Are any the brake pads directional on a Fabia 1 VRS?

 

This will be indicated by the arrow on the back if the new pads. Champered surface not symmetrical, or a crescent shape on the back of the pads to allow the piston to contact the back of pad at a slight angle .

 

For those of us not familiar with them they reduce NVH and allow the brake pad to touch the 'leading'   edge of the disc first ie from back to front rather than the brake pad digging into the disc on initial braking.

 

I ask because on the Astra they have them and I nearly fitted the wrong way around across the front set. The instructions online are accurate but those supplied make no reference to this and even contradicted Delphi's own website. For instance,  it is not recommended to lube the ears of the brake pads.  It helps initially,  but the brake dust build up then gunks the brake pads movement.

Website states no to lubing . 

Paper instructions in the box states yes!

 

 

You certainly should not lube the pads at all, a light smear of anti seize on the back where it touches the piston or the caliper is all that's needed to keep the dreaded squeal away.

This week I replaced the corroded front discs on my Yeti and resused the existing Delphi pads because they had no wear and I considered them a good make.

 

I deliberately mixed them up on reassembly because one disc had a bigger band of corrosion than the other.

 

I did notice that the chamfers were assymetrical, did not see any direction arrows but they probably would no longer be visible.

 

I will bear in mind your info and listen out for any juddering, grabbing or NVH and refit them in the correct location if need be.

 

I bet most garages just throw them on.

I thought most pads have a spring clip or some other difference which dictates that they can only go on the piston side or the outer side anyway. I can't remember the last set I fitted where all 4 could go in any location

40 minutes ago, SuperbTWM said:

most pads have a spring clip or

One of the pair of front brake pads has the spring clip. But you will be able to fit that spring clip pad to either front brake disc. 

 

Safety wise I think you are ok. It is a noise , vibration and harshness issue.

 

I ask the above question because I can't remember seeing any obvious difference when I last did Fabia front disc pads.

 

I'm the type of person to research and double check these things, but this one passed me by...

I thought I would bring some awareness to this.

59 minutes ago, J.R. said:

chamfers were assymetrical

I think the largest chamfer is position towards the rear most side of the car, nearer the leading edge of the forward motion of brake disc.

1 hour ago, sepulchrave said:

smear of anti seize on the back where it touches the piston or the caliper is all that's needed to keep the dreaded squeal away.

Agreed. Ceramic brake lube is excellent,  it remains in place and does not melt away. 

PTFE silicone similar to the powerflex lube to the slide pins.

1 hour ago, bmbmdmb said:

One of the pair of front brake pads has the spring clip. But you will be able to fit that spring clip pad to either front brake disc. 

 

 

 

Forgive me if i'm being really stupid here but It doesn't matter which side it goes on, the rotation of the disc is the same at either side in relation to the caliper, so either side it will work on (inside to inside and outside to outside that is)

Edited 6 April, 20206 yr by SuperbTWM

46 minutes ago, SuperbTWM said:

doesn't matter which side it goes on

That's correct from a safety viewpoint.

I thought that too  until I discovered a reference in Haynes manual, albeit an Astra H , to directionality of the pads. 

From a safety viewpoint if you fit them the wrong way ie the arrow point towards back of car you will suffer more noise and vibrations.

Presumably the car will stop in same time.

 

When trying to understand the effect of chamfers or the  crescent grove on the  back of pad in contact with caliper piston it might help to understand the benefit of directionality if you have ever used a grinding wheel.

You never sharpen your chisels head on into the rotating wheel , it digs in.

Similarly,  the side of pad rear most contacting the brake disc you wouldn't want to touch the disc first (digs in). Instead , the directional pads allow the front side of pad, relative to car to contact the disc, reducing NVH.

 

If this is confusing then on a separate issue, how do you make up your mind whether to place the brake pads with the mechanical wear clip if the pads are symmetrical pads, as mainly found on rear brakes, on the inside or outside of brake disc? Also, should it also face forwards or towards the rear, relative to the car.

 

Answer - wear clip to inside of brake disc (most problems lead to inner pad wearing first) and towards the rear (particularly if chamfering present), so the squeal can only be heard on braking. But, this is more an each to their own.

 

Hope this helps.

Edited 6 April, 20206 yr by bmbmdmb

My point is, if a pad has a clip that means it can only fit to the piston side, the arrow will point the same direction whichever side it goes on. Its a mirror image.

 

I understand if all 4 pads are the same then it is important to get them inside or outside the disc, but as for left and right i'm totally baffled as essentially they are the same arrangement. 

 

Take the front of a car for example, while travelling in a forwards motion the brake disc on each side is spinning into the top of pads.

 

I think with Vauxhall pads you must just get a set of 4 identical pads which means you can get them the wrong way, with VAG I don't think you could because all the ones I have ever come across can't go any other way.

