on for longer)

[SuperbTWM]

The guy is correct about the alternator pausing charging, in normal operation the battery only ever gets charged to around 80% to save room to harvest energy when coasting or braking from the alternator. Another reason why I don’t really rate the device you have fitted, it doesn’t give you much room to play with once the dash cam has sapped all the usable capacity and then the car may sit for a few days etc etc. factor in some bad weather and a tired battery and you’ve got yourself a non starter 
 

I can’t remember from memory what that voltage is likely to be and it may also depend on whether you have an EFB or AGM battery. I know some have monitored it and it has been discussed so somebody will know 
 

I would get yourself a new battery and try out the new 12.5v cut out voltage and you will more than likely be golden

Edited 22 December, 2022 by SuperbTWM

[Warrior193]

If you had access to a decent charger, it would be useful to give the old battery a full charge and then a load test - failing that, as TWM says, new battery time. Batteries can last longer than 5 or 6 years, but they do lead a pretty hard life. 

[ords]

Why don't you turn the box off until you next need to use the car (at least 24 hrs) and see if that makes any difference?

[nidza]

My lasted 4,5 years, but didn't show much symptoms, they detected on the regular annual service. New one brought a big difference in start and stop - I don't even recall that the car was working like that since it was delivered.

 

If dashcam starts on ignition, it is connected properly to the fuse which is off when car is shut down, and is not a reason of your issue. Could be that more power consumption now just has shown better the existing issue.

[mrdomskoda]

On 22/12/2022 at 21:08, varooom said:

At least you know where to look for that in the future.

When stop/start doesn't work, or rarely does shut down engine.. battery is often near the end (but they can still work on for longer)

Yes that is what the guy told me in Kwik Fit, he was very knowledgeable on AGM batteries bit of a battery geek, his words not mine. 

 

[mrdomskoda]

I've left the car standing Wednesday night 20:30 , and just started it today Saturday 11:30, and it fired up , I'm hoping the 12.5v config switch has made a difference, effectively this is just shutting down the camera in parking mode.

 

Looked at the car battery and it's not a bosch battery!, somebody told me it was, I guess it's because Varta and Bosch are technically the same, and i'm too bloody lazy to look.  anyway I have done today and it's a Varta 7PO 915 105 68ah 

12V

 

 

So plan is now to get through xmas, merry xmas everyone, if it still starts after a few days sat on the drive  then great it goes for another battery test down kwik fit for a final determination, if it fails to start then it's a new battery.

 

When I typed in my battery model this came up

 

"Halfords 096AGM Start/Stop AGM 12V Car Battery 5 Year Guarantee" - £151

 

 

[J.R.]

On 22/12/2022 at 21:54, mrdomskoda said:

I said to him the magic pro is suppose to be installed within driver reach so I can switch the device on or off to make it easy to disable.

 

His answer was, well all you need is a credit card and you can just pop the side of the dash off and then access the box and switch it off, there is nothing holding the side paneling in apart from clips slide a credit card in and it won't scratch anything. This I found ridiculous workaround for something that has been installed in the wrong place, I will write to halfords about that, the staff are idiots.

Having seen the photograph I dont think the "idiot" as you call him could have chosen a better location aside from screwing it to the outside of a lower dash trim which I'm sure you would soon have moaned about, that panel on the drivers side is intended to be removed to access the fuses.

 

He ought to have screwed or tywrapped it in position though.

Edited 24 December, 2022 by J.R.

[varooom]

@mrdomskoda If you do need to secure the little dash cam box, I recommend some 3M Double-Sided sticky tape VHB (very high bond)

Can be found on Fleabay/Amazon etc, once that stuff goes "off" after about 24hrs, it almost needs a chisel to remove.

[Tilt]

Not a stop / start battery, but I have had my S5008 096 fitted in the Octavia since November 2011......

 

Not good for them if they are regularly allowed to remain low on charge...

 

In the really cold weather I put a trickle charge on it every now and then.