Wheel spin

[Choclab]

When I had my Octavia (68reg 1.5 tsi DSG), I used to have horrendous wheelspin, which wore out the front tyres in no time. Supplying dealer could find nothing wrong, and blamed my driving style. Once prepaid services finished, I took to another dealer for 3rd service, and they agreed not right, found an update and installed it / no more wheel spin.

Now my Karoq is doing it (admittedly mainly, but not exclusively,in the wet). Looks like a trip to dealer☹️

[OldKaroq]

36 minutes ago, Choclab said:

When I had my Octavia (68reg 1.5 tsi DSG), I used to have horrendous wheelspin, which wore out the front tyres in no time. Supplying dealer could find nothing wrong, and blamed my driving style. Once prepaid services finished, I took to another dealer for 3rd service, and they agreed not right, found an update and installed it / no more wheel spin.

Now my Karoq is doing it (admittedly mainly, but not exclusively,in the wet). Looks like a trip to dealer☹️

Im presuming your Karoq has the DSG gearbox? If so, its almost normal - somewhat of an all or nothing start off. I adopt a gentle right foot approach, but can still be caught out in the wet as you say. My 2018 Karoq DSG was same.

Edited 14 November, 2023 by OldKaroq

[JohnArm]

I had a 20 reg 1.5 Tsi DSG Octavia and I'm sure that it's gearbox was more refined than my 1.5Tsi DSG Karoq.

 

Does your Karoq have the traction control on and working, as I can provoke my Karoq into small bouts of wheelspin before the traction control calms it down? I think it's the ESC activated in the settings in the Vehicle Status. page

[Sanqhar]

Tyres make a difference.  OEM Bridgestones were not good.

There are reports that Cross Climates are better.  

I have Goodyear Vector 4 Seasons which are also good.

 

tom

[Choclab]

Thanks folks. I do find it less manic if I turn off the hold feature, and use the foot brake to hold the car, so not having to overcome the hold. Just annoy anyone behind, with the very bright brake lights!

[Ootohere]

@ChoclabDo you not know the brake lights are on anyway with Autohold functioning?

Edited 14 November, 2023 by Rooted

[SurreyJohn]

Temperature is answer.

 

The tyres from from the factory are Eco biased warm weather tyres to improve fuel savings at warm (I think it is 23c) test temperatures.

 

They go hard when cooler, and wet grip falls off sharply below about +10c, (maybe even bit higher, say +13c).  Nearer 6c in dry

 

Quite simply they are not designed for year round use in UK, either need to switch to winter set of tyres Nov-March or change them to all season tyres.   Nothing wrong with the car, just basic physics and coefficient of friction.  A non grippy tyre in colder weather is not going to grip so wheel will spin if put lot of power to it.

 

Change the tyres, for ones that work in cold rain, all will be sorted.  I had similar problem with my Arona (and that is 1 litre DSG), bought set of winter tyres and never spun them since, even when frosty.

 

Skoda do a rim catalogue, order set via parts Dept or other retailers, then source tyres on internet.  Alternatively change to all season, but will have tyres to throw away, whereas you could use them for next few years April-Oct

 

https://www.skoda.co.uk/_doc/639a0118-4da5-446b-a786-86e1f789b57b

 

Winter tyre sets big advantage is can switch wheels around to even out wear, when swapping sets.  The front left always wears faster than rear right (due to roundabouts), and by even out wear usually can get to 60k+ miles with the 2 sets, before have to buy 5th new tyre.  So compares favourably with those who buy 2 new tyres about every 20k miles.

 

[Rory]

Think there's another recent similar thread to this where I commented that our Karoq, which we bought a few mths ago with 4500 miles on it, seemed to have a kind of "soft start" initially, but that's oddly gone away now and the car is quite abrupt.

 

The only couple of things that have changed is I started using Costco's premium fuel, and the weather has got a bit colder.

 

However I've noticed the front tyres - Michelin Primacy's - are quite worn bearing in mind the car's low mileage (backs look brand new) so that makes me think whoever has driven the car previously has had the same issue.

 

I'm now on a second tank of  non-premium fuel but can't honestly tell any difference, and my wife commented the other day that it spun the wheels on her.  We don't use autohold, although maybe hill hold is activating sometimes (think it detects if the car is on a slope).

 

I'm getting a bit worried about how hopeless the car might be in icy weather - the Tiguan we had before was 4Motion and I had a set of winter wheels and tyres.  I'd really like to get CrossClimate's onto the Karoq (have them on our Ateca) but it means chucking away the barely used rear Primacy's.

[SurreyJohn]

1 hour ago, Rory said:

I'm getting a bit worried about how hopeless the car might be in icy weather - the Tiguan we had before was 4Motion and I had a set of winter wheels and tyres.  I'd really like to get CrossClimate's onto the Karoq (have them on our Ateca) but it means chucking away the barely used rear Primacy's.

that's why I got winter set, why throw away tyres you can use for 6 months a year, and do say 5000 miles a year for next 4-5 years.