Edited 6 April, 20206 yr by SuperbTWM

53 minutes ago, SuperbTWM said:

My point is, if a pad has a clip that means it can only fit to the piston side, the arrow will point the same direction whichever side it goes on. Its a mirror image.

 

 

Are you sure about that?

 

Think about directional tyres being swapped from one side to the other, will they rotate in the same direction?

 

Now if the caliper pistons were on the inside on one side of the car and the outside on the other...........................

 

Not that I have seen any arrows yet but the assymetric chamfers did get me wondering but clearly not enough 🥴

@J.R. Picture yourself looking at either side of your car and imagine you have drawn an arrow on it pointing to the sky, You move around to the other side of the car and the pad has flipped on its long axis but the arrow will still point upwards to the sky and into the direction of rotation.

 

Tyres and discs would move in the opposite direction on the other side but because the caliper is always at the front the discs still turn the same way in relation to the caliper.

Edited 6 April, 20206 yr by SuperbTWM

I freely admit that my weakness as a draughtsman was visualising things and would often draw things back to front, inside out, the wrong hand etc but in this instance I have done my usual physical visualising with objects and my hands and think you are incorrect.

 

The wheels are off my car and I have some spare brake pads, unless you have an epiphany in the meantime, tomorrow I will put an arrow on one with a paint marker and offer it up to both sides, its the only way with my weakness that I can be 100% sure but I'm quite confident on this one.

 

Pride comes before the fall.............................

Can't you do it now? I'll not be able to sleep with anticipation 

12 minutes ago, J.R. said:

I freely admit that my weakness as a draughtsman was visualising things and would often draw things back to front, inside out, the wrong hand etc but in this instance I have done my usual physical visualising with objects and my hands and think you are incorrect.

 

The wheels are off my car and I have some spare brake pads, unless you have an epiphany in the meantime, tomorrow I will put an arrow on one with a paint marker and offer it up to both sides, its the only way with my weakness that I can be 100% sure but I'm quite confident on this one.

 

Pride comes before the fall.............................

 

I think I've had that epiphany, I am definitely wrong.

 

I think in my head I had forgotten that the pad fits the rounded profile of the disc and so it does have to be flipped round to go on the other side.

 

Edited 6 April, 20206 yr by SuperbTWM

Any effect due to the 'crescent shaped cutout' will disappear very soon after the pad is used, and the friction surface machines itself to be parallel to the disc, won't it?

8 hours ago, SuperbTWM said:

the arrow will point the same direction whichever side it goes on

It doesn't. 

That was my issue. 

The arrow is not an up or down. It is a curvy arrow to indicate the direction of rotation, similar to arrow on directional tyres. 

49 minutes ago, Wino said:

Any effect due to the 'crescent shaped cutout' will disappear very soon after the pad is used

It the back of pad and its friction surface are parallel when new, ignoring chamfers , the effect of the crescent recess  on back of pad that piston locates in will mean the wear will result in the 2 surfaces of the pad, back and friction surfaces, are now longer parallel?

 

Or am I wrong and is this just to reduce noise etc early on just after fitting new pads?

 

 

So back to the original question if you are changing your front pads are the Fabia ones directional or not?

 

Here is a link to Delphi

https://www.delphiautoparts.com/gbr/en/resource-center/fitting-directional-brake-pads-right-way

 

PS any heard of Geomet coated discs that don't rust. The Astra 5 spoke alloys have large gaps to let in rain etc.

But, I got last set for car front discs, the rear they don't do. After inquiring with the company,  they now only sell for 2009 models on, even though it only adds a few quid per disc.

The cheap discs I bought from Germany, in a German branded box but with small print "made in RPC" looked to have some sort of electroplated coating looking like anodising (but could not be on steel)  after fitting just turning the disc within the caliper the drag from the pads scraped it off, it was simply silver paint applied without any preparation, nice decorative finish but will probably play havoc with the pads, have not driven it yet to find out but at least they wont rust again before even being used!

4 hours ago, J.R. said:

sort of electroplated coating looking

Could be, I will report back, but might be a while as car still has a lot of work left to do.

It does look different to a quick spray of silver wheel spray paint. I doubt any company would allow their name to be used with the product.  Initial on the drive braking suggests the zinc is alloyed in the steel discs. 

Just checked the box, mine were ATEC Germany (= PRC) Premium (yeah right!) discs, I've had them before & the discs were OK & were oil protected last time, the pads though were amongst the worst I have ever had and being a tigh ar5ed optimistic I have plumbed the depths before.

 

This silver  finish looked really impressive, I would love to have a car painted in it but you could never actually use it or wash it!

That silver crap is cold galv spray to stop rust forming without using any oil.