Engine vibration after cambelt change 1.0 TSI 110 3 cylinder DSG 2018 Fabia MK3

[ForCar40]

Hi, following cambelt change at  5 years and 23k miles I now have quite noticeable engine vibration around 1100 rpm, fine at other rpms.  Dealer says this vibration is normal for 3 cylinder engines, but it didn't do it before service and cambelt change and was very smooth previously.  Engine can spend quite a time around 1100rpm in slow moving traffic with the DSG gearbox, so quite noticeable and irritating as there was no hint of vibration before.  Any suggestions why this may have happened or similar experiences?  Thanks.

[CReese123]

20 hours ago, ForCar40 said:

Hi, following cambelt change at  5 years and 23k miles I now have quite noticeable engine vibration around 1100 rpm, fine at other rpms.  Dealer says this vibration is normal for 3 cylinder engines, but it didn't do it before service and cambelt change and was very smooth previously.  Engine can spend quite a time around 1100rpm in slow moving traffic with the DSG gearbox, so quite noticeable and irritating as there was no hint of vibration before.  Any suggestions why this may have happened or similar experiences?  Thanks.

What's the revs like on idle? 

[Ootohere]

Hopefully they did the job correctly. But then you will not know unless the work is checked.

 

Is it the Master Tech that dismisses it as being normal having test driven the car,  or the Service Desk Staff or Service Manager?

?

@ForCar40How much did the Dealership charge?

 

http://mechanexpert.com/timing-belt-replacement-on-mk7-golf-1-0-tsi

 

[ForCar40]

Hi Toot, I had the "technician" that did the job, another one and a manager look at it in workshop, I held the engine at offending rpm 1200 (not typo 1100 rpm in post) and for them it was not excessive vibration in their opinion, ignoring the fact that there was none before which obviously I can't prove.  Had it been at another rpm level it wouldn't be so bad, but slowing to stop or reversing DSG box often spends a time at this rpm especially when cold. As I can't suggest why this might have happened or how they might remedy it, will have to put up with it. Maybe if someone drove it not knowing how smooth it was before wouldn't be troubled by it. I was charged £550 for cambelt change, originally told £650 by office staff to include water pump, which was error as pump not driven by cambelt, but they didn't attempt to charge for it afterwards . I did expect them to say it might be because I didn't have spark plugs changed at cost of £115, will get this done next service, perhaps last at main dealer if prices are much above independents, but who's to say their service is better?

[Ootohere]

Best not put up with it.

Speak with the Dealer Principal next week and tell them your concerns about the job they did that you paid for.  Maybe @ApertureSor @Crashercould comment.

 

Easy enough on here to give them some publicity if that is what they would like to have. 

 

................

The spark plugs really could do with being looked at even though it is only at 23,000 miles. 

Then since out get replaced.

Charging customers the same price to replace 3 spark plugs as replacing 4 is a p!55 take.  Like the old Fixed Price Servicing where they use 4.6 litres oil for one car and 3.2 or even 2.8 for another.

 

http://briskoda.net/forums/topic/486469-spark-plug

 

 

[ForCar40]

Having just read article http://mechanexpert.com/timing-belt-replacement-on-mk7-golf-1-0-tsi  the non-round pulley system might be an area of concern if not done correctly as could have potential to change balance of engine I would have thought, but would expect main Skoda dealer to do correctly with the right tools? Maybe question  technician if get chance, thanks for info.

[ForCar40]

Now this has happened regret not having spark plugs changed, but bill was already £899 with unexpected MOT suspension bush work, 

[ApertureS]

It’s gonna be near impossible for me to comment as I haven’t actually seen the car but I’ll still say what I can;

 

yes the 3 cylinder engines are very very rough running engines and that’s ’normal’ but you say it’s worse now they’ve done a belt change.

 

personally I would be asking them to time the engine again and just make sure the pins go in as required, it’s not a massive job to time this engine as technically if you know what you are doing you don’t even need to touch the belt or timing cover.

 

as the pulleys are not keyed and are freewheeling it is extremely easy to time the engine a few degrees up either way by mistake.

 

yes the pulleys are oval shaped and are marked to only go in 1 position using a camshaft pulley to camshaft pulley locking tool, but even if they were 90/180 degrees out I couldn’t see them causing a vibration.

 

Final words; if the vibration is more apparent now then I would put money on the timing being ever so slightly out of position.

[ForCar40]

Think I will get spark plugs changed and ask for timing to be checked at same time. Due to family bereavement and travel plans, will probably not have time in near future. Will update when something to report, thank you for all replies, much appreciated.

