Why do you need 240? 150 in an Octavia is more than enough for today's roads and speed limits.

What are your needs that require more?

Do you tow large weights?

What actual needs do you have that require a manual?

 

Have to admit I do agree that if you live anywhere near the big smoke these days BHP just sits in the traffic jam chewing its way through your wallet. The one place I do find a bit more grunt useful is if you spend a lot of time on single A roads. A car that is good from 30-60 can make overtaking a bit easier. Straits on a road I knew well were no longer that comfortable for getting past something when I sold the old M3. That is where diesels can be good but I find you need to be in the fairly narrow rev band which a manual can be easier to control.

 

Over a dozen cars of mine have been manual, (save for one SMG) mainly as a consequence of remembering some slushboxes of old with no more than 3 gears! so that is where I am coming from  :p  I did have a modern automatic as a courtesy car a while back and have to admit I was surprised how relaxing it made a 2hr traffic jam.

 

I was "forced" to go DSG as I could not get a manual in the car I wanted. Test driving one did not show an issue, but a test drive does not really show you enough to be really used to it. There is a bit of a learning process to get the most out of these boxes. I have had it a while now and still getting used to it

 

It is still basically a (2x) manual box and you can flick through the gears with the stick (or paddles if you have them) and change when you would a manual on the move, then you have the ability to jog along in traffic in auto, and yes if you have ACC it seems to work very well.

 

I miss being able to feather the clutch when manoeuvring especially towing or when it is slippy. And it does, just occasionally, catch me out. I think it selects gears so well 99% of the time that the one time it cant read your mind or see the road ahead can come as a surprise!

 

"Compromise" or "best of both worlds" will depend on the driving you do. As a die-hard manual driver I am glad I "had" to get the DSG as I do find it good so far. Would I get one again? bit too early to tell but on balance, yes, and either way it wont be through lack of finding out how best to work this box.

I cannot really comment on the DSG as I have only had short test drives in them where they seemed ok, but every independent review I have read has said they are really great on the move but can be somewhat hesitant on take-off. The latter issue is rarely alluded to on this site so I am not sure how big a problem it is but it not a good thing to experience if you are trying to make a gap in the traffic from a standing start.

 

Obviously my preference is for manuals and I would say the Octavia manual gearchange is pretty good but relatively notchy compared to a silky smooth unit I experienced in a Ford Focus manual. The first to second gear change on the Octavia is the only one where the notchiness is really pronounced for me.

However the Octavia clutch has much better feel than the Focus unit which I found to have an indeterminate/vague 'bite' point.

The hesitancy at take off; I can understand it can be felt by people not used to the DSG.

It's a question of learning, for the driver to adapt the behaviour of the box, which is indeed a bit different. You get it after few hundreds km.

Once you've learnt it, no hesitancy anymore, neither at takeoff, nor in roundabouts.

 

Yes, you might think this is not you to adapt to the car.

Like those young people who don"t see why they would learn drinking wine, as it does not taste so fun at first try.

Just switch to s-mode and all hesitation taking of is long gone.

Not necessariliy. You can manage it in Normal mode as well. And you can't push the throttle to hard neither, with a 2WD, as you might afford with a 4WD. :-)

Also, in commuting, S-mode is not advisable before the engine is high enough in temperature.

Why do you need 240? 150 in an Octavia is more than enough for today's roads and speed limits.

What are your needs that require more?

Do you tow large weights?

What actual needs do you have that require a manual?

I find having more power makes for a much more relaxing drive, both on the motorway where progress is so much easier to maintain and on A roads. I don't tend to speed, in 34 years of driving so far I have never had a speeding ticket nor been stopped by the police.

If you drive mostly on single lane A roads as I do, with little congestion, you can maintain safe progress much more easily. Overtaking when appropriate is much safer.

I enjoyed having a series of V6 diesels as they were so much more refined than a 4 pot ( it is the refinement I miss as much as the extra 70hp)

I live on a rough track, which slopes quite considerably near my house. It is never gritted and when it snows, the only way it is cleared is if I get a brush out. 4wd and a manual gearbox on a slope with winter tyres gives me the control I want. In my experience, DSG does not.