 

If you have a set of Tiguan winter wheels, what size are they, do the fit a Karoq

 

[Ootohere]

They are not hopeless in winter on the right tyres.

 

The Petrols are no Premium.  They might be E5 and 97 or 99 Octane Minimum, & Costco E5 is 99 ron Min.

Or E10 and 95 ron.

 

All Petrol delivered now in the UK is winter grade so less hygroscopic.

All Diesel is also Winter spec, so has Anti Waxing.     This is until March 2024.

[Choclab]

As car is only 750 miles old, I don’t particularly want to buy more tyres. Could ask the question of why cars are sold with summer tyres instead of cross climate (not fit for purpose of winter use?).

Must say, my old Subaru XV was a much nicer drive, albeit a 4x4, but a bag full of trouble.

[Ootohere]

@ChoclabThe newness is not even off your tyres really if just 750 miles done.

?

Have you adjusted the pressures for the load carried and reset the TPMS?

 

 

Edited 14 November, 2023 by Rooted

[J.R.]

29 minutes ago, Choclab said:

Could ask the question of why cars are sold with summer tyres instead of cross climate (not fit for purpose of winter use?).

 

No such thing as summer tyres, I'm pleased to see even SurreyJohn has stopped using the phrase 👍

 

He gives a good detailed explanation as to why they choose Eco tyres as the factory fitment, it is likely that they have to fit the type of tyres that were used for the official fuel consumption tests to avoid legal claims.

 

I doubt in the majority of the UK (I added that bit for you Root!) there has been more than 14 days per year of proper winter conditions over the last 3 decades yet the uptake of people fitting winter tyres has been quite remarkable, of the ones that I know they all fall into the poor driver category, those with an absence of connection with the vehicle through its controls, who drive without regard to or adapting to the road and weather conditions and who cannot modulate the power transmission according to the grip.

 

It has got gradually worse since FWD vehicles became the majority yet in the correct hands they are the best vehicles for winter conditions.

[Ootohere]

@J.R.Don't be daft.  Where you get that 14 days in 3 decades is  mystery, it might not be in the majority of the UK but there is weeks of poor conditions in enough of the UK in winter.

Plenty members drive in parts of Scotland, England, Wales or Ireland South or North that need tyres to deal with adverse conditions and snow.

You might just have 20 miles to travel in the worst of conditions i wish you had appropriate tyres. 

 

FWD cars are not an issue, low profile / wide tyres with Summer / ECO bias treads are and that need not even be vehicles with more than 75 ps having issies let alone twice that.

A DSG is good in Snow but a DQ200 DSG has a 1st gear that spins up quick to change by 6 mph or so. It can just be a gentle accelerator foot needed with them.

Even the TC off when having an issue getting moving.   Using S for slowing down helps when off the accelerator rather than touch the brakes.

Edited 14 November, 2023 by Rooted

[skomaz]

20 minutes ago, J.R. said:

 

I doubt in the majority of the UK (I added that bit for you Root!) there has been more than 14 days per year of proper winter conditions over the last 3 decades.

 

Location location location @J.R....

 

By my reckoning we probably had more than 14 days in the last two years where I live or if not certainly in the last three years.

 

And by 'proper winter' I'm counting unploughed roads with pukka lying snow...   Not those light dustings that seem to bring havoc to those in the South East...

Edited 14 November, 2023 by skomaz

[Rory]

2 hours ago, SurreyJohn said:

that's why I got winter set, why throw away tyres you can use for 6 months a year, and do say 5000 miles a year for next 4-5 years.

 

If you have a set of Tiguan winter wheels, what size are they, do the fit a Karoq

 

 

I got the Tiguan wheels and tyres for a bonkers price so it was a no-brainer to buy them - VW sent sets of them to dealers to put on cars to demo.  Dealers sold them from their service departments instead, some on eBay.  I paid £200 for the set.

 

I think they will physically fit Karoq but the offset is different - 33 on the Tiguan vs 43 on Karoq.  I know what offset is, but I'm unclear if the difference is an issue.   Anyway the tyres are 10yrs old now, plus they don't have much wear left.

Edited 14 November, 2023 by Rory

[J.R.]

Sorry, I meant 14 days per year 😒

 

Mea culpa!

 

In respect of fitting winter tyres for say 4 months or more when they are only likely to be properly needed for less than 14 days.

 

There was a member selling a set in recent days that lived in Cornwall, palm trees thrive there! OK he may have moved there fromcolder climes and no longer needed them.

[J.R.]