[DaniP]

@ForCar40 have you made any progress with this?

 

I have almost exactly the same issue - my 2018 1.0 TSI Colour Edition has about 22000 miles on it and was in last week for a cam belt replacement and now the engine is really rough and lumpy at 1200rpm.

 

I've got it booked back in with the garage to get it looked at but I'm worried they're going to fob me off. @ApertureS /anyone if the timing is off by a couple of degrees, would that show up in diagnostics? What's my best course of action to make sure they properly look at and adjust the timing other than just insisting?

[ApertureS]

2 hours ago, DaniP said:

@ForCar40 have you made any progress with this?

 

I have almost exactly the same issue - my 2018 1.0 TSI Colour Edition has about 22000 miles on it and was in last week for a cam belt replacement and now the engine is really rough and lumpy at 1200rpm.

 

I've got it booked back in with the garage to get it looked at but I'm worried they're going to fob me off. @ApertureS /anyone if the timing is off by a couple of degrees, would that show up in diagnostics? What's my best course of action to make sure they properly look at and adjust the timing other than just insisting?

To check the timing using the correct tools should take no longer than 30 minutes or so as its a bolt/pin and a bracket with locating pins, fairly straight forward so no reason for a garage to try and rip you off.

If youre sceptical, ask for photos of the timing pins in their correct locations and fitted to the car.

[MB21]

@DaniP @ForCar40How did you get on with your respective garages following your problematic cambelt changes? Any resolution?

 

I had my cambelt replaced earlier this week by my trusted and long time used indie. I also have a 1.0TSI 2018 Mk III and like you, now have a noticeable vibration starting at c. 1100 revs. The vibration remains when driving, but less noticeable. 

 

They have had a quick look and couldn't see anything obviously wrong, but agree the vibration is very noticeable and not normal.  The car is going back in on Monday for further investigation. They didn't think it would be a timing issue, as they believe the EML would be showing almost immediately. The car has only done a few miles since the service, so not sure how long it takes for the car to register an issue.

 

If you have got yours resolved, would be grateful for any insights - will be helpful to point the garage in the right direction.

 

Thanks

 

[Ootohere]

@MB21Welcome.

 

You do not say how many miles your car has done, so was the Cam belt replaced because @ 5 years old.

 

Were the Spark Plugs replaced at this time or have they been replaced before this service.

Has the car got a new air filter fitted or even checked? 

So serviced as needed and not just to some Guidelines, Recommendation or Skoda Schedule / specification.

[MB21]

@toot

Sorry for my omissions.

 

The car has been serviced in line with the Skoda recommendations, and hence the decision to replace the cambelt this year even though it has only covered 36,000 miles. A full service and brake fluid change was carried out at the same time.The spark plugs were replaced last year. The air filter hasn't been replaced, but based on your helpful schedule will be on the list next year.

 

The vibration has definitely arisen following this service, and hence my belief it is related to the cambelt change.

 

[DaniP]

Hi @MB21

 

Mine's not booked in until the 23rd so no updates on my front I'm afraid

 

Appreciate that @toot's questions were directed to you but in the interest of sharing info:

 

- My car has done 22,000 miles, and I've had every service done at my main Skoda dealer where I bought the car from and have had whatever's recommended done at each service interval

 

- My cam belt was done at the same time as my 5 year service and MOT, where I also had brake fluid change, coolant change, air-con service - my spark plugs were replaced last year 

 

- Car got the usual Skoda health check done at the same time as the service and everything was marked as green aside from a corroded exhaust clamp which I had replaced at the same time as all the other work

 

Given that the car was running perfect prior to the service, MOT and cambelt and immediately had noticeable vibration at 1200 revs (and I think it's vibrating between 1000 and 2000 revs but it's much more subtle than what happens at 1200 revs!) post the work, my immediate thoughts are that there must be something slightly off on the timing per @ApertureS's comments or generally related to the cambelt change so it's interesting that your garage thinks it's not that. I was discussing the issue with some of my work colleagues who work on their own cars and their opinion (for what it's worth) is that it definitely sounds like the timing is off and that if the timing is only off by a few degrees then it wouldn't necessarily show up in a diagnostic or trigger the EML to come on.

 

Best guess is that my car has done about 90 miles since the work was done and at this time it hasn't gotten any better or worse and the EML hasn't come on

 

Seems extraordinarily unlikely that three of us with the same engine have all encountered an identical issue post a cambelt change and it's related to something other than the cambelt change....

 

Please keep us posted with what your garage is able to find and (fingers crossed!) how they fix the issue so I can pass the info on to my garage when I take mine in!

