Thinking of taking the Scout to the Alps this winter...

[Pigglesberg]

As the title states, I'm looking at heading to the French Alps this winter. I've always wanted to do the drive rather than flying all the time. My questions though are:

Has anyway been over to France lately?

Is it safe etc with the whole Calais situation, going through the tunnel?

Also, I'd be taking a 3 month old baby... Bad idea?!

Just like to know people's thoughts and opinions!

Thanks

[andsoutham]

I took the ferry from dover to Calais back in july and had no problems either way but then heard a few more people were having issues after.

 

If it were me I would take the DFDS ferry from dover to Dunkirk and then drive down from there. I recently got back from a nurburgring trip in Germany and one of the guys brought his 12 week old baby and they were okay, stopped every couple of hours (loads of motorway services) and his missus sat in the back with the baby

 

Andy

[Dodgy]

I've driven to the French alps 6 times over the last 6 or 7 years, always to Haute Savoie (think Morzine, Samoens, Morillon area), but we always go in July. I've only ever done it in 2 cars, both vRS TDis. We do the drive in a single day, which is about 900 miles each way and it's nowhere near as hard as you might expect. 

Most of the problems you hear about re Calais are on the ferries, the Eurotunnel seem to have much tighter security (from my perspective).

 

All the above is summer experiences, I think doing the same drive in Winter would be much harder, possibly do it in 2 days? (you're in Liverpool, I'm in Wirral, so similar journey).

 

It is, though, a real adventure. Holiday starts as soon as we leave the driveway and nothing prepares you for the surreal feeling of seeing signs for Geneva, Milan, Chamonix etc etc when you've driven off your own driveway that morning.

 

Have fun.

 

Edit, if you might do this journey more than once, consider investing in a Sanef tolling fast tag.

Edited 2 October, 2016 by Dodgy

[GainfulShrimp]

It'll be fun, but the toll booths can be interesting if you don't have a front passenger to help deal with money etc - Dodgy's tip about the toll tag is a good one - I didn't think of that when we did it and had a couple of awkward moments.

 

Also, make sure you either have proper winter tyres or at least snow socks (or chains, if you dare using them with your alloys - but chains are a right faff!).  When it's snowing, the gendarmerie have been known to block drivers from attempting the drive up into the mountains if they haven't got the right tyres or suitable snowsocks etc.  I'm a massive convert to using winter tyres in this country too; they don't just help when it's snowy...

 

If taking the péage autoroutes (toll motorways), which I'd recommend, make sure you keep your average speed under the (pretty generous) limit.  Speed cameras on motorways in France are pretty rare, but if you reach a toll booth and your average speed since the last booth is much over the limit, you're likely to get an automatic fine (if you suspect you might have been flooring it too much - often tempting when the motorways are a higher quality than ours and tend to be less busy - just stop at a services for a break to bring your average speed down).

[Pigglesberg]

Thanks for the replies guys

Dodgy...Samoens is one of the places I'm looking at. Either there or Les Houches. Been to both a few times but obviously never done the drive! I'll definitely be breaking up the journey with the little one. I was thinking maybe stay this side near the tunnel then set off early the next day with a few stops for the kids etc. 540 miles or so from Calais isn't too bad!

Gainfulshrimp...I will be investing in some decent winter tyres as I would also use them here. I presume the snow socks are as good as chains? I remember years ago trying to fit a set of chains to my hire car up the mountain. It was -15 and 6am...lets just say it didn't go well and I nearly had frost bite even with gloves on!! Never again

I'd read about the toll tag, I'd get it just to save time stopping at the booths and hopefully beat the queues.

[Guest]

This looks similar to a website I used when driving through Spain and France whilst going on leave from Gibraltar;

http://about-france.com/mobi/driving-m-amp.htm

Not sure of the route you are taking but on my last roadtrip in 2013, I nearly got caught out with the lack of petrol stations (in contrast they are 10 a penny in Spain!). Fortunately I made it, just, to the Shell garage at Somme.

Be aware, even some of the latest services have the Pull-Squat-and Thrust toilet cubicles; "Why is there toilet paper in a shower cubicle? Ohhhhhh!!!

