Hi everyone, 

 

I am seeking some advice on the current situation and options available. 

I have a 2017 superb 2.0tdi Sportline DSG. Originally purchased in 2018 from Skoda UK via RRG Skoda. The car had 5k on the clock at the time. I have since maintained tha car with Skoda only up until this year where I took it to an approved VW garage locally. The car has only just turned to 30k in October and the 3 year warranty ran out at the end of September. 

On the way to work one morning on the 17th November as I was pulling into works carpark the car just randomly jolted and a warning popped up saying "Gearbox in emergency mode no reverse gear". So I literally limped the car luckily 10 yards to the work carpark and called Skoda straight away. I had to get a recovery vehicle to put the car on the back to take it over to Skoda since I didn't want to drive it and cause any further damage. After skoda charged me £140 for diagnostic they confirmed that the part within the gearbox has failed and it now needs a new gearbox at £5k cost. They said to hold tight as Skoda might be able to offer a good will since its only just out of warranty by a month and a bit and taking into account cars condition. They soon called back and said that Skoda will not accept it as a warranty claim but as good will gesture they will pay for the parts 100% and only the 50% towards the labour leaving me with a final bill of £700. I have expressed my gratitude for the offer of course but considering the car's condition I wouldn't expect a whole gearbox to go after 30k especially its a DSG which you cannot break yourself as a user error. Skoda have refused to budge and I have since escalated to the Skoda UK MD directly who transferred the complaint to his PA. They have offered to look into it and since come back now stating that after speaking to the dealer who has done investigation who is Alex Lawrie Skoda Liverpool by the way, they cannot confirm what has caused the gearbox to fail. Since the car is out of warranty they are not able to move on the good will offer at all. 

I had explained that I had to already pay £140 diagnostic, £75 for a skoda courtesy car fully comp insurance premium (apparently that's what they charge everyone) and on top of that I had to hire a car for £120 when they couldnt offer a courtesy car. 

 

My question is, I'm I being unreasonable asking skoda to fully cover the repair bill!? I wouldn't expect a full gearbox to fail on a car of such low mileage and being fully serviced by Skoda themselves. 

According to Skoda Resolution Team my only option now is motor ombudsman... 

 

Any recommendations or thoughts guys are welcome as I feel at this moment never owning a Skoda again. 

 

Cheers

 

Russ

I think you have been offered a fairly good deal. The extra charges you have paid sound a little much. 75 for insurance? Eh? Then 120 for a hire car anyway. Should you not get the 75 back at least? It's not technically a warranty claim so those additional bits I would expect are on you but would definitely be looking at what you got for those costs.

Given the alternative and god knows how long to wait with all the associated costs i would take up the offer....... it is worrying though on such a car.

10 minutes ago, MarkyG82 said:

I think you have been offered a fairly good deal. The extra charges you have paid sound a little much. 75 for insurance? Eh? Then 120 for a hire car anyway. Should you not get the 75 back at least? It's not technically a warranty claim so those additional bits I would expect are on you but would definitely be looking at what you got for those costs.

Yeah the charges seem unreasonable hence why I am asking skoda to compromise a little more on their offer.

I know what you mean its not technically a warranty claim although we are only talking a month out. The garage called me and confirmed its a warranty issue because the part has failed in the gearbox when they opened it up they could see it was a defect as they said it without any hesitation. Now they are backtracking which makes me frustrated a little. 

If your car was written off and your insurance had only expired by one month I think you would be snapping up an offer like that towards a new vehicle.

26 minutes ago, J.R. said:

If your car was written off and your insurance had only expired by one month I think you would be snapping up an offer like that towards a new vehicle.

Totally irrelevant comment.

 

Skoda can and do do goodwill 100%. If this is a manufacturing fault, which it appears to be, then existing consumer legislation covers such defects up to 6 years, although in the case of cars, its not straightforward. I have had 100% goodwill on parts and labour outside of warranty, but it is tiresome having to argue with Skoda Uk and reminding them of consumer laws. To help them to change their mind, tell them how you had planned to change the car for a new one, another Skoda, but now that is in doubt. Then the case manager can take loyalty argument that to their boss to justify paying for everything.

