Fuel Leak!

[rum4mo]

I have corrected my posting where I incorrectly described these fuel rail/injector clamping bolts as M4 to the correct size which is M6 X 16mm with what looks like being a Torx cap head, originally 8.8 grade but maybe now 10.9!

[Eeeekkk]

Do not take Skoda's initial no as a final answer,that's exactly what they said to me first. Then I wrote them a letter before action suggesting I'd take it to the Small Claims court and they decided to pay.

[Lemto]

4 hours ago, Eeeekkk said:

Do not take Skoda's initial no as a final answer,that's exactly what they said to me first. Then I wrote them a letter before action suggesting I'd take it to the Small Claims court and they decided to pay.

 

I would be tempted to do the same mate but the only reason I didn't even contact them is because Im pretty sure I've voided my warranty by modifying the car. Although all of the jobs weren't related to the engine and were done by a trusted, professional mechanic they will probably try to pin the issue to my modifications. The customer service rep pretty much said because the job wasn't completed by a Skoda Technician they can't do anything. 

[Eeeekkk]

Like I say, that's what they told me. I got my garage to write me a letter outlining the fault, but in the end they didn't even ask to see it. They never asked to see my car. Worth the cost of a stamp when there is obviously a bigger issue here and not just a one off.

My argument was that the bolt was obviously faulty at manufacture, and therefore they are responsible.

[Jonnobris2]

So this just happened to me too. Luckily still under Approved used warranty. All ok yesterday, got into car and took longer than usual to start, which was odd, quickly followed by EPC error and Error with Auto Start Stop. Had to do school run so did that but car stank of fuel. Car was stuttering and down on power. Managed to get home and called skoda assist, AA out within an hour and replacement Octavia whilst mine is being looked at. The AA guy showed me the dripping fuel from the injector. Glad this happened close to home! Will report back when fixed. Also a 110 1.2 tsi 2017 Fabia. 

[rum4mo]

Okay, so that is now 3 Briskoda members with 2016-2017 VW Group 1.2TSI - so far all 110PS engine versions if that really does mean anything - I'd doubt it, with this potentially serious and car occupant safety issue, hum!

 

I feel now and again that I should chat to local VW dealership about this as my wife has a 2015 Polo 1.2TSI 16V 110PS - but I think that they will stone wall me as all I'm quoting or using is normal internet chatter and the subject cars are all Skodas and so will have Skoda built engines in them - me letting them into the secret that all these engines of that family were built in Skoda factories will count for nothing.

 

All I'm trying to discover is if this issue only covered a short engine build period - Skoda should find that easy to work out as they built all these engines, and to be told what recovery action(s) were taken, down to the finer detail ie did they change the M6 X 16mm Torx headed bolts supplier, or did they change the bolt strength/quality? If they did, I don't mind buying and fitting a new improved set of bolts, to me that sounds better than having any car my family are in ending up going on fire for a known fault/failure.

 

This sort of thing sounds a lot like it should have ended up as a formal safety recall - or maybe only a "when its in for service action" - which is extremely naughty if it does end up being the best that VW Group will be offering for this fault/failure.

Edited 16 January, 2020 by rum4mo

[rum4mo]

@Lemto, did you ever get the info from your mechanic as to which grade of bolt he used to sort your car? 

 

I would be replacing all 4 of these bolts if one failed, especially as the root cause of the failure is not known from VW Group, better to be safe than sorry.

[KenONeill]

8 minutes ago, rum4mo said:

so far all 110PS engine versions if that really does mean anything

Unless that's the only engine this size and grade of set screw is used on, I don't think it does. (opinion about failure from someone who did metallurgy stated up-thread)

[rum4mo]

19 minutes ago, KenONeill said:

Unless that's the only engine this size and grade of set screw is used on, I don't think it does. (opinion about failure from someone who did metallurgy stated up-thread)

 

I know that the same parts are used on both engines, but just added that in - in case.

 

Edit:- from Erwin it looks likes these fuel rail mounting bolts should be torqued to 9Nm,hardly excessive torque for an M6 bolt in 8.8 grade, if in fact that is the torque that ended up being applied to these 4 fasteners at the engine build plant.

 

Another Edit:- recommended torque, which I'd think means max torque setting for an M6 8.8 grade bolt is 11.6 or 12Nm, the same recommendation for an M6 10.8 grade is 16 or 17Nm - just for information and ignoring the properties of the material that they are getting bolted into.

