How much time do you warm-up your Felicia?

[D.FYLAKTOS]

This cable harness is from the factory for the fuel injectors, i haven't touch it at all nor me or any mechanic.

Has the factory tape on which is A' class quality, stiff no melty and very durable.

[nta16]

Fair enough just looked a bit untidy and as if it should go under the throttle cable, been thrown up like a quick washing line, same as a Sky satellite or cable TV installation we get here, speed of installation matters only.

 

[D.FYLAKTOS]

Another test today: my second cold start of the day was shorter in time than the older 3.45 but i didn't measure it exactly because i wanted to go to boulevard before i return home.

Unfortunately it had traffic, i manage to engage even the 4th gear but for a while, disappointed i took the ordinary route to home but although it's cold here the fuel consumption was 10,12ltr / 100km or 27.91 Uk mpg.

[RicardoM]

On 17/11/2021 at 21:08, Thefeliciahacker said:

I on the other hand have a starting ritual. 

Turn the ignition on run position wait for the pump to prime. 

Then start the car with the barely minimum cranking. 

Let the idle stabilise it can take from 5 secs up to 20 secs then the car is fine for me. 

Very decent answer for a Felicia maintained properly. Anything else is paranoia for splitting hairs with zero efficiency and a waste of time and money.

Edited 20 March, 2022 by RicardoM

[D.FYLAKTOS]

Quote

engine will warm up in about 5 minutes. Then you can go to rally with this small family car.

 

When you haven't modify or drove sport style your Felicia you think like this. If any one tries to drive fast this car only after 5 minutes of driving will and up on a pillar-barrier-cliff or the front car's rear bumper.

The participation in this topic is not mandatory, if a member does not find this topic interesting he can proceed to other, "no hard feelings".

 

[RicardoM]

Let's put everything about Skoda Felicia in a single, huge, never ending topic. That would make this section interesting for people searching for useful information. Like those shops "All for 1 dollar" where you enter and you can find anything you can think of.

[cheezemonkhai]

A polite reminder that people remember:

 

 1) People have feelings and please post thinking how you would feel in receipt of a similar post.

 2) Threads are supposed to be about a subject and obviously multiple subjects should have multiple threads.
      When things diverge, it's probably better to have a new thread rather than a very large single thread, as it makes it easier to find things.

 3) It's not anyone's thread, it's a thread on the forum.

 

 

[D.FYLAKTOS]

On 17/11/2021 at 21:08, Thefeliciahacker said:

Let the idle stabilise it can take from 5 secs up to 20 secs then the car is fine for me. 

 

Mine (plus the @HappySkoda car) does not, is it a coincidence or your Felicia has something different or special than ours?

Yesterday i made another test, i let the car idle for 1.30' and the drove slowly with 1st gear to the exit of the parking, when the idle drooped to 830 rpm i look at the timer.

So where is the ''drive it immediately to get warm faster" theory? Why this does not happening?

 

 

 

 

[nta16]

Personally I usually wait around 10-20 seconds before driving off but that is as much about listening to all the car noises for anything unusual or new, to check the warning lights and gauge readings, including the rev-counter, and even if something might smell odd.

 

To have the car sitting static at fast idle is wasting fuel, you might as well have the car moving using that fuel.  In 1st and 2nd gears you are probably at more than say 1,500 rpm when driving the car so above the fast idle speed anyway.  There is no need to drive slowly, obviously you will also not want to drive too quickly until the car is fully warmed.  You want to get the engine up to operating temperature as quickly as possible which usually means driving in the appropriate way given the conditions you face.

 

Do you have an oil cooler, if so is it larger than standard?

 

[D.FYLAKTOS]

1 hour ago, nta16 said:

You want to get the engine up to operating temperature as quickly as possible which usually means driving in the appropriate way given the conditions you face.

 

Do you have an oil cooler, if so is it larger than standard?

 

I will make another test tonight this way, i have done it in the past but i tell you that i didn't like the car's behavior at that time.

Let's see tonight what the TC-6 will show after this kind of driving.

 

No oil cooler installed.

[D.FYLAKTOS]

5 hours ago, nta16 said:

To have the car sitting static at fast idle is wasting fuel

 

I just make some calculations, those 3.40 minutes i burn about 110ml of fuel.

Till now (with the "crank and wait") the fuel consumption is 10,57 ltr / 100 km or 26,72 mpg but let's see in few hours if the "crank and go" technique works better in my modified Felicia.

