Diesel days are numbered according to Renault, Peugeot & VW

[Ootohere]

Interesting that they think petrol hybrids are the answer and not EV's

Are they going along with the kidology that they have spun that because they can run on electric that they are being run on electric and burning less liquid fuel.

Someone should maybe do a Freedom of Information request if the information is not already available asking if they spend less on the Fuel now in the 

25% diesel replacements fuel requirements & what they have as the emissions reduction including the manufacturing of the new vehicles.

[Ttaskmaster]

Fossil fuels are not the answer, for it pollutes.

Electricity is not the answer, for generating it pollutes.

Hydrogen is not the answer, for acquiring it pollutes.

 

Thorium was recognised as a pretty perfect fuel source back in the 1950s. It's one of the most abundant substances around, a piece the size of a sand grain will power my wris****ch for two lifetimes, a piece the size of my fist will power my car when your great-grandchildren are willing it to their own great-grandchildren, it gives off less radiation that what you're exposed to in your own home right now and it is exceedingly difficult to refine into weapons-grade... this latter being the reason further research was dropped in 1965.

 

But no-one will make as much money from supplying thorium as they do supplying fossil fuels and electrickery, so we won't use it.

 

 

Edit: Wrist watch... stupid ****** swear filter, ha ha!! :D

Edited 18 January, 2017 by Ttaskmaster

[Ootohere]

Maybe true in the South of the UK where you have not enough electricity generation.

Not so in the top 1/3 or more of the UK where the Possible Renewables Generation is not used because it can not be stored so turbines are not turning and generating, just payments being made not to generate because the National Grid connections or Interconnectors are not there.

 

There is surplus energy that can be converted to Hydrogen and is in someplaces like Aberdeen but the busses are Not Fit For Purpose and over expensive and breaking down.

 

Every little helps but Government Vehicles being Petrol Hybrids is taking the Pith really.

Give them 80 mile range and a Zoe or Leaf and stuff getting a Prius.

Edited 18 January, 2017 by Offski

[Ttaskmaster]

We have a whole business park here, supposedly powered by one turbine... it spends more time broken and/or requiring maintenance than in operation (I can see it from my home office window right now and it ain't moving). It also cost a bomb to make and install!!

[Ryeman]

I think the short term priority is to 'export' the generated pollution to the areas away from the town centres.........distribute it more evenly across ALL the country.

EV does that so well .........escape to the city perhaps?.

(Seriously, diesel busses and taxis have to go, and quickly.......plus establish hubs for heavy, long distance transports)

[Ryeman]

Nuclear fusion in our lifetime?.

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/alluring-elusive-fusion-energy-possible-lifetime/

[Nathanio]

 

Diesel even seem number as cars the UK Government use.

 

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/pmqs-recap-theresa-corbyn-brexit-9643841?service=responsive

 

12:25

Government still has harmful diesel cars

Tory MP Andrew Selous says he welcomes action on air quality to help curb the 40,000 early deaths it causes each year.   

He says she can start by removing all diesel cars from the government fleet “as soon as possible”.

 

“We are determined to cut harmful emissions,” she (Ms T May) replies. 

She  says a quarter have been replaced with petrol hybrid cars so far and the work continues.

 

 

 

So to clean up pollution we're going to scrap a load of functioning cars and replace them with new cars. Not taking into consideration the cost, the cradle-to-grave environmental costs of a new car or the effects on the environment of digging and producing the batteries for the hybrids.....

 

What a crock of.....

[Ryeman]

The BEV era is surely here for European city work.

There are BEV delivery trucks already which can transport from outer freight hubs.

There are scientific solutions to urban air quality problems which only require a commitment from those with the power and determination.

[Ootohere]

We will be hearing from the Scottish Government today.

http://bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-38666232

[lol-lol]

Interesting that they think petrol hybrids are the answer and not EV's  Are they going along with the kidology that they have spun that because they can run on electric that they are being run on electric and burning less liquid fuel. Someone should maybe do a Freedom of Information request if the information is not already available asking if they spend less on the Fuel now in the 25% diesel replacements fuel requirements & what they have as the emissions reduction including the manufacturing of the new vehicles.

 

The PM said Petrol-hybrids but I would expect Pure EVs to get in to the mix when they have chance to evaluate cars introduced to the market such as the Renault Zoe.

 

Government usage can be everything from a messenger cars (could be a Micra/Leaf maybe) which can be the most basic of a cheap range to a ministerial car of an EV Jaguar ie UK made.  Robert Llewellyn doing a sensible piece on it....

 

Edited 19 January, 2017 by lol-lol

[Breezy_Pete]

We will be hearing from the Scottish Government today.

http://bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-38666232

For most of Scotland's area, the ideal short to medium-term solution to reducing overall transport related CO₂  is probably to make everyone drive highly efficient diesels, ironically.

[lol-lol]

Fossil fuels are not the answer, for it pollutes.

Electricity is not the answer, for generating it pollutes.

Hydrogen is not the answer, for acquiring it pollutes.