[Ootohere]

@MB21

If the place you use does not open the Airbox at each service and at least have a look see how the filter looks they would be someplace i would avoid to do anything on a vehicle.

Basic stuff, even with vehicles with awkward to look into Air Filter boxes.

[nta16]

Thing is the engine isn't really serviced at these oil changes and inspection services let alone servicing the whole car so I doubt many places look at an engine air filter if they're not scheduled to change it, I might be wrong about this I'll have to have a look at the lie tick sheets for my wife's car to check.

 

I think it's ridiculous to leave it 6-years/60k-miles before changing the engine air filter but these German engineers must know what they're doing as German engineering is so good.

 

My wife's filter was changed with changing the spark plugs which makes sense given the design of the air filter airbox removal and additional fun of the what's involved with the plugs.

 

[Ootohere]

Derren Brown let alone German Engineers or technicians do not know where a vehicle is driven. Or parked or where it provides a home for wildlife / critters.

In a city centre with busses and taxis still spewing out soot and particulates, or a country side with crops and chaff and all sorts of dust including off roads, near the seaside or just anywhere. 

First off the air filter boxes should not require a manual to see how to get into it, but then again neither should pollen filters need the carry on that some require to check or replace, or just to vacuum out and clean up and replace.

 

Pollen / cabin filter, Skoda Enyaq etc.

 

 

Edited 13 May, 2023 by toot

[ForCar40]

Regarding my engine vibration after cambelt change, unable to update as I am still out of country following a bereavement. Will report when have some useful feedback on issue, June or July hopefully, thanks.

[DaniP]

@MB21 how did your Fabia get on at the garage today, did your guys manage to find anything/fix the problem?

[MB21]

I was hoping that I could come back with some positive news, but the garage are still working on it. They've refitted the cambelt having carefully gone through everything, and put it back together, but still getting the same result. They maintain they do 2 or 3 of these every week, and not previously encountered the problem. They recognise there is a problem, and accept that it is likely to have been caused by the cambelt replacement. I'm hoping to hear again in the morning, and will keep you posted.

 

I saw @Twiz had a similar issue, and concluded it was the harmonic balancer had been refitted incorrectly. I've highlighted this to the garage, but they weren't convinced. I assume this isn't replaced as part of the cambelt kit?

 

Also saw that @toot and @ForCar40 posted a link from mechanic expert on the Mk7 Golf timing belt replacement - the link is no longer live. I don't suppose anyone else has a copy / live link that I can access?

 

Thanks all for your help.

 

[Ootohere]

 

 

Edited 15 May, 2023 by toot

[J.R.]

On 13/05/2023 at 14:43, nta16 said:

I think it's ridiculous to leave it 6-years/60k-miles before changing the engine air filter but these German engineers must know what they're doing as German engineering is so good.

Since approx 1995 so 28 years or more all vehicles have to be able to run without any servicing including oil changes, air filter, spark plugs etc for 100000kms = 62000 miles and still remain within their emissions limits and at Lambda 1.0.

 

It triggered the use of 3D mapped electronic ignition, long life oils, crankshaft driven oil pumps, larger oil filters and especially larger air filters.

 

The emissions limits have tightened considerably since then with EU3, 4, 5 and EU6 and the 100000kms has probably also been extended, the surface area of VAG (and all other makes) air filters has increased massively during the 3 decades and also the intake ducting picks up cooler cleaner air and has chambers for leaves, water etc to drop out, the lower part of the air filter housing is also designed for leaves etc to drop away from the filter element.

 

I ran my MK1 Octavia to 225000 miles on the original air filter with no more than a shake out and dusting with a soft brush every couple of years, it was never restrictive and I always watched the fuel economy obsessively, I eventually replaced the filter because it was falling apart!

 

Pollen filters are a different matter and need to be frequently replaced, dusting off and brushing helps a little but the airflow from the fan is severely reduced, on the MK1 it was a difficult job to replace and the main dealer servicing it had prior to my ownership never once replaced it despite it being charged for several times.

[J.R.]

Nothing wrong with replacing the air filter more frequently or changing the brake fluid when it has not absorbed any H2O but if you are paying a garage to do it then you might need to reflect.

 

Service intervals seem to be all about maximising the revenue for the dealers whilst minimising what they actually do and charging for the maximum of parts often not fitted.

[Ootohere]

 

I lent a Jimny to a family member and they asked me too look at it a couple of years later as it was a really heavy drinker.

The K&N filter was new when they got it as were the plugs. it had not done a lot of miles but they were all in and around Edinburgh.