Heavy steering, front near side wheel intermittent noise Fabia 1 vrs

[bmbmdmb]

Hi,

Car - Fabia 1 vrs 07

Symptoms - Front left (Near side) noise (grinding, crunching) intermittent noise. Later developed heavy feel to steering a few days later, particularly front left.

No warnings on dash.

 

Last Friday when going over a speed bump at low speed the front left wheel, which I believed was the suspension made a noise (not a knocking) but a crunch. Never done this before. I looked under car but could not find anything out of place or trapped. 

I drove it without incident yesterday (Monday). Today (Tuesday) wife calls Green Flag out reporting a grinding noise, she pulled over and when I arrived and Green Flag we could not replicate the noise. Nothing trapped under car. The front suspension spring (original with 75k on it) looks okay, console bushes were replaced 20k ago (so not this), not loose caliper carrier or anti roll bar, CV joint looks fine (no tears), drop link intact. Nothing out of place. Not a binding caliper (changed around 60K) and disks on same axle were both same temperature after a drive with frequent braking.

 

I'm going to have a more thorough look with car jacked up tonight (at the spring). Is it possible for a McPherson style strut (as on the fabia vrs 1?) has a knackered shock absorber?

 

Green Flag said possibly the spring or the steering rack was on its way out. But only guess work.

 

Anyone any ideas? I've searched and someone mentioned the steering angle sensor or power steering. 

 

Probably worthwhile plugging into diagnostic scanner that I've been meaning to buy.

 

I've heard a power steering pump and its not this (whine noise continually on a 5yr old Audi A1). I'm going to check the power steering fluid level but this is under the battery tray (joy!)

 

Thanks,

 

 

 

 

[Breezy_Pete]

I'd say the top of the spring has broken off, and the remaining sharp end has got around the topmount bearing, instead of sitting on it.

Edited 13 March, 2018 by Wino

[penguin17]

10 minutes ago, Wino said:

I'd say the top of the spring has broken off, and the remaining sharp end has got around the topmount bearing, instead of sitting on it.

This.  Happened on our Mk1 Furby vRS.  Replaced both springs and it was fairly obvious with a visual inspection up into the wheel arch.  Once the spring was removed the garage showed that there was no rust, corrosion or similar, it seemed to have just failed and sheered at the top end.  

[bmbmdmb]

Thanks, I'm taking wheel off when I get home to have a look. Would this affect the steering - hence the bearing. Greenflag gent said when corner there is torque on the spring.

 

 

[rum4mo]

With a car without any issues, there will not be any torque applied to the front springs while turning the steering away from "ahead" position, if the top bearing starts to get rusty then it will apply a bit of torque to the spring before it breaks away and moves with the strut, also a broken spring will, as said could get caught up with the rubber top mounting and so end up being twisted as the strut turns away from the "ahead" position.

 

These issues will be obvious once you have jacked the front of the car up, tip, with a complete spring, the end of the top should almost or exactly be in the same point rotationally as the end of the bottom of the spring.

[bmbmdmb]

Wheel off car. I have felt around and looked at spring. Nothing obvious. Everything else looks ok. The car has not replicated any noises made previously that wife said happened on braking for a roundabout in a straight line then got worse when turning. As the car sped up the noise reduced or did not worsen. Noisy when reversing she saud. I have driven car for 15 miles since and nothing except the heavy steering which on return home was not evident.

 

I took the black cap in engine bay off, in there is a spring like ring. Nice and clean. 

 

Is the break in the spring in the top mount hidden from view?

 

Will leaving this cause damage?

Just replaced rear shocks and rear axle bushes and boost pipes and thought I could have some time to concentrate on other things!

[mogwye]

Both my front springs broke at the top coil, both the pieces were inside the spring sitting on top of the spring seat.

 

DB.

[bmbmdmb]

1 hour ago, mogwye said:

Both my front springs broke at the top coil, both the pieces were inside the spring sitting on top of the spring seat.

 

Were there any noises or other symptoms and did this occur on cornering or braking? The photo shows a fair bit if crud up there and I only power washed a few days ago. 

Wife said she expected to find something was dragging along the road.