 

Get a full written report of the fault the dealer technicians found and get them to state if its a manufacturing defect. You can use that, ultimately to lodge a claim in the small claims court.

Edited 4 December, 20205 yr by xman

Not irrelevant, I was responding to the question  the OP asked, was he being unreasonable in expecting Skoda to fully cover a repair bill for a car out of warranty?

 

I dont question that Skoda could do 100% goodwill or that they could eventually after a prolonged legal battle be forced to do the repairs if it can be proved to be a manufacturing fault.

 

The very essence of goodwill is that it should be recieved in the same spirit that it is given, if its not then it has been a wasted gesture, I have pro-actively offered a goodwill solution to a client who was in fact being really out of order, I did so in the hope of moving forward and not losing a customer, he did not see it in the same way and tried to exploit the situation which was of his own making, I withdrew the offer as I had already lost his custom & would not want him to return.

 

I was taken to court, his claim was thrown out and my counterclaim granted 100%.

 

I'd take the money and run.  Have the work done and then either sell the car and get a manual gearbox version or something else entirely if you no longer trust or aren't happy with Skoda as a brand.

Alternatively keep the car hoping that the new gearbox is better or even if not, just get rid when another 30k miles are on the horizon.

Either way, I think you'd be wise to accept Skoda's offer. 

As above, take the deal. You could go legal claiming a 3 year old failure like that suggests not fit for purpose, but even if you are successful it could cost you a good deal more than £750 to resolve. 

If you take the deal then as you are paying some money then the gearbox should get a two year warranty. This wouldn't be the case if you got it done Free of Charge. 

 

Myself I'd say £700 as a final bill is not a bad outcome.

10 hours ago, xman said:

Totally irrelevant comment.

 

Skoda can and do do goodwill 100%. If this is a manufacturing fault, which it appears to be, then existing consumer legislation covers such defects up to 6 years, although in the case of cars, its not straightforward. I have had 100% goodwill on parts and labour outside of warranty, but it is tiresome having to argue with Skoda Uk and reminding them of consumer laws. To help them to change their mind, tell them how you had planned to change the car for a new one, another Skoda, but now that is in doubt. Then the case manager can take loyalty argument that to their boss to justify paying for everything.

 

Get a full written report of the fault the dealer technicians found and get them to state if its a manufacturing defect. You can use that, ultimately to lodge a claim in the small claims court.

Yep completely agree, it's just the case of obtaining the report now and seeing what they have actually written in there. 

I have been polite with them all the way through as I don't want to come across argumentative but as you correctly pointed out just politely reminding them of the consumer legislation and a bit of understanding.

The small claims procedure has crossed my mind, but the case is hugely reliant on the report and the findings. Will post it once I get my hands on it. 

I don't think I am being unreasonable in asking and equally I don't see myself being the only one in the Skoda community who has faced this. So any advice is always much appreciated thank you. 

 

 

31 minutes ago, bigjohn said:

If you take the deal then as you are paying some money then the gearbox should get a two year warranty. This wouldn't be the case if you got it done Free of Charge. 

 

Myself I'd say £700 as a final bill is not a bad outcome.

Thanks for that. 

I thought the warranty comes with the part itself if it's replaced either paid or free of charge!? I was under the impression that any work carried out by the dealership will carry an element of guarantee hence their prices are a lot higher than others??

2 hours ago, J.R. said:

Not irrelevant, I was responding to the question  the OP asked, was he being unreasonable in expecting Skoda to fully cover a repair bill for a car out of warranty?

 

I dont question that Skoda could do 100% goodwill or that they could eventually after a prolonged legal battle be forced to do the repairs if it can be proved to be a manufacturing fault.

 

The very essence of goodwill is that it should be recieved in the same spirit that it is given, if its not then it has been a wasted gesture, I have pro-actively offered a goodwill solution to a client who was in fact being really out of order, I did so in the hope of moving forward and not losing a customer, he did not see it in the same way and tried to exploit the situation which was of his own making, I withdrew the offer as I had already lost his custom & would not want him to return.

