ezero1 device (CGON)

[chimaera]

19 minutes ago, Tpacs said:

Yes i saw that one too and agree with you...that was why i had to satisfy myself about the kit....they have just purchased a PEMS machine as it happens !!! £250K....but all of that aside it all really quiet straight forward...the HHO acts as an additive...with a RON rating of 130+ it increases the burn speed significantly burning more of whats there or put it another way it burns waste fuel....anyway...im really impressed...tickles me when ever i drive the van knowing thats what is happening...fitting one to our other family vehicle...a big V8 petrol....

 

Im confident that these hydrogen cells are going to be a practical way of dealing with the daily dpf issues i see...less soot = less dpf problems....the economy and performance gains are just additional benefits.

 

I know there are alot of snake oil comments but really try it first..personally i think a better question should be how can it not work ?

 

Some positive info on this subject http://www.hho4free.com/documents/nasa_hho_proof.pdf

 

 

 

It contravenes some of the most robust (in terms of evidence) scientific laws known (the laws of thermodynamics) - it can't work. End. Of. Story.

 

Any gains you're seeing are likely due to the installation instructions telling you to drive the shi1te out of it after fitting. A good hard Italian tuneup will help most cars a great deal more than any snake oil solution like this and I'm willing to bet that CGON know this which is why that instruction is included in the install manual, while relieving you of a lot of money. If you bought this, you've been had!

[Guest Tpacs]

Yes the old thermodynamic chestnut however this relates to measuring the energy going into the process of making the HHO versus the energy when thwe calories are calculated from the actuall HHO produced...yes more goes in than comes out BUT this does not account for effect that the HHO has on the combustion process overall...thats why you feel it the improvement etc

[chimaera]

29 minutes ago, Tpacs said:

Yes the old thermodynamic chestnut however this relates to measuring the energy going into the process of making the HHO versus the energy when thwe calories are calculated from the actuall HHO produced...yes more goes in than comes out BUT this does not account for effect that the HHO has on the combustion process overall...thats why you feel it the improvement etc

I've been through why that is nonsense earlier in this thread. I suggest you go back and read it before any of your customers get fleeced.

[Aspman]

Quote

Yes the old thermodynamic chestnut

 

Lol. CGON has made a perpetual motion machine. But it's all above board.

 

Look dude the energy you use to crack the water to H2 and O... you don't get it all back when you burn the H2.

 

Entropy is a bitch like that.

 

 

 

 

[mac11irl]

Without verified, long term test results my dubiousness shall remain firmly in place.

 

And i mean no disrespect, but first post and only posts since being in a random thread on a random forum singing the praises of the saviour of internal combustion being a little tank of electrolyte, just usually has an under current of "product endorsement". Like the fake review farms for amazon and ebay stuff.

Cgin may well have bought themselves 250k worth of pems equipment, but thats still them testing their own product..

And the laws of thermodynamics arent arbitrarily made up like traffic laws. They are proven facts that literally make the world and galaxy go round.. there isnt a way of changing them... 

[Breezy_Pete]

Thermodynamics doesn't apply to magic though, does it?

Derrr.

[Aspman]

 

[mac11irl]

27 minutes ago, Aspman said:

 

 

I suspect it is my trio of turbo encabulators in my shed which has made me cynical of such products.

I really thought the 3rd one was the real deal! 

[ColinD]

@mac11irl dam dude, you didn't get the memo? @Aspman I thought I asked you to send it out to all encabulator enthusiasts, you need a minimum of eight to make any difference.

 

I think I'd save more fuel by putting a doughnut under my accelerator and one less pork pie in my shopping trolley each month.

 

I'm not sure are you saying @Tpacs that you sell this? Just need to highlight the guidelines for you to read before you proceed to far.

 

[mac11irl]

Im giving him the benefit of the doubt on selling @ColinD theres no mention on his website, so perhaps for now he is trialing on his own vehicle. 

Equally though hes not been back since the reality of  thermodynamics was mentioned again..

I kinda hope we havnt scared him off, as i am interested to see what the long term affect is.. he is a new brisky who bit the bullet and shelled out for one, so first hand experience. Hopefully objective, if hes not an agent/fitter yet..

[Guest Tpacs]

Hey guys I got one to trial first...ive read all the pro and cons about the technology and I always believe try it first before you make allot of noise...so that’s what ive done...

 

I use it on my van...we all know our own vehicles...there was an instant improvement in response and performance and then i wanted to test the economy aspect in as a real life way as i could so for me it was what did i get per tank...i saw an 18% increase in economy.  My post was for conversational purposes thats all...i dont need to drum up business like this....anyway im impressed...and im fitting another one to our other car...petrol this time...big V8. Love the wireless control...blue tooth’s to your phone and you can see what’s happening and adjust gas production...so economy or more of a performance twist....for me though the key thing with this technology is this...what im feeling and seeing is the fuel that normally would not be fully combusted...emissions drop and im see this along with others as a fix for persistent blocked DPFs....oh by the way before fitting mine I called most of the people in the Cgon paperwork who have been used as recommendations and the feed back was excellent however everyone’s entitled to their take…

 

 

[mac11irl]

Any chance of getting monthly updates? With some data? Mpg, etc?