[PetrolDave]

We got one of the toll tags a few years ago when they became easily available to UK residents, and I would recommend it if you plan to use the peage.

 

https://www.saneftolling.co.uk

[Dodgy]

Oh forgot to add, with the toll tags, when you're approaching a Peage, look above on the gantries, there will be one or two with a number (speed limit) above, that's basically the toll booth that you can roll through without stopping as long as you keep your speed below the indicated limit on the gantry.

[Wet Kipper]

would it be worth investing in one of those carry cots which goes across the back seats and a baby can lie down and sleep in ?

means (if they sleep) you can go for longer than the 90 minutes at a time that they're supposed to spend in a car seat.

 

http://www.samueljohnston.com/en/Carrycots-for-Cars/c-72.aspx

 

we found it a real bonus, even for the 4 hour journey from us to my inlaws.

[rob_e]

Lots of good advice here.

I've driven to the Alps many times. Winter tyres are essential IMHO, plus take chains or snow socks too - better to be over prepared than not. As above, a sanef tag is a great addition - means you just drive straight through the tolls.

We normally break up the journey down, but do the return in a single trip. Only reason for having a stop on the way there is that it means that you arrive mid-day and have plenty of time to get your passes and equipment etc.

I did Samoens a couple of years back, great place - when i was there we didn't need the chains, all the roads were clear.

Our chalet was at the other side of the town to the lifts, so it meant we had to shuttle everyone to the car park at the lift and back every day - not a problem but the roof box is essential for this IMO as it means you have somewhere to put wet helmets, skis, poles, boards etc rather than inside the car.

Here's a pic:

Samoens - Haute Savoie French Alps by Rob E, on Flickr

[imikk3]

I`ve just travelled to Germany and back 2 weeks ago and I was using the tunnel. There is not a single problem apart from being delayed both ways due to some technical issue with the train and the roads are clear too towards Belgium. I usually take the ferry from Dover to Dunkirk thinking the same. I`m not sure about the ferry port at Calais though, as far as I know all the camps by the border has been moved further into the country

I can`t really give you ideas for your little one 

[jonathan.tong]

 

Edit, if you might do this journey more than once, consider investing in a Sanef tolling fast tag.

 

I'd like to second this recommendation. We got one for our night drive from the Chunnel down to the Lot and it made our journey much more pleasant as there was no faffing with tickets, cards or cash and the wrong side of the car etc. It was a little scary driving up to the ones where you don't have to stop but otherwise it worked a dream.

[Pigglesberg]

Thanks everyone for all the input, I really appreciate it. Gives me a lot of things to look at and consider.

Thanks,

Jonny

[TheOctaviator]

Drove from Barnsley to Modena and back last week. Eurotunnel was problem-free.

Peage tag is a no-brainer, especially as it annoys the Frogs when they think the stupid Brit has got in the wrong lane, only to see you whistle through in front of them!

Winter tyres are not just 'advisable', as some have said, but compulsory in Winter in the mountains.

Bon voyage.

If you're using the Dart Crossing on the M25, it's free between 10pm and 6am.

Edited 3 October, 2016 by TheOctaviator

[Dodgy]

One last tip, drive anti-clockwise around the M25 on the way down there, that avoids the Dartford crossing.

[WayTooTall]

Drove from Barnsley to Modena and back last week. Eurotunnel was problem-free.

Peage tag is a no-brainer, especially as it annoys the Frogs when they think the stupid Brit has got in the wrong lane, only to see you whistle through in front of them!

Winter tyres are not just 'advisable', as some have said, but compulsory in Winter in the mountains.

Bon voyage.

If you're using the Dart Crossing on the M25, it's free between 10pm and 6am.

 

If you do use the Dart, there are no toll booths anymore. It is like the congestion charging, they just take note of your reg and it is up to you to go and pay it. If you don't remember, a fine will be on its way to you.

[Gabbo]

I guess travelling with a baby you should always prepare for the worst & hope for the best.

Even if you plan a short distance that day take enough water/milk/food to last a day & a night especially if you will be in the mountain régions.

