Anyone have the definitive answer?

 

Petrols normally DON'T, but I've heard that Skoda fitted them to the "larger engined" petrol Superbs.

 

Is the 1.8TSi a "larger engine" or does that just mean the 3.6 V6?

 

Expertise welcomed; cheers.

The short answer is yes.

The part number fitted to the BZB engine is 06J 105 266K, manufactured by LuK and also fitted to the CDAA and CDAB engines. The latter two are also listed with a Sachs DMF, part number 06J 105 266H.

http://www.oemepc.com/skoda/part_single/catalog/sk/markt/CZ/modell/SUP/year/2012/drive_standart/632/hg_ug/105/subcategory/105010/part_id/2541390/lang/e#sec_9

http://www.oemepc.com/skoda/part_single/catalog/sk/markt/CZ/modell/SUP/year/2012/drive_standart/632/hg_ug/105/subcategory/105015/part_id/2541390/lang/e

That's very helpful - thank you for your time! 

 

What I DON'T get, though, is why this fact doesn't show up on garage parts databases. I've been ringing round for quotations on a replacement clutch; when I give them my reg., they ring me back in 10 minutes with a quotation which is clearly NOT for a clutch with DMF. Only one garage has quoted me "correctly" - how so? 

 

If I have the clutch replaced, do I have to replace the DMF? I know you do if it's the other way round... 

Probably some level of ignorance: "sure it's a petrol, they never have DMFs!"

 

As to whether or not to replace the DMF, it depends on what your current mileage is, and how much longer you plan to keep the car. Going by your profile, the car is remapped which will have shortened the life of the flywheel. If the part isn't stupid money, most of the labour is shared so it would probably make sense to change it.

Hi Noddy90 - I've just had work done on my 3.6 (had to have engine and gearbox out - just unfortunate....chain tensioner failed.....rare occurrence on what is otherwise a bulletproof lump and DSG 6sp gearbox) and mine has a DMF as does your 1.8 tsi (as per Chimera's post).  My car has 114,000 kms on it (approx. 71k miles) and the DMF was like new still. I pondered over getting it changed, along with the clutch, but both were 'as new'....a wrong decision?  Who knows, but given that the police 3'6's here in Suisse clock up 350,000 kms plus with ease on the original bits, I'm taking the chance.

 

Again, as Chimera says, on the TSi, if it's chipped and you are giving it some beans regularly (as you should), those parts will wear more quickly. The 3.6 is relatively unstressed by comparison (can be quite a lazy lump in normal driving). But when you do hoon....it sings!

 

Good luck with it...

 

Dave

Thanks for the replies, guys!

Maybe this is a bit off topic, but just FYI most of modern cars have DMF (even with petrol engines). Still there are some exceptions like VAG Group 1.6 TDI 77kw CAYC engine with 5 speed manual trans - this car has SMF. 

5 hours ago, Lutz said:

Maybe this is a bit off topic, but just FYI most of modern cars have DMF (even with petrol engines). Still there are some exceptions like VAG Group 1.6 TDI 77kw CAYC engine with 5 speed manual trans - this car has SMF. 

Very interesting. Is that for sure just the 5 speed 1.6 ? I have a Superb Greenline 3 (so six speed) ...  would be interested to know which I have.

5 hours ago, Lutz said:

Maybe this is a bit off topic, but just FYI most of modern cars have DMF (even with petrol engines). Still there are some exceptions like VAG Group 1.6 TDI 77kw CAYC engine with 5 speed manual trans - this car has SMF. 

Update: just checked on Euro Car Parts and it's a Single mass flywheel for the superb 6 speed. No other option and a single mass conversion kit unavailable  (obvs). My mk5 golf 1.9 PD 5 speed however definitely has a dual mass, in line with what the reg is showing on ECP.  

2 hours ago, Shaunieboy said:

just checked on Euro Car Parts and it's a Single mass flywheel for the superb 6 speed

 

I was lent a 2.0 140ps diesel S2 for a day when a warranty repair was carried out on my my Superb 1.6d, facelift 6 speed manual. I did notice that pulling away from a stop was smoother on the 2.0. When I asked, the dealers tech told me it was down to the single mass flywheel on my car.

 

Like you I checked the parts database(s) and the only option for a dual mass flywheel for the CAYC 1.6d was for a DSG.

 

 

12 hours ago, Lutz said:

Maybe this is a bit off topic, but just FYI most of modern cars have DMF (even with petrol engines). Still there are some exceptions like VAG Group 1.6 TDI 77kw CAYC engine with 5 speed manual trans - this car has SMF. 

There are two reasons a manufacturer would spec a DMF. The first is refinement since it smooths out the take up in the clutch and damps out engine vibrations so that the gearbox doesn't rattle at idle.

 

The second is that it reduces shock loadings on the crankshaft and transmission during clutch take up: the springs in the DMF absorb shocks from sudden clutch application. This allows smaller, lighter parts to be used in the crankshaft and gearbox which helps with fuel economy and emissions. Fitting a SMF in such applications is going to lead to stuff breaking so is best avoided.

As far as I know on the Superb 

22 hours ago, Noddy90 said:

Anyone have the definitive answer?

 

Petrols normally DON'T, but I've heard that Skoda fitted them to the "larger engined" petrol Superbs.

 

Is the 1.8TSi a "larger engine" or does that just mean the 3.6 V6?

 

Expertise welcomed; cheers.

