1.5TSI DSG wheelspin when pressing accelerator from stop

[stever750]

Just driven mine properly today, its a manual though. No chance of the 1.5tsi engine breaking traction. I also have a very steep drive, must be around 25% gradient, with a cement top surface, I can pull out of it forwards (uphill) without any traction issues either. 

[Widescreen]

Bridgestones on my neighbour's S3 Audi, and my beema no problems at all with wheelspin. My brother in laws golf gtd dsg spun the wheels in 2nd on Yokohamas today.

Seems to me its not the tyres, more so the Karoq power output and gearing in first. 

[Berisford]

1 hour ago, Widescreen said:

Bridgestones on my neighbour's S3 Audi, and my beema no problems at all with wheelspin. My brother in laws golf gtd dsg spun the wheels in 2nd on Yokohamas today.

Seems to me its not the tyres, more so the Karoq power output and gearing in first. 

 You might be right Widescreen.....I'm on Michelin Cross Climates and had the devils own job to move off on this bend last night after stopping for a large vehicle coming down. It is quite steep and tight but my offside front just wouldn't grip despite very little throttle. 1.0 DSG

https://goo.gl/maps/TX1hwvLcVqMdYwzV9

 

[Gmac983]

Anybody know what the weight distribution front to rear is in these smaller engine karoqs? 

[Ootohere]

Much the same as with the 1.2 TSI DSG Yeti's and there is the same thing happening as many had with them and still are.

 

It is what you can expect to get if you have what you call a SUV that is just a tall Hatchback with FWD & a small / not heavy petrol turbo engine and twin dry clutch gearbox. Looks like a AWD and is not,  so just fit the right tyres and drive according to the cars ability.

 

FWD Small capacity turbo engine's that rev easily with a 7 speed DQ200 DSG with first gear that changes up by around 6mph.

A light foot is needed, or put the car in ECO mode if there is no 'Snow Mode' which there is not.

Maybe even put TC (ASR) off in some situations. 

Edited 2 December, 2019 by Roottootemoot

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Roottootemoot said:

1: It is what you can expect to get if you have what you call a SUV that is just a tall Hatchback with FWD & a small / not heavy petrol turbo engine and twin dry clutch gearbox. Looks like a AWD and is not,  so just fit the right tyres and drive according to the cars ability.

 

2: FWD Small capacity turbo engine's that rev easily with a 7 speed DQ200 DSG with first gear that changes up by around 6mph.

A light foot is needed, or put the car in ECO mode if there is no 'Snow Mode' which there is not.

Maybe even put TC (ASR) off in some situations. 

 

2: That's what I find - just have to adapt driving style and use a very light right foot. Already have car in ECO and others who've driven it still spin the wheels ( they don't realise it, I just sit in the passenger seat thinking of how soon the tyres are going to last ). Power delivery seems almost instant in the 1.5DSG Karoq as opposed to my 1.4tsi Octavia. Never driven an EV but wouldn't be surprised if they'd suffer the same fate.

 

1: Test drove both a 1.5DSG Ateca and a 1.5DSG Tiguan ( although Tiguan may have DQ381 ). Absolutely no wheelspin when I drove them and that was on a bitterly cold morning.

 

Not aware of this being reported on SEAT / VW or Audi forums. Well only one person did on SEAT forum and from reading their previous post, I think he/she was using poetic licence. There's no report of this on Briskodas own Kodiaq forum either.

 

Is this a relatively new phenomenon with Karoq or has it existed from day 1?

 

PS - what do you mean by "if you have what you call a SUV"?  It is an SUV - it's not what I call it, it's what the world in general calls it. There is no definition of SUV but it's widely accepted it means something with higher ground clearence.  Your definition of it being a tall hatchback is quite wrong. To the best of my knowledge a tall hatchback is generally referred to as an MPV such as the Renault Scenic, Citroen C4, 2 series tourer.

 

 

 

[Ootohere]

Widely called as good spin, but neither sports utilities or suburban utilities, so maybe a cross over with not that much ground clearance or ability other than getting up kerbs with fwd unless driven to the conditions and tyres fitted.   The Kamiq is being called the 3rd suv in the range, available with optional lower suspension and the same ability to spin the front wheels. Really they are 5 door hatchbacks. 

[Gmac983]

Ah you bet me to it @Roottootemoot

 

@Scot5

I think the term you are looking for is "crossover". That term seams to cover all the raised ride height and crucially 2wd vehicles that some refer to as SUV's that are basically just hatchbacks with a bit more ground clearance, defo not MPV's. 