For once it was not my bad English but others misreading, I had indeed wrote:

 

36 minutes ago, J.R. said:

I doubt in the majority of the UK (I added that bit for you Root!) there has been more than 14 days per year of proper winter conditions over the last 3 decades

 

[Ootohere]

@J.R.I got your 14 days a year.

It is nonsense though and not just in the areas of Scotland's 5 Ski Centres. 

There are palm trees near Spey Bay on the Moray Firth as well, but that does not mean they do not get snow and iced roads that need salted and gritted. 

There are post code areas of Scotland that get Cold Weather payments for maybe as much as 7 weeks in a winter for temperatures or forecast temps of zero or below for 7 consecutive days nights.   (Well there was before last winter when it stopped in Scotland but Cold Weather payments still can be paid in the RoUK.)

[J.R.]

Nonsense is my middle name!

 

I can see my efforts to appease you by speaking of the majority in the UK and making special mention of yourself was to no avail.

[Rory]

51 minutes ago, J.R. said:

I doubt in the majority of the UK (I added that bit for you Root!) there has been more than 14 days per year of proper winter conditions over the last 3 decades yet the uptake of people fitting winter tyres has been quite remarkable, of the ones that I know they all fall into the poor driver category, those with an absence of connection with the vehicle through its controls, who drive without regard to or adapting to the road and weather conditions and who cannot modulate the power transmission according to the grip.

 

It has got gradually worse since FWD vehicles became the majority yet in the correct hands they are the best vehicles for winter conditions.

 

I can't say I've done a massive survey but I don't know anyone else amongst friends, family and colleagues who runs anything other than standard tyres.  The place that swapped our summer and winters over on the Tiguan (sometimes I did it myself, sometimes I got them to) seemed to think I was a bit bonkers. 

 

There's a lot of variables, but some cars are known to be spectacularly useless in snow - Merc Estates, for example.  I had one and put All Seasons on it before there were things like CrossClimates.   A colleague got one after years of BMW Estates that had been no problem and first bit of snow he couldn't even get it off the works car park.

 

 

Edited 14 November, 2023 by Rory

[skomaz]

1 hour ago, J.R. said:

For once it was not my bad English but others misreading, I had indeed wrote:

 

 

 

Oops..   Apologies I must have misread

[SurreyJohn]

10 hours ago, J.R. said:

Sorry, I meant 14 days per year 😒

 

Mea culpa!

 

In respect of fitting winter tyres for say 4 months or more when they are only likely to be properly needed for less than 14 days.

@J.R. I know you live in south west France which has different climate

 

We are talking about European winter spec tyres, not Nordic (snow) spec.  Tyres designed for cold rain and some snow.  
 

It is generally agreed they are better in wet below about +10c, (nearer +5c in dry) than factory fit eco summer tyres.  The exact temperature varies slightly by brand so not going to debate one or two degrees.

 

In UK virtually all wet days from end October to early April have rain below +10c (6 months), and in many northern areas is nearer 7-8 months.

 

Yes some southern coastal areas might on see 0-5 days of snow, but they will also see frosts anytime from November to late April.

 

The UK also tends to use the cheap method of using rock salt when cold which tend to dissolve moisture and make roads damp.  Do you really want to be driving along main road, (and plenty of country A and B roads in UK are full of bends at borderline frost with hard eco tyres providing little grip).  Last year my local B road over 20 cars crashed on corners into fences, stone walls, ditches etc.  There was always one or two dragged into lay-bys with blue police tape waiting to be be towed away.  Our local fields get waterlogged and roads are lower (like French bocage) so water runs onto them, washes off treatment and freezes, hence all the accidents writing off cars.

 

Edited 15 November, 2023 by SurreyJohn

[Routemaster1461]

11 hours ago, J.R. said:

 

He gives a good detailed explanation as to why they choose Eco tyres as the factory fitment, it is likely that they have to fit the type of tyres that were used for the official fuel consumption tests to avoid legal claims.

 

 

 

I don't think that the tyres normally fitted should be considered Eco tyres. There are Eco tyres on the market, but these are designed for use on electric cars where the cars are heavier and rolling resistance is critical to the range of the car. You can fit them to conventional cars but the grip they give is significantly poorer.

[Ootohere]

^^^ Common on EV,s of the cheaper type which might be £30,000-£40,000 plus are Michelin Primacy 4.   Crap on BEV, PHEV,s, Hybridsas they are on ICE vehicles in adverse weather and winter conditions, just as the Pirelli, Continental, Dunlop or Goodyear that might get fitted.

LIke the Goodyear Eagle F1 fitted to my Electric MINI.

 

These are the same type of tyres that have a Summer or ECO Bias.   Even the VW Group / Skoda SUV,s might be on Bridgestone Dueler which are pretty rubbish tyres in colder / winter / snowy/ icy weather.

Just like those that an Enyaq comes to the UK wearing. Even with Staggered Tyres, that is wide rears, but still with rubbish Traction / Grip.