Thorium was recognised as a pretty perfect fuel source back in the 1950s. It's one of the most abundant substances around, a piece the size of a sand grain will power my wris****ch for two lifetimes, a piece the size of my fist will power my car when your great-grandchildren are willing it to their own great-grandchildren, it gives off less radiation that what you're exposed to in your own home right now and it is exceedingly difficult to refine into weapons-grade... this latter being the reason further research was dropped in 1965.

But no-one will make as much money from supplying thorium as they do supplying fossil fuels and electrickery, so we won't use it.

Edit: Wrist watch... stupid ****** swear filter, ha ha!! :D

 

The plan of nearly all government is to convert their entire fossil fuel electricity generation to solar, tidal and wind with some nuclear if they need it so apart from the the disposal of the nuclear material at end of life it is clean.

 

Use of hydro kinetic/potential storage, like Dinorwig, and then using the EV vehicles and Electrical storage banks to smooth the generation/demand cycle.

 

Just popped in to our new London office earlier this week.  10 gleaming EV charging station which should help the pollution issue around HEathrow. Progress. 

[Ootohere]

I watch the TV and i see what the Government Ministers get driven in.

 

Theresa May MP as home Secretary had some convoy of Protection with her in the Armoured Audi, and the escort RR's. BMW's, Audis etc & Bikes.

 

As David Cameron MP / PM drove to say good bye to Madge he arrived in one Manufacturers Armoured Car and left in another.

Theresa May MP arrived in one brand and left in another, 

& i see she in now being driven in an Indian / British model.

 

The Royals liked their Audi's obviously seeing as the Head of the Family has so much invested in the Company and they get such good terms on them.

Now they seem back to driving the Indian / British SUV's which is nice.

[lol-lol]

So to clean up pollution we're going to scrap a load of functioning cars and replace them with new cars. Not taking into consideration the cost, the cradle-to-grave environmental costs of a new car or the effects on the environment of digging and producing the batteries for the hybrids.....  What a crock of.....

 

Reading between the lines, and knowing a bit about government disposal of such things, use to sell batches of cars, yachts etc after customs seizures, they will sell the terminate diesels in to the market place, probably by sealed auction or bulk, by auction, to one of the major disposal networks.  

 

The plan is to get rid of all government diesel cars so they are not seen working in the cities and this, along with cities progressively banning and fining diesel being used in the cities will so that the government led they way.  Also, as it could happen that manufacturers and operators who promoted, used and lied about the diesel cars may be prosecuted for selling and using such diesel cars much as the way tobacco has been pursued through the legal system so the various governments in the world ar looking to get out of this area ASAP.   

[Ootohere]

Wino.

The Scottish Government previously announced the Charging points all over Scotland and considering the amount of Turbines that will happen.

As to the majority of Scotland, the Population is in Glasgow & Edinburgh, Dundee, Aberdeen & Inverness where diesels are not required unless travelling regularly out of cities.

 

As to HGV diesel reduction the Rail Heads at Euro Central / Edinburgh / Glasgow/ Stirling / & especially @ Perth & Inverness are required, 

get the containers on the Rails and off the roads.

 

Renault might just be the game changer, 

Sadly Sir Arnold Clark Dealerships could be the downer on that.    Hyundai 'Click to Buy' type purchasing might sort that out tho, & Government run Dealership / Workshops. MOT Stations as well, strict ones, use the UK MOT rules but the testing equipment that is being introduced used ASAP.

Still part of the UK but Scotland has a different legal system & laws on Drink Driving etc so they can enforce stricter than England & Wales on polluters even if vehicles are tested and passed in England, Wales, Northern Ireland or EU Countries.  More Roadside Testing.

http://bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-37930907

http://bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-21346299

 

Yet another 'Car Sharing Club' started this week, this one in Inverness, and there will be one in 'Fort William'.

There are already ones around Scotland. Good one in St Andrews.

http://bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-38167818

Edited 19 January, 2017 by Offski

[Aspman]

So to clean up pollution we're going to scrap a load of functioning cars and replace them with new cars. Not taking into consideration the cost, the cradle-to-grave environmental costs of a new car or the effects on the environment of digging and producing the batteries for the hybrids.....

 

What a crock of.....

 

Very true but the economy and legislature of the Western World is dependent on the solution to most problems generally being "buy new stuff".

If they actually consider the whole life cost of anything it would all come crashing down.

 

EVs. Plenty of government bodies use pure EVs in limited fashions. Range and recharging prevent more use exactly as for domestic use.

 

Diesels are really only a problem in cities and even then lots of the problems are caused by road management measure (badly tuned lights, speed humps etc).

 

Outside cities diesels will still make more sense because they will be getting used in their most efficient manner (moving a moderate speed for long periods) and overall producing less pollution.

[Ryeman]

Re charging points, maybe it's more to do with Brexit overwhelming all else........can't walk AND chew gum?

[Aspman]

Re charging points, maybe it's more to do with Brexit overwhelming all else........can't walk AND chew gum?

 

It's a chicken and egg thing.

 

More people would buy EVs if there were more charging points and authorities would be keener on putting in charging points if there were more evs.