[Guest Tpacs]

Yes sure...no problem...im continuing the product...so far im really impressed....Ive been in the business along time but this really tickles me

[mac11irl]

We shall see what happens over time then!

Edited 13 January, 2018 by mac11irl
Typo

[Breezy_Pete]

@Tpacs & @tubbyleigh; a question that occurred to me over the weekend.

 

Since the device can/does connect in to the MAF sensor, what do you do if the car it's being used on doesn't have a MAF sensor, does that mean it can't be installed, or is there an alternative install?

[tubbyleigh]

Hey wino. As I remember, the wire to the MAF is just a trigger so the unit knows the car is running. It can be wired up to anything that the voltage changes with rpm or engine load (MAP is also good). To fit to a really old car you would probably need to phone them for advise. 

[Guest Tpacs]

Hi Wino sorry for the delay in getting back to you...turbos everywhere today...as the last post said the MAF is the trigger so anything showing load can be hooked up....lights just come on my van last 10 mins...thats a steady 18% fuel saving...right going to see what running more gas does....

[Ootohere]

Can you give some clues then.

Before fitting how many miles did you get from a litre of fuel or 45 litres or what ever and what has that increased to now from 10 gallons or whatever.

[Guest Tpacs]

Hi Awaoffski...i think i explained previously but i just wanted to measure it in a real life way not sitting at a steady speed etc...i know i always get 480-500 on a full tank...the light comes i fill up so i know what i get - after fitting the Cgon unit i got 18% more plus a much much better drive so im more than happy...to be honest i wasnt really looking for better mpg but wanted to evaluate the feel of the vehicle we have heavily involved in Hydrogen production with our Hydroflow machine which we use for decarbonising engine internals and dpfs etc so we know how effective it is but i wanted to see what using it as an additive would bring to the drive etc.....really clever

[chimaera]

Did you take any measurements of performance/economy after doing the hard drive part of the install but before fitting the device?

 

Bottom line is that with the way this device works, and the volume of gas it can produce (thankfully tiny for safety reasons), it can't give the results you're claiming for it. To do so would violate the most fundamental physical and chemical laws known to science.

 

You're either fooling yourself or something else has caused the improvement, most likely the hard drive part of the fitting procedure. I would suggest you avoid selling this product to your customers since the claims you (and the manufacturer) make for it are liable to be considered fraud.

[tubbyleigh]

Hey chimaera. The hard drive part of installation is simply 20 seconds. Full rpm through 1st and 2nd gears. It’s simply to get the full range of voltage from the MAF sensor and certainly won’t improve fuel economy or reduce emissions. I think your referring to my pre and post testing, and I can assure you that the engine was very hot and revved hard several times before I did my pre test. My test results were accurate to the best of the ability of the MOT spec emissions tester I used. 

[chimaera]

7 minutes ago, tubbyleigh said:

Hey chimaera. The hard drive part of installation is simply 20 seconds. Full rpm through 1st and 2nd gears. It’s simply to get the full range of voltage from the MAF sensor and certainly won’t improve fuel economy or reduce emissions. I think your referring to my pre and post testing, and I can assure you that the engine was very hot and revved hard several times before I did my pre test. My test results were accurate to the best of the ability of the MOT spec emissions tester I used. 

A hard run like that will dislodge a lot of crud from the engine's internals, particularly in the intake and exhaust and will help quite a bit with performance. This will especially be the case on vehicles that are usually driven gently.

 

The testing I would like to see (which you probably didn't do) is perform the preparation parts of CGON's install instructions up to and including the hard drive part (the so-called Italian tune-up), then run a full tank through it to measure fuel economy. This will tell you how well the engine is performing after the Italian tune-up, and before the installation of the device. I suspect you'd see most of the same improvement at that point and that adding the device would have little further impact.

[Aspman]

Two members who have joined only to post in this one very specific thread......

 

I am cynical but.....

[tubbyleigh]

This is what I’m trying say!

i did the Italian tune up before my pre test and did less of one before my post test. I can’t run a tank of fuel through it because it isn’t my car but the other chap posting has. I don’t know if he did pre and post tests???

 

[tubbyleigh]

Aspen. This is the only forum talking about cgon. I first came here to research a product before agreeing to fit one but no one here had fitted one. 

After fitting one I joined the forum and posted my findings. Only trying to be helpful. Nothing for you to be suspicious about. If you don’t want one, don’t buy one. Why would I care either way?