Personally I would only refer to larger vehicles like the kodiaq and upwards into other brands like LR discovery and the like as SUV's (not directly comparing kodiaq to discovery BTW before anyone says so). 

Edited 2 December, 2019 by Gmac983

[Ootohere]

There are engine versions that can not even have a towbar fitted for towing and some will not fit one so that a bike rack can be fitted to a tow ball.

That about rules them out as a SUV, Mini SUV or City SUV. ie Lifestylee vehicles for work, rest and play making them a Multi Person Vehicle or Mini Multi Person Vehicle AKA a passenger car.

Edited 2 December, 2019 by Roottootemoot

[extouran]

       According to DVLC  my Karoq  is a Petrol Estate Car  ( with very occasional wheelspin ! )

[robby_red]

5 minutes ago, extouran said:

       According to DVLC  my Karoq  is a Petrol Estate Car  ( with very occasional wheelspin ! )

Yeah I would say it's more a high estate car than an SUV especially the 2WD version

[TheWibbler]

I have a 1.0 SE DSG fitted with the Bridgestones and I get wheel spin when pulling off when the wheels are at an angle with anything more than a mild pedal.  

[Orville]

My 1.5TSI DSG loves to spin it's near-side wheel whenever I use moderate or higher acceleration from standstill. I had the alignment checked twice by the dealers and each time they have said all is fine. I put the cars squealy-nature down to relatively-skinny low-end tyres on a car with a light-nose and high/springy suspension. The DSG gearbox is also a little less controllable/adjustable than a manual would be.

[Grumpy Geaser]

Interesting Thread. I have the 1.0L and it will spin/ scrabble tyres when pulling away at junctions on wet surfaces - the TCS is woefully slow at responding - having said that last car was 4x4 Yeti. The Hankook tyres on my Karoq are not the grippiest but it is embarrassingly easy to break traction even with the 'little' engine

[Schtum]

SUV, crossover, tall hatchback -  they're all just names used as descriptions that are more or less accurate.  

 

As Alfred Korzybki wrote in Science and Sanity: An Introduction to Non-Aristotelian Systems and General Semantics.    "A map is not the territory it represents, but, if correct, it has a similar structure to the territory, which accounts for its usefulness."    

 

In other words, the name is not the thing named and the description is not the thing described or as Shakespeare wrote in Romeo and Juliet, "A rose by any other name would smell as sweet".

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Map–territory_relation

[silver1011]

Did you post in the wrong forum!? 😂

[Guest]

4 hours ago, silver1011 said:

Did you post in the wrong forum!? 😂

 

I've never heard of Alf before but he sounds rather confused.  "A map has a similar structure to the territory" Is that so?   I have a map of Loch lomond but it's not wet.  Should I be worried?     

 

Back on subject - have 400 miles worth on the tyres now, set mode back from Eco to Norm and there's no wheelspin now. ( or at least not at the speed I drive there isn't ). I think it was just down to being brand new tyres.

Edited 22 December, 2019 by Guest

[GlosJanner]

Yes, this frustrates the hell out of me. Can't have the car in S when pulling out in wet conditions and the electronic traction control is a waste of space. Doesn't cut the power like a mechanical one would and the tyres are tramping all over the place.

 

[Schtum]

44 minutes ago, Scot5 said:

 

I've never heard of Alf before but he sounds rather confused.  "A map has a similar structure to the territory" Is that so?   I have a map of Loch lomond but it's not wet.  Should I be worried?     

 

 

 

Some of the stuff that Korzybski wrote was certainly a bit strange but that bit about the map and territory is one of the central points of Semantics Theory.  The point is that what you call anything is only helpful if it is a reasonably accurate representation of what it is in the real world.  

Calling a car an SUV infers that it has some kind of off-road ability which usually comes with AWD.  Buying a tall car which will inevitably suffer from weight transfer to the rear when you take off, especially if you do so quickly and expecting it not to spin its wheels is almost as daft as expecting 

your map of Loch Lomond to be wet.  HTH

[Fitzwilliam]

5 minutes ago, GlosJanner said:

Yes, this frustrates the hell out of me. Can't have the car in S when pulling out in wet conditions and the electronic traction control is a waste of space. Doesn't cut the power like a mechanical one would and the tyres are tramping all over the place.

 

I’ve got a DSG box Skoda admittedly it’s a VRS Fabia, it’s the first auto box car I’ve ever had, even with the wide (215/40 17s) tyres it’s all too easy to spin up the wheels from a standstill particularly if the road is greasy, I think the clutch engagement is rather keen if you prod the accelerator a bit quick, coupled with the gear ratio of first being very low, it’s tricky but with a bit of practice it is possible to apply enough accelerator movement to get away smartly without wheel spin, also best to leave it in D rather than S.