 

I was taken to court, his claim was thrown out and my counterclaim granted 100%.

 

I can see your point mate, and I don't disagree fully with what you are saying. The only difference would be a wrong doing by yourself, or by someone else (in this case car manufacturer). This would have a completely different outcome on the situation. 

 

I fully agree with the good will being received the same as being offered otherwise it defeats the object. 

I am not sure what happened in your case and from what you have said the customer has been out of order then I would probably have done the same. However it all depends on the circumstances and each case shouldn't be treated equally. 

 

If anything the biggest surprise is such a big part on the car going completely kaput without any warnings or indication and its not something I would have expected from the German group. I think if it was a fuel pump or something minor like that then I wouldnt be even here and would have just paid it. 

If you or a warranty company pay all or part for parts there is a 2 year parts and labour warranty.

 

If VW Group are paying for the parts not so.

 

The labour being paid for to fit parts requires the Dealership / Repairer to be doing a competent job.

 

The Past Brand Directors & Skoda UK, all 3 of them usually a a 'Resolutions Manager' handle the claims, not a PA.

It's also a lesson to learn that if you have anything replaced during warranty period to see if the dealer will let you pay towards the bill. You get the full 2 years cover then. If not then you are only covered to the end of the warranty. Even if only a day left.

9 hours ago, e-Roottoot said:

If you or a warranty company pay all or part for parts there is a 2 year parts and labour warranty.

 

If VW Group are paying for the parts not so.

 

The labour being paid for to fit parts requires the Dealership / Repairer to be doing a competent job.

 

The Past Brand Directors & Skoda UK, all 3 of them usually a a 'Resolutions Manager' handle the claims, not a PA.

Thanks for that, something I have learnt new today!! 

I know it’s not the same situation but I fell foul of the dodgy sach’s clutch on my old mk2 superb 2.0 diesel manual at 56k miles where the clutch pressure plate fails and machines it’s way through the gearbox housing and that ended up costing me £2k at my usual independent (didn’t realise it was likely to be so catastrophic at first and the car hadn’t been back to Skoda due to not wanting the dieselgate update and by the time they had taken the gearbox out to find what I then suspected to be true Skoda didn’t want to know...)

New gearbox housing, full rebuild and new clutch and dual mass flywheel, cha ching!

if someone had told me I could’ve spent £600 before to replace the clutch and flywheel I would’ve jumped at it, hindsight eh?!

£700 is a bitter pill to swallow (and all the extras I’ll admit) but I’d still be tempted to take it and get the car sorted, at least then you can either keep it or shift it quick.

I seriously  considered scrapping the car but due to still owing money on it at the time couldn’t. (As it was I drove it on until 87k with no issues when I got my mk3)

1 hour ago, SkudMissile21 said:

I know it’s not the same situation but I fell foul of the dodgy sach’s clutch on my old mk2 superb 2.0 diesel manual at 56k miles where the clutch pressure plate fails and machines it’s way through the gearbox housing and that ended up costing me £2k at my usual independent (didn’t realise it was likely to be so catastrophic at first and the car hadn’t been back to Skoda due to not wanting the dieselgate update and by the time they had taken the gearbox out to find what I then suspected to be true Skoda didn’t want to know...)

New gearbox housing, full rebuild and new clutch and dual mass flywheel, cha ching!

if someone had told me I could’ve spent £600 before to replace the clutch and flywheel I would’ve jumped at it, hindsight eh?!

£700 is a bitter pill to swallow (and all the extras I’ll admit) but I’d still be tempted to take it and get the car sorted, at least then you can either keep it or shift it quick.

I seriously  considered scrapping the car but due to still owing money on it at the time couldn’t. (As it was I drove it on until 87k with no issues when I got my mk3)

Yikes, that's a hefty bill to pick up! I've had something similar with my vw polo 1.9tdi which had an issue with the dual mass that had to be replaced twice by VW under warranty as it just kept going. It sounds like there must be some weakness in their clutch/gearbox department. Although I always thought a DSG is highly regarded due to its quality, maybe not so much for reliability...