Also, blankets, snow shovel, thermos, coffee, food etc

 

As in recent years, bad weather can come quickly & can cause overnight queues even on the highways.

 

I would also check your breakdown cover is adequate as you don't wait days for help if you have a breakdown, damaged Wheel etc.

 

 

My advice would be to avoid chains, they are heavy, difficult to fit & can cause lots of damage to the wheels & surrounding trim.

You also need to have a Wheel width thin enough to allow you to fit them with adequate clearance.

If conditions are really that bad its best to find somewhere safe & warm & wait for the snow to stop & ploughs to do their job.

The roads will also be chaos will lots of drivers stopping in inaprropriate places to fit them or using them where they are not necessary.

 

Snow socks are cheap but there are also some good hybrid style chains you can fit to normal width wheels:

e.g. http://gb.michelin-lifestyle.com/en/michelin-easy-grip-snow-chains-1
These can at least get you out of a difficult situation & like socks are quick & easy to fit.

Edited 4 October, 2016 by Gabbo

[Pigglesberg]

Thanks Gabbo, sounds like great advice. Everyone has been great, that's why I love this forum!

With the snow socks, I presume I'd be allowed up the mountain and not stopped because I don't have chains?! I presume they're accepted in the same way?

[Gabbo]

I can't say for sure as I've never been stopped but I'd imagine it would be down to their discretion.

However, from what I've seen they only check when the weather or forecast is very very bad.

 

The checkpoints are usually on main trunk roads where there are stopping places for fitting snow chains & close to populated areas where you could also find somewhere to wait it out.

 

Perhaps I'm a bit over-cautious but if the police are telling me the roads ahead are difficult enough to require snowchains I would probably turn-back/stop in the village & wait for the weather to improve.

 

On the main roads & in the resorts they have plenty of equipment to keep the roads drivable so once the snow has stopped it doesn't take long for the to get the traffic flowing again even at night.

 

 

I've driven with the Skoda into the mountains many times the last few winters & you'd be suprised how useful a good set of winter tyres can be.

Even in conditions where I was very nervous if we should continue, I had no problems making it to our destination.

I do however have the advantage of living only a hour or so away from the slopes so have the choice to stay at home when the weather does look clear or forecast is bad.

[Gromle]

Are snowsocks or chains a requirement even with wintertyres?

[cheezemonkhai]

FYI, snow socks are no replacement for snow chains.

 

If a road requires chains are on and you have socks, you're not going anywhere.

There are some easy to fit chains, basically you put a plate over a couple of wheel nuts, then on the mountain you just clip onto that.

 

http://www.snowchains.com/car-snow-chains/thule-k-summit?ts=0

 

Cheap is not a word to use with easy fit though.

[Gromle]

Why not just buy good wintertyres?

Ive never had the need for chains with good tyres.

[cheezemonkhai]

Why not just buy good wintertyres?

Ive never had the need for chains with good tyres.

 

Because some roads in the mountains have the snow chains required signs and if you don't have them, you're not allowed on the road.

Good winter tyres are great, but no use if there is for example a large drift of lose snow or a polished ice corner next to a huge drop.

 

Also worth mentioning is that we can't use studded tyres, so it's friction only.

Plus even the Hakka R2 wouldn't be much good with the carbide grains in the tyres, as when it rains they're not as good as dealing with the water as the central european winter tyres.

 

It's a trade off, we drop snow/ice performance for road life and water performance.

Edited 6 October, 2016 by cheezemonkhai

[Gromle]

Because some roads in the mountains have the snow chains required signs and if you don't have them, you're not allowed on the road.

Good winter tyres are great, but no use if there is for example a large drift of lose snow or a polished ice corner next to a huge drop.

Also worth mentioning is that we can't use studded tyres, so it's friction only.

Plus even the Hakka R2 wouldn't be much good with the carbide grains in the tyres, as when it rains they're not as good as dealing with the water as the central european winter tyres.

It's a trade off, we drop snow/ice performance for road life and water performance.

Thanks, that answered my previous question if chains is required

Studded tyres are great, but my next set will be without studds. The winters up north are getting warmer...