Hi peeps

Friend's Fabia 1.2 HTP 2010 has come to me to sort the brakes out, which leave a lot to be desired. It does and will stop but there is a lot of travel in the pedal. it doesn't quite reach the floor when pushed hard, but can't be far off.

Pedal feels very spongey, it has been taken to a garage and they have bled the brakes and otherwise done all they can to fix the issue, but it is still not fixed. So it has been passed to me to try and sort it :-(

I have done the basic servo test, i.e. pump the pedal with the engine off, until it stiffens - which it does (but still has a little give in it), then switch engine on and check pedal sinks to the floor - which it does.

I will re-bleed the brakes myself, just to rule this out, but other things I thought to check -

• vacuum line (and non return valve) - looks ok just on brief visual inspection

• air in abs - need to use VCDS to open valves in modulator ?

• leave pedal jammed with wood on it overnight before bleeding brakes ? ?

• rapidly operate handbrake while bleeding to expel air from rear calipers ? ?

owner has a new master cylinder to be fitted, in case it is this, but I haven't been given this yet.

any other ideas please, is this a common problem ? (I have done a quick search of the forums)

Cheers for reading, thanks in advance,

Check the servo hoses again. My sons brakes were poor and the hoses were split at every join. If there is a new master cylinder to be fitted it could also be the seals have failed and fluid is pushing past them? I used a pressure bleeding kit. (gunsons from memory) and I discovered some air in the front brake line after replacing flexi,s I did bleed it manually but the pressure kit cleared the air and sorted the problem out. If its got drums on the rear it could also be a leaking brake cylinder.

Alasdair

Are there drum brakes on the rear? have come across this issue a few times now, the rear cylinders look good but when shoes are taken off and the rubber dust covers peeled back slightly the inside of the rubbers have been quite wet with fluid, 2 new cylinders and a re bleed using a vac pump (around £15 off the bay ) will make it easier for you, I have known the actual master cylinder to be faulty causing this issue where the centreseals inside the cylinder are weak and pass fluid inside the chamber, you do not loose fluid but this causes the pedal drop and spongy feel on the pedal, normally when servo pipe is leaking the car runs eratic on idle and pedal will be hard to press when braking but have aso seen a faulty vac vale cause some thing like this, my friend bought a used vac pipe and valve to try this out but it turned out to be the master cylinder in the end

thanks both, sorry for the delay in replying. yes have a pressure bleed kit (gunsons) and already checked cap is thread not bayonet 👍

have now checked and it has drums not calipers, no obvious signs of fluid leaking, i.e. on ground, but could be a small leak, so it sounds like I need to remove the drums, to get a proper look. I have a mityvac as well as the eezi-bleed.

it idles fine not erratically. will chase up the master cyl in case it is this, one has been bought for it I believe as this was next thing on the list to check/ change. and you have both mentioned this.

and, yes, correct spelling is spongy, sorry about that !

thanks again Alasdair and Murdockman !

I had a similar issue on another car, I clamped all 4 flexi hoses and checked the pedal with the engine running, if it's solid, you can pretty much rule out everything up to the flexi's, then in turn release a clamp in turn, I did NSR - then re-clamped, OSR - then re-clamped, NSF pedal went spongy, then re-clamped and OSF - then re-clamped, turned out that the NSF brake caliper bleed nipple wasn't seating fully and sealing due to corrosion, changed the caliper, retested everything and then got a good pedal, it's not always the most obvious things, it's always good practice to start with the basics prior to changing parts as it can quite quickly become very expensive, hope that helps you Bud.

I would replace the rear cylinders anyway. They arent expensive. Couldn't get my sons rear brakes to balance for MOT. MOT guy suggested to just change them both . When I took them off the NS one was weeping slightly but not really losing fluid and they looked ok but on closer inspection inside the seals were shot and a fair bit of corrosion/dirt build up which was stopping them leaking badly. New cylinders and brakes were spot on.

Alasdair.

thanks Alasdair again and Goz, sorry nothing to report back as yet as I haven't had a chance to get any time on it, but it's a good tip to clamp all 4 hoses, and I will also look at getting new wheel cylinders. in terms of sourcing the correct new parts, is it like the VW T4, i.e. there's a PR code for the brakes (front and rear) ? ?

cheers

Yes there normally is a pr code but on all my skoda so far its been missing. I think the fabia rear cylinders are fairly easy as there are two options. One with two mounting bolts and the other with just one. Try brakeparts.co.uk They have a good website with info on identification etc. I then get my parts from whoever is cheapest as long as they are reputable brands.

Parts list page for 2010 Fabia with rear drums:

https://www.lllparts.co.uk/catalogs/skoda/CZ/FAB/608/6/609/609020

That's the only option there, PR 1KM, for drums at rear.

Front brakes might be one of two set-ups on your car, I think. One type has 239mm discs, the other 256mm.

PR code for that wouldn't be on the sticker, typically.

thanks Alasdair and Breezy Pete, I have had a quick look and it looks like the wheel cylinders are secured by 2 socket head bolts, as per the image in the link in the post above from B_P. ones I had seen were Apec, ok price, reasonable brand.

I fitted apec ones to my sons as they were a lot cheaper than the dealer. Used Apec braking parts before and been uite happy with them. I always put a bit of coppaslip on the bleed screw on new ones for future remova.

Alasdair

quick update on this folks, have had an initial quick look and re-bled all 4 corners, JIC this wasn't done properly, still the same, so will try clamping all four flexis next and re-check pedal feel. quick question on this, the wheel cylinders have hard lines into them the nearest (only ?) flexi being the short one that loops over the trailing arm joint, is it ok to clamp the hose at this point ?

All four corners look like they need a really good service, reading up on a similar issue on the T4 forum (see link below) the problem could be with the rear shoes/ drums worn excessively , so will also attempt to get the drums off and have a peek next (quickly tried when bleeding but they didnt seem to want to come off, will release the shoes this time and try again). can check the wheel cylinders also at the same time.

https://www.vwt4forum.co.uk/threads/t4-very-unusual-brake-problem.114410/

also, the brake fluid in the reservoir was (is still) quite dark, we tested with a brake fluid tester and it passed ok, so we only pushed enough fluid through to check each corner was air free, and then topped up, but not enough for a complete fluid change. if the previous garage had bled the brakes, as they said they had, I would have thought the fluid would be clean/ golden, but maybe they just did what we did and only pushed a small amount through, enough to check air free at each corner. i.e. bleed as opposed to complete brake fluid change.

thanks for reading