 

As far as I know the larger petrol engines on the Superb II have a DMF but the smaller 1.4 tsi doesn't (it was one of the reasons I bought mine - as was having an external clutch slave cylinder, water pump fed from aux belt and no DPF)

 

The only fly in the ointment for me is I'm not 100% sure NOW that mine doesn't hae a DMF as it is a facelift model with stop/start. The Eurocarparts web site is a reasonable way of cheking (not 100%)

 

 

Edited 14 February, 20188 yr by bigjohn

4 hours ago, TheRobinK said:

 

I was lent a 2.0 140ps diesel S2 for a day when a warranty repair was carried out on my my Superb 1.6d, facelift 6 speed manual. I did notice that pulling away from a stop was smoother on the 2.0. When I asked, the dealers tech told me it was down to the single mass flywheel on my car.

 

Like you I checked the parts database(s) and the only option for a dual mass flywheel for the CAYC 1.6d was for a DSG.

 

 

Yes I agree about the smoothness, I can change gear and be 'vigorous' with the clutch on my Golf with a DMF and the shifts are always smooth. I've got to think a little bit more about it on the Superb with the SMF or it gets a bit 'thuddy'. Thankfully I'm all about the economy so everything is taken very easy 99% of the time in the Superb. I'm sure I've read that SMFs are a bit more haedwearing too. Bonus if it's true.

8 minutes ago, Shaunieboy said:

I'm sure I've read that SMFs are a bit more haedwearing too. Bonus if it's true.

 

A single mass flywheel has no moving parts, it's just a round lump of metal, so they will last the lifetime of the car.

 

A dual-mass flywheel has two flywheel components mounted together with a set of springs inside to buffer the movement between the two parts. The springs eventually wear out and/or break requiring a replacement of the DMF. They can be good for up to 300000 km depending on the driver and the type of driving they're subjected to; for a lot of cars that's pretty close to lifetime. City cars will fail much sooner, motorway cars last a very long time.

 

I'll soon find out what it's got as the clutch completely failed on me tonight and I had to be towed home (see other thread). Garage (and verdict) tomorrow...

 

Cheers for the replies!

 

Car currently in for a new clutch and DUAL MASS flywheel.  £980.    

6 minutes ago, Noddy90 said:

Car currently in for a new clutch and DUAL MASS flywheel.  £980.    

Ouch. Can't you spec a single mass flywheel conversion?

15 minutes ago, Noddy90 said:

Car currently in for a new clutch and DUAL MASS flywheel.  £980.    

If its a competent garage they should have the tool to check the condition of flywheel without just replacing it ....

 

13 minutes ago, Shaunieboy said:

Ouch. Can't you spec a single mass flywheel conversion?

As I pointed out further up the thread a lot of modern engines are specced with a DMF to reduce shock loading and allow lighter components in the engine and transmission. Fitting a SMF in these cases is likely to break stuff down the line.

2 minutes ago, chimaera said:

As I pointed out further up the thread a lot of modern engines are specced with a DMF to reduce shock loading and allow lighter components in the engine and transmission. Fitting a SMF in these cases is likely to break stuff down the line.

Used to fit conversion kits to Octavia taxis due to the price difference and you could tell as soon as you drove one with single mass that it had been changed terrible vibration through whole car made it an uneconomical repair in the long run  

@DEL80Y @chimaera

Fair dinkum 

We had a Mondeo with a DMF, a Focus with a DMF, a BMW 1 series with a DMF and all were beautifully smooth transmissions. Bought a Kia Ceed 1.6 CRDi which had no DMF and whilst it was perfectly acceptable (designed to work with an SMF so it should have been) it was nowhere near as smooth as the other cars. 5th at 40 mph was perfectly OK in the DMF cars, the Ceed needed 4th otherwise you knew about it.

OK:  a 2012 1.8TSi 6-speed manual Skoda Superb definitely DOES have a Dual Mass Flywheel.

8 hours ago, skidpan said:

We had a Mondeo with a DMF, a Focus with a DMF, a BMW 1 series with a DMF and all were beautifully smooth transmissions. Bought a Kia Ceed 1.6 CRDi which had no DMF and whilst it was perfectly acceptable (designed to work with an SMF so it should have been) it was nowhere near as smooth as the other cars. 5th at 40 mph was perfectly OK in the DMF cars, the Ceed needed 4th otherwise you knew about it.

 

Probably not helped by the very un-torquey Kia engine, although  a DMF may have helped to reduce the vibratations of a protesting engine.

 

I think my1.4tsi Superb has a SMF and that is smooth with reasonable pull from 1500rpm. It protests a bit if you try and pull from 1000rpm in 6th gear (aprox 30mph ) but OK from 1300rpm (aprox 40mph). 

 

Not 100% sure re SMF though, the pre facelift did have a SMF but mine is Stop Start so possibly different although Europarts still says SMF for a clutch kit

 

My dad used to drive his MKIV 3.0 ZFord odiac around town starting from the lights in third and then just changing gear by clicking the overdrive - ouch. That didn't have a DMF (I suspect they weren't invented) but it was very smooth. Saying that clutches didn't last long and at a young age I became an expert in changing them every year for him - the gearbox weighed a ton!

 

How smooth is the S3  Superb 1.4tsi?

 

Edited 15 February, 20188 yr by bigjohn

Yeah; my understanding is that the 1.4 has the SINGLE mass. That tallies with what I read about only the "larger" petrol engines having a DMF...