Finally, 240hp, a smooth V6 4wd and a slick manual gearbox is fun, most of the time. 170hp 4wd and four cylinders is OK but...

Anything less? No thanks

Are those sufficient reasons?

Edited 20 September, 201510 yr by Bristolf2b

Well I live up a country lane and in the winter if it snows, I used to get stuck, but then I bought winter tyres and I haven't had any issues with getting stuck and I have a 90° bend at the bottom of the hill and another sharp bend before a main road.

 

I won't be changing from a DSG now or in the future, the only thing I will make sure is that I have flappy paddles.

I live on a rough track, which slopes quite considerably near my house. It is never gritted and when it snows, the only way it is cleared is if I get a brush out. 4wd and a manual gearbox on a slope with winter tyres gives me the control I want. In my experience, DSG does not.

 

 

 

Did you try the DSG in manual mode and traction control off?

Everyone has different experiences and needs. But there are quite a few of us forum members in the Nordics, driving DSGs on snow/ice for 6 months a year. I haven't heard too many complaints.

DSG every time. If I want to push on I override with the paddles. Saves arsing about rowing a stick

Missing rowing the stick is not an issue really for most is it, and for those that have no interest in it, 'D' does the job.

They are Automated Manuals and personally i like using the Gear Stick for changing down gear (decelerating) and dececlerating (slowing down) on Snow, Ice and loose surfaces, and then back across to 'D' for upshifts.

(not being a paddle fan). DSG's are very good cars for UK Winter and other conditions and great were you can stay off the brakes.

 

Surely the only thing that is missing for the Involved and Sporting Driver experience on UK 60 mph NSL roads

is the left leg going up and down on the clutch pedal.

 

It is not exactly a case of double de-clutching and heeling and toeing in a Dirty Diesel Manual on UK A roads.

As to Towing with a DSG Vehicle, they do very well to the towing weights Braked or Unbraked and i never seen 

where a Manual Gearbox would be of any advantage.

I do think a lot of dislike of auto's is based on the old fully hydraulic units of old, I have to say I felt pretty much the same until the TCU controlled tiptronic boxes started to come out and and they were a step in the right direction but a modern electronic auto is a thing of joy and every bit as involving as a manual or dsg 

 

Out of the three cars in our household (Petrol) we have a CVT, a conventional modern auto and a dsg , it would have to be a very good manual to tempt me away from an auto nowadays , better than anything VAG produce for sure

I still v much rate the ZF 8 speed that BM use...most of the benefits of DSG (quick shifts due to lock up from 2nd gear up, little or no parasitic loss) but v smooth.

I still v much rate the ZF 8 speed that BM use...most of the benefits of DSG (quick shifts due to lock up from 2nd gear up, little or no parasitic loss) but v smooth.

 

Having both ZF and DSG I agree, its one of the best auto boxes out there and in sport mode it bangs gears home ferociously!

 

I also find autos in winter great, allow the box to creep you away rather than needing to be very delicate with manual clutch control and revs.

I am afraid I am not convinced that the £1600 premium is worth it.

For me.

I will contunue to object to the lack of choice that Skoda and others are presenting, and may take my business elsewhere

We will just have to agree to disagree, although if this thread is a true representitive sample, I amin a minority, although if someone has decided to spend the cash on this of course they will be convinced they have made the right decision.

I do know of a number of people who regretted buying DSG when they have been stranded by the roadside with a damaged 'box and subsequently had to pay large bills out of warranty, and others who having bought a DSG equipped car decided they had made a mistake.

It takes all sorts

I can tell you that the vast majority of cars sold in Australia are automatics of one flavour or another.

The number of manual options on offer over here for all makes are continually reducing. I'd go so far as to say that the only manufacturer that I am aware of who has actually put some recent development work into improving manual boxes is Mazda under their SkyActive banner.

 

Historically the relatively recently introduced double (dry) clutch gearboxes from various makes at the cheaper end of the market have suffered reliability problems.

As far as I am aware VAG have now addressed their particular demons and even though I personally prefer manuals I could 'suffer' a DSG box if I had to.

to Bristolf2b

We may be in disagreement with your view of the DSG.