[mogwye]

The noise from the LH side strut was similar to a well worn console bush every time I went over a bump, an annoying grating noise, I jacked up the car and found the broken coil sitting in the spring seat inside the spring. On testing, the noise had disappeared  but then I heard  a similar noise coming from the RH side, so I repeated the procedure and found the same sized coil in the same position. On inspecting the spring I had a job to find where it had snapped, but by feeling around the top part of the spring (the end of the spring should be a 90' square cut) I could feel that the breakage was about a 45' snap. I note on the forum that quite a few other cars that are about 10 years old are also suffering from the same stress fatigue.

 

2007 1.4 TDI

 

DB.

[bmbmdmb]

See image of parts please.

Part 2 looks like rubber end.

Part 4 looks like top mount bearing.

Having had a 2nd opinion from someone who breaks cars for living , he thinks it might be the bearings disintegrating in top mount. He and I could not find any break in spring. Painted Grey few years ago but the last spiral was unpainted but I can feel end which is facing opposite direction to lower part of spring end of coil.

 

Anyone heard of top mount bearings going and making grinding noise?

 

Is there any way of testing this theory? The car drove normally last Tuesday. Could the old ball bearing have broken up hence the intermittent noise ?

 

Worthwhile replacing shock and spring and other parts at 75k? Or just replace top mount? Seem to be a lot of golf mk4 with this issue. Similar suspension?

 

 

 

 

 

 

[liljim91]

Just throwing one out there... not the back plates/ heatshields around the disc??? Mine were pretty rot?!

 

And another simple one. Habe you checked tyre pressures?

Edited 15 March, 2018 by liljim91

[TMB]

You've got the parts mixed up. Part 4 is the rubber top mount and part 2 is the bearing. The parts look like this...

 

 

The bearings look like this inside...

 

 

Edited 16 March, 2018 by TMB

[bmbmdmb]

Thanks.

Going to get some prices and replace at least top mount bearings. They are more exposed to road salt and water than I first thought.

Tire pressures ok and heat shield good. 

[rum4mo]

From your description of where the end of the top of the spring was relative to the bottom, it sounds like the springs are still okay.

 

I had to replace a top bearing on my wife's previous 2002 Polo 1.4 75PS, I can't remember what drew my attention to it, I'd guess the noise when turning and the changed feel of the steering.  When I jacked up both sides at the front, I think that I left the steering lock off and tried moving the wheels side to side and found that they were stiff to move - I probably rechecked that after disconnection the TRE from the noisy side to confirm things before buying new parts.

 

Edit:- one thing to prepare for is, when you get the top mounting off the strut, you might be a bit confused when you can't find the top bearing - it will probably still be stuck to the top mounting!

 

Old but true story:- I was visiting my local VW dealer for parts one day a long time ago, and there was a professional mechanic/tech in buying some parts, but he was not interested in the top mounting that they were trying to sell him as it was different form the one he had in his hand, reason being, the old one he was holding still had its top bearing stuck on to it, I think that eventually I used a house key to lever the old bearing off the old top mount, then he was okay with what he was being sold, so it is not just us "stupid" DIYers that get things wrong!

 

Another Edit:- I seem to remember that the balls are a lot bigger on newer cars, and so fewer of them, that I discovered when replacing the springs etc on a late 2009 Ibiza and still having the old parts from the 2002 Polo lying around!

 

Yet Another Edit:- seeing as you have asked the question concerning the replacing of other parts while you have it in bits, I'd think that will depend on how long you plan to keep that car and how it is used.  If you plan on keeping it for another 2 or 3 years, and it is being used as a means of getting to work sort of thing, then with all the crap involved with taking stuff apart, the fact that these springs will eventually break, and the fact that you have already done this work on the rear end, I'd be thinking, "why not".

Edited 16 March, 2018 by rum4mo

[bmbmdmb]

Thanks Rum.

 

I spent this morning having another look around and cleaning up the springs. There is definitely no breaks. I checked both front springs and could feel the top end of the spring. 

 

I'm just waiting on prices from dealer.

 

Having read quite a few fabia posts and mark IV golf's involving top mounts in the search, there is a disturbingly large number of parts owners have replaced before finding the solution is something totally different.

 

[bmbmdmb]

Checked power steering fluid reservoir in case the heavy steering was due to low reservoir fluid / leaky steering rack gaiter etc. 

Reservoir looked full

 

[bmbmdmb]

Update:

 

Appears to be the drivers side shock absorber. No oil remained in this after removal. Although track rod ends and ball joints were replaced.