[Sanqhar]

17 hours ago, Schtum said:

 

Some of the stuff that Korzybski wrote was certainly a bit strange but that bit about the map and territory is one of the central points of Semantics Theory.  The point is that what you call anything is only helpful if it is a reasonably accurate representation of what it is in the real world.  

Calling a car an SUV infers that it has some kind of off-road ability which usually comes with AWD.  Buying a tall car which will inevitably suffer from weight transfer to the rear when you take off, especially if you do so quickly and expecting it not to spin its wheels is almost as daft as expecting 

your map of Loch Lomond to be wet.  HTH

While we are into semantics ...”Calling a car a SUV” implies not infers.  On someone reading/hearing it they may infer the meaning.

 

tom 

[Ootohere]

@Fitzwilliam

Just imagine your car with the OEM 205/40 R 17 tyres rather than what you have on now.  They fitted some real horror show ones.

Good 205 or 215's can make a big difference from ones that can be considered ditch or hit a kerb finders.

 

You do have a twincharger that can produce 180ps plus and the DQ200 up to 2012 behaves different from the software they had when the CTHE engines were fitted.

Drivers of the twinchargers get used to letting them roll a bit and not just flooring it, and that works with a 1.0, 1.2 or 1.4 / 1.5 TSI.

(TC off with a Twincharger is good as well, and a light right foot from a standstill.)

 

Like anything, Simply drive it like you borrowed it, or to the conditions, and learn what is needed...

 

Actually it is Supercharger from 800 rpm, then Super & Turbo under load then turbo alone. 

No idea about previous generation being 6 speed, Fabia were Manual and 6 speed DSG not a DQ200.

 

 

Edited 23 December, 2019 by Roottootemoot

[Fitzwilliam]

27 minutes ago, Roottootemoot said:

@Fitzwilliam

Just imagine your car with the OEM 205/40 R 17 tyres rather than what you have on now.  They fitted some real horror show ones.

Good 205 or 215's can make a big difference from ones that can be considered ditch or hit a kerb finders.

 

You do have a twincharger that can produce 180ps plus and the DQ200 up to 2012 behaves different from the software they had when the CTHE engines were fitted.

Drivers of the twinchargers get used to letting them roll a bit and not just flooring it, and that works with a 1.0, 1.2 or 1.4 / 1.5 TSI.

(TC off with a Twincharger is good as well, and a light right foot from a standstill.)

 

Like anything, Simply drive it like you borrowed it, or to the conditions, and learn what is needed...

 

Actually it is Supercharger from 800 rpm, then Super & Turbo under load then turbo alone. 

No idea about previous generation being 6 speed, Fabia were Manual and 6 speed DSG not a DQ200.

 

 

Totally agree with what you’re saying, as this is the only DSG, in fact only auto car of any kind I’ve owned so I can’t comment how it likely performs with other engines, I had a Rapid 1.2tsi Sport for a couple of years but that was manual, that would set off smartly without wheel spin if I remember correctly but being turbo only there’s always a little lag at very low revs until the boost starts under load, if I accelerated hard from low revs in a gear you could feel the shove come in strong at about 2300rpm. My big bugbear about DSG is although with the Twincharger there is prodigious torque from 2000rpm the box insists on dropping down several gears if you accelerate hard and flings the Rev counter  needle towards the redline. Where less than blistering acceleration is needed I’ve started using manual and using my favourite main road overtaking gear, 4th and then applying hard but progressive amount of throttle so I avoid a needless downchange, I do the same when dealing with uphill or downhill gradients where the box tends to always select a lower gear than is really needed.

[Ootohere]

@Fitzwilliam

2,400 -3,500 RPM it is Supercharger & Turbo when under load, giving it throttle, or at speed above 3,500 rpm and drop a gear or 3 and Supercharger on demand with turbo.

 

There is a reason that it drops down gears to have the RPM where the PS and torque is at its max. 

That was the point of the 1.4TSI that produced the power & performance of the VW V5 or V6 and gave better economy.

 

The gears selected are dependent on throttle position and i do not mean the kick down, there is a position under acceleration that matters.

As to 1st gear that is really just to move off, and you really need to be nearly stopped for it to drop into first gear.

There are many different generations of DQ200 DSG softwares from 2009, the DQ200 is used in 28 different applications.

Edited 23 December, 2019 by Roottootemoot

[KenONeill]

2 hours ago, Sanqhar said:

.”Calling a car a SUV” implies

Suburban Useless Vehicle for example.