I've seen some sensible suggestions such as putting charging points at taxi ranks so that EVs start to become an option there for cars doing a lot of urban miles.

 

EVs make sense in a city up to a point. But everyone needs to make longer journeys occasionally and public transport is perceived (rightly or wrongly) to be expensive and unreliable. It's certainly more hassle than stepping out your front door into your fossil fuel powered motor.

I think we're a long way from getting people with cars to change them for EVs.

City dwellers are more likely to just do without a car altogether, an EV is still going to be expensive to buy and insure in a city.

[Ryeman]

BMW are in a joint venture to establish them .

There's no particular rush but I'll happen incrementally.

I would expect it to be a ten year project.

Victoria has announced its Melbourne tram network will be entirely solar powered from sites in the nw of the state.

Solar panel roads are being rolled out in the Netherlands IIR, and we knew 50% less 12 months ago, probably in the sciences.

The only fly in the proverbial is the populism exploited by the ignorant........one in particular.

[Breezy_Pete]

...

EVs make sense in a city up to a point. But everyone needs to make longer journeys occasionally and public transport is perceived (rightly or wrongly) to be expensive and unreliable. It's certainly more hassle than stepping out your front door into your fossil fuel powered motor.

I think we're a long way from getting people with cars to change them for EVs.

City dwellers are more likely to just do without a car altogether, an EV is still going to be expensive to buy and insure in a city.

Nail. Head.

 

.., and we knew 50% less 12 months ago, probably in the sciences.

...

I don't understand how anyone could seriously believe this.

[Ryeman]

This is just one publication in the science field

http://view.mail.advantagebusinessmedia.com/?qs=ce1907656f5451316edf0d1e33ec8764cc013abbdb6ab649a80a4e6b7035056e971599ca25f12dfb4c33641edde40663a87a6786b4c6ee69df90aa6d1b2c755e864d3dee26cabde298b5a5f4cb29ae2c

Then there all the university based research institutes

Imagine the narrowness of the research radiating out leaving even more space the further out it goes.

It's beyond anyone's ability to get a hold on what's going on, and that's just the scientists.

Humanities trained polies are clueless and still dabbling in 19th century law.

[Ttaskmaster]

The plan of nearly all government is to convert their entire fossil fuel electricity generation to solar, tidal and wind with some nuclear if they need it so apart from the the disposal of the nuclear material at end of life it is clean.

 

Yes yes, no nasty stuff being chucked out the back, nice clean vehicles... but what about the places where all this stuff is made?

What about all the factories and plants using fossil fuels to make all this?

What about all the EV stuff that is 2 years old and only does 100 miles, compared to the newer stuff that does 250 miles?

 

We're still turning the wheels and burning the fuels of industry in order to make all this.

Not so clean...

[lol-lol]

Re charging points, maybe it's more to do with Brexit overwhelming all else........can't walk AND chew gum?

 

My company did most the charging points in Paris and are rolling this out in London.   Paris was easier with one unitary metropolitan authority, London has 44 individual authorities.

 

It is a big exercise.  Our charge points are principally 3 phase power as we are looking to charge the vehicles at either 45 Kw/Hr or 22 Kw/hr so we put 80% of needed charge in as little as half an hour but if there are more than one charge point in the bank of charge locations that can be quite a power draw from the local infrastructure.   Alternate is to have 3.6 or 7 Kw points which are usually fine for employees working at the office all day but we need the fast charge points for our EV cars, vans and trucks especially one the one doing the run in the transit sheds at Heathrow at a moments notice for an Aircraft on Ground scenario.  Hopefully this help further with the poor air quality in this part of London.  

[Aspman]

Yes yes, no nasty stuff being chucked out the back, nice clean vehicles... but what about the places where all this stuff is made?

What about all the factories and plants using fossil fuels to make all this?

What about all the EV stuff that is 2 years old and only does 100 miles, compared to the newer stuff that does 250 miles?

 

We're still turning the wheels and burning the fuels of industry in order to make all this.

Not so clean...

 

Power stations are more efficient at generating energy than individual combustion engines so it's still a reasonable argument to concentrate energy generation to a few locations.

 

As for older 1st gen evs, well that's back to the point about governments not looking at whole life costs.

 

When we've all been forcibly moved to EVs expect an environmental outcry about mining for the relevant chemicals (like lithium right now) followed by some sort of punitive tax. The tax regime has already moved against low emission vehicles because it was too effective and lowered the tax take through VED and VAT.

[Ttaskmaster]

Power stations are more efficient at generating energy than individual combustion engines so it's still a reasonable argument to concentrate energy generation to a few locations.

 

As for older 1st gen evs, well that's back to the point about governments not looking at whole life costs.

 

When we've all been forcibly moved to EVs expect an environmental outcry about mining for the relevant chemicals (like lithium right now) followed by some sort of punitive tax. The tax regime has already moved against low emission vehicles because it was too effective and lowered the tax take through VED and VAT.

 

In other words, it's nothing really to do with the environment or people's health and just about reaping in more tax.... kinda like the WHO decrying vaping and advocating smoking tobacco as "a useful source of tax revenue", then?