Edited 16 January, 2020 by rum4mo

[rum4mo]

This bolt, which is P/N N105 464 03, is used across the VW Group marques from applications like securing ABS wheel sensors to securing small brackets down onto cylinder heads, but maybe this is the only application where the load on the bolt is always changing as combustion pressures change throughout the combustion cycle and engine load range - ie it will experience the short sharp pulses from the firing of the individual cylinders.

 

The 1.0TSI 3 cylinder engines seem to only have 2 self tapping bolts holding their fuel rail down onto the head though, so maybe this is more a faulty batch of bolts than an under spec'd bolt - either way VW Group should be taking steps to identify and rectify across a certain engine build time period, having petrol running out and down the front of a car is not funny!

[Mattheboy]

Hi all. It looks like this same issue has happened to me this afternoon. Car wouldn't start, tried it a number of times and when I got out petrol was running down my mum's drive. Will phone Skoda tomorrow and see what they say.

[Lemto]

59 minutes ago, Mattheboy said:

Hi all. It looks like this same issue has happened to me this afternoon. Car wouldn't start, tried it a number of times and when I got out petrol was running down my mum's drive. Will phone Skoda tomorrow and see what they say.

Disappointed to see this has happened to someone else. Hope you get it sorted Matt! Let's us know how it unfolds. 

[rum4mo]

41 minutes ago, Lemto said:

Disappointed to see this has happened to someone else. Hope you get it sorted Matt! Let's us know how it unfolds. 

 

Yes, possibly 4th reported bolt failure on this section of Briskoda!

 

[rum4mo]

1 hour ago, Mattheboy said:

Hi all. It looks like this same issue has happened to me this afternoon. Car wouldn't start, tried it a number of times and when I got out petrol was running down my mum's drive. Will phone Skoda tomorrow and see what they say.

 

It would help if you could tell us which engine type was in your car and its power output - also the approximate build date or reg date of your car.  Just in case this goes on and on and later reader/posters have all the facts to hand.

[Mattheboy]

It's a 66 plate 2016 model, 1.2 TSI Colour Edition. Can't remember the power output but seem to remember it was the higher of the two options.

[rum4mo]

Thanks, that all fits in with the previous cars that this has happened to, good luck tomorrow, maybe mention this is the 4th Fabia 1.2TSI 110PS that this has happened to on a single motoring forum - ie not an isolated incident and over a period of 8 months!

 

Edit:- 6MT = 110PS,  5MT = 90PS.

Edited 11 February, 2020 by rum4mo

[Eeeekkk]

I'm not sure whether mine is a 110? It's a five speed, are the 110s six? Very worrying to see so many similar faults though.

[Mattheboy]

Will certainly bring it up when they get back to me. It's a pity really because up until now I have been really happy with it, even recommended it to my in laws (let's hope they don't have the same issue or I will be in the bad books).

[rum4mo]

1 hour ago, Eeeekkk said:

I'm not sure whether mine is a 110? It's a five speed, are the 110s six? Very worrying to see so many similar faults though.

 

As far as I know, all manual gearboxes fitted to 1.2TSI 16V 90PS were 5 speed, and all manual gearboxes fitted to 1.2TSI 16V 110PS were 6 speed.

[Mattheboy]

Mine is 5 speed also so that would fit

[Eeeekkk]

Mine is a 90 then 🙂

[Mattheboy]

Skoda have got back to me, a pin has failed in the fuel pump causing it to leak, sound familiar. They are going to look if they can offer me a good will gesture, if not they said to go to Skoda customer services.

[Lemto]

41 minutes ago, Mattheboy said:

Skoda have got back to me, a pin has failed in the fuel pump causing it to leak, sound familiar. They are going to look if they can offer me a good will gesture, if not they said to go to Skoda customer services.

I hope the forum has helped mate. I personally used to underestimate the power of sites like this, it's incredibly reassuring at times to be able to speak to people who have been in your shoes, being able to provide some insight. You done the right thing and contacted Skoda, I should've done the same! Live and learn as they say. 

[Mattheboy]

It has been really helpful, when I told the dealership that I was the 4th in 6 months he was taken aback. In the first instance they are going to contact Skoda on my behalf and if that doesn't work I will have to contact them myself.

[Lemto]

Just now, Mattheboy said:

It has been really helpful, when I told the dealership that I was the 4th in 6 months he was taken aback. In the first instance they are going to contact Skoda on my behalf and if that doesn't work I will have to contact them myself.

Brilliant, I'm glad you said to them about other owners having similar issues. We may be out of pocket as a result but hopefully it uncovers an issue that could potential injure someone, rendering the occurrence highly unlikely. As I said before, please do keep us informed of the outcome.