 

On the other hand, I fully support your objection to the lack of choice presented by Skoda.

Things may change, however.

For instance, it seems Skoda will finally propose the 1.8 TSI in 4WD in France before the end of the year.

Edited 21 September, 201510 yr by JPH0091

I do think a lot of dislike of auto's is based on the old fully hydraulic units of old, I have to say I felt pretty much the same until the TCU controlled tiptronic boxes started to come out and and they were a step in the right direction but a modern electronic auto is a thing of joy and every bit as involving as a manual or dsg 

 

Out of the three cars in our household (Petrol) we have a CVT, a conventional modern auto and a dsg , it would have to be a very good manual to tempt me away from an auto nowadays , better than anything VAG produce for sure

It has to be said that the old torque convertor slush boxes had a lot going for them in terms of the driving experience. They gave a lot of oomph when moving from rest and were generally smooth and quiet at all times. But they hammered fuel economy, so no longer acceptable ...

 

I've gone for a DSG 1.8 TSi for our new car - from comments elsewhere don't think I'm going to be disappointed!

The 1.8 is a peach of an engine and when mated to the DSG 7 box a real joy to drive.

Any experience of the Torotrak IVT box?

Edited 21 September, 201510 yr by usedit67

Not strictly true. If you want an auto 4X4 Octavia you have to get a Scout, all other 4X4 Octavias are manuals.

I'm afraid you are in a dying breed along with manual chokes, non fuel injection engines and candles for lighting.

I gave worked in transmission and driveline fir the last six years and no one is designing new manual gearboxes as the demand outside of tiny cars for manuals is minimum.

New auto boxes and new DSGs are being developed (ZF have a 1,000 Nmtr gearbox now) but there is no investment in new manual boxes, as the sales are not there to justify the development. More is being put into HEV, P HEV, BEV systems which all mate to autos.

Every manual box is a box designed at the latest in the eighties and are modified with front plates to fit new engines etc.

It's not just VAG, but all premium manufacturers spend development money in new autos not new manual boxes

Any experience of the Torotrak IVT box?

It has to be said that the old torque convertor slush boxes had a lot going for them in terms of the driving experience. They gave a lot of oomph when moving from rest and were generally smooth and quiet at all times. But they hammered fuel economy, so no longer acceptable ...

 

I've gone for a DSG 1.8 TSi for our new car - from comments elsewhere don't think I'm going to be disappointed!

 

 

Modern torque converter boxes can often more than match their manual counterparts as they are able to employ more gears and longer gearing

 

Some manufacturers are going back to torque converter autos over dsg type boxes, the Lexus IS-F for example has a shift speed that walks all over DSG as well as 8 gears and is a work of art imo

 

http://www.supra-2urgse.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/aa80e-intergration-pt1.pdf

I went DSG mainly as it will be my daily driver and while it does suck the fun out of pushing the car hard, my circumstances don't really require it. I am probably closer to one of the motoring purists that want to run with no TCS and a manual gearbox but having lived with my impreza for the past year i am more than happy to have the option to not knacker my left ankle/knee in while stuck in traffic on a regular basis.

 

My impreza is pretty much on par with a golf R in terms of performance but when i pushed the golf hard i just had no real sense of enjoyment as the gearchanges were almost undetectable... just a fairly linear increase in speed without any drama. The impreza with its huge dollop of boost between 3500-5500 just has a lot more fun attached to it.

 

The vRS for me is meant to be a much more practical car with a hint of fun thrown in to stop me from getting too bored. The impreza will still be getting used when i just want to drive,  The vRS will get used when i don't want to have to worry about finding momentum99 or v-power in a 100 mile radius 

Edited 23 September, 201510 yr by Rahr85

I only put V power or momentum in my VRS

I try to, but I don't have a Tesco petrol station nearby so I have to make do with JS super unleaded or V-Power, very very occasionally it gets BP Ultimate or Esso Supreme, but I consider BP to be rip off merchants & Esso not much better.

The difference being its recommended to run a higher ron fuel but the impreza very clearly states 98 or higher.