It certainly sounds like I will have to take the bitter pill and accept my faith with this one and see where I end up with the car in the long run. I love the car and everything about it, but the thought of anything else going on it so big just makes me think twice of keeping especially it being out of warranty. Will see what Skoda say on Monday regarding the final say on this and will probably take it from there. Maybe I'll end up buying something older which is cheaper to repair 😏

Thanks for the advice and your experience, it certainly helps seeing it from other people's perspective 👍

The fault is disappointing. But it could be worse in terms of the offer.

 

It is likely a manufacturing fault surely, it can't really be a user error or maintenance question.  But, as others have pointed out, it will take a good deal of arguing and court filings and who knows how long to get an outcome.

 

One thing you should be made aware of Skoda UK cover the manufacturing warranty and sounds like they are offering an ex gratia goodwill contribution to minimise impact to you.

 

However, the consumer rights act and its predecessor that give the potential for 6 year claims are against the retailer i.e. RRG you bought from. So if you want to get a bit of extra help and possibly something to cover some of the extra costs, I would press the dealership director or service manager for something as well. But through negotiation and see what they say.  

I understand the legal process says that the claim must be against them but under what moral basis could anybody justify tapping them up for money in this instance?

Because they are the vendor and have consumer law responsibility for selling the product.

 

I used to think like you as well but you have to consider the way the law is formed and the model the dealer operates in and who has a contract with whom and for what.

 

If the vendor sells products that are not fit for purpose then they have to deal with it, it is then up to the manufacturer behind the scenes to support as appropriate and under the terms of their dealer relationship, the vendor who sold to you but you don't find out about that or what concessions they make. It is also up to a dealer to cease a relationship and sell a different make car if they do not receive the support expected. 

 

There are very limited cases where the manufacturer sells vehicles direct to you.

 

End of the day, if your a vendor who sell expensive durable goods that are supposed to last longer than 4 years you can expect to need to make it right if it catastrophically fails early even if you did not manufacture it yourself. 

 

Edit: and in the context of this case I am talking about the possibility of a relatively small co-contribution to soften the £700 plus expenses imposition on the purchaser. Not a claim for 10s thousands in damages that would bankrupt the dealer.

 

 

Edited 9 December, 20205 yr by TheClient

Morning guys, 

 

So I have finally received a reply from Skoda today, I think I have come to terms that I will be picking up the 50% labour bill. But the fact that warranty is not being offered considering the part and the bill I find completely absurd. 

 

Hmm. Yes, no mention of your consumer rights or 6 years or fit for purpose because they are not the vendor.

 

The most disappointing part of the reply IMO is even though you are contributing to the repair, they are saying you have no further warranty, which is not how  co-contributions have necessarily worked in the past, especially disappointing if you have lingering concerns on durability......

The lack of further warranty is down to the offer being 100% on the parts.  They don't offer warranty on the labour.  You could offer to pay your £700 towards the parts cost and they cover the labour 100%.  That way you would still pay the same but you would receive 2 years cover on the parts.

 

That is your best outcome I think.  Yes you are £700 (+expenses) down, but they are under no obligation to pay anything at all as the part out of warranty.  SUK have selected 3 years/60k as their warranty period as a balance of parts life, customer expectation, sales leverage.

I suppose it all depends on how invested you are in the vehicle - both from an emotional and financial sake.  I had to shell out half towards a new clutch on my 3 year old VRS (£495) - a couple of month back, so whilst the £700 is quite a bitter pill to swallow, I personally think it isn't the end of the world (unless you don't have that kind of money).  The car (even though its on a low-loader) looks like a nice vehicle.  It would be so sad to scrap it because of a component failure.  What I should add is that if you do get the work done by Skoda to replace the gearbox, you will get a brand-new DSG gearbox (and you will also get new clutch plates as part of the deal) - plus a 2 year Skoda warranty on all parts and labour.