[nta16]

3 hours ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

I just make some calculations, those 3.40 minutes i burn about 110ml of fuel.

Plus possibly delayed warming and more (hopefully) burnt fuel products to engine and its parts and to the cat.

 

[D.FYLAKTOS]

Tonight "crank & go" results:

Idle frm 1100 to 830 at 2.10 minutes (better than "crank & wait") and fuel consumption 10,62 ltr or 26,60 Uk mpg (slightly worst).

The temperature was one click higher than yesterday and the weather was wet.

I had to try tomorrow, i am not happy.

[nta16]

15 minutes ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

fuel consumption 10,62 ltr or 26,60 Uk mpg

Is this journey consumption or instant consumption?

 

I do not know if there is anything on the car, from which the TC-6 takes its information, that can be as consistently  accurate and precise as you rely on.  I think you need to have a plus and minus margin of error for all the figures you compare.  I do not know but wonder if there is may also be also a margin of error within the TC-6 which would compound the margin of error.  These margins may be small (or not) but so are some (not all) of the differences in the figures you compare.

 

My wife's 2015 Fabia engine on a cold start can sometime seem to be running rough and idle high, but not always, I ignore it and take it as the computer programs getting their panties in a twist.  My car isn't always sweet on its (full mechanical) choke running either - but that is more my guesswork about how far to pull the choke cable out each time.

 

[D.FYLAKTOS]

10 hours ago, nta16 said:

Is this journey consumption or instant consumption?

 

I do not know but wonder if there is may also be also a margin of error within the TC-6 which would compound the margin of error. 

 

It's total consumption, gasoline spended divided to kilometres traveled. The instant consumption changes every 250m, it's impossible to make an average looking the screen.

 

The TC-6 is an indicator and since isn't a NASA tool for sure would be an error, even the gas station pump maybe has an error. Minimal differences doesn't matter but since the route is steady it's a matter of few tests to see which technique works best.

 

[nta16]

1 hour ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

The TC-6 is an indicator and since isn't a NASA tool for sure would be an error, even the gas station pump maybe has an error. Minimal differences doesn't matter but since the route is steady it's a matter of few tests to see which technique works best.

Yes an absolute minimum of three runs of each test circumstances to compare three against three but five or more runs of each would be better, then to average out possibly using the calculated mode figure, or your preference of 'average'. - Mean, Median, Mode, Range Calculator. - https://www.calculator.net/mean-median-mode-range-calculator.html

 

Edited 23 March, 2022 by nta16

[D.FYLAKTOS]

TC-6 is always under voltage, has a sensor to the speedometer, a sensor to the fuel injector and is connected with the factory tank floater, isn't a perfect tool but can show (even in real time) some variables.

For the next 3 days i will follow the ''crank & go" technique and Saturday morning i will make the sum.

[nta16]

Good stuff, but three times is an absolute minimum.

 

Always makes me smile when one car's dash computer fuel consumption is compared to another car's dash computer fuel consumption, especially if one or more are modern VW products.

 

[D.FYLAKTOS]

Today's "crank & go" fuel consumption results:

10,80 ltr or 26,16 mpg and 10,82 ltr or 26,11 mpg.

I will make another two tests but i am not optimistic.

[nta16]

Are you starting the car, checking lights and gauges, look, listen and smell, then pulling off and driving normally not going as slow as a frightened learner driver or as fast as a by-racer, just normal - bear in mind you are an influencing factor in the tests you can get the pessimistic results you prefer as any differences could be small or marginal.

 

I'll get me coat . . .

 

[D.FYLAKTOS]

Same spot on the same floor of the same garage parking, same hour, same route, same calm style of driving till the first traffic light.

 

Keep in mind that i have a disadvantage, the exhaust manifold wrapping.

https://donotdpfdelete.green/exhaust-wrap-pros-and-cons/#2-engine-takes-time-to-warm

this is a saviour on summer temperatures but not at cold start in winter that's why i don't think that the ''crank & go" will work for me better than ''crank & wait 1 minute" but nevertheless i will make another 2 tests.

 

[nta16]

1 hour ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

Keep in mind that i have a disadvantage, the exhaust manifold wrapping.

The flip side might be that it retains more heat to the cylinder head.

 

1 hour ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

why i don't think that the ''crank & go" will work for me better than ''crank & wait 1 minute" but nevertheless i will make another 2 tests.

If you are only waiting 1 minute perhaps the differences will be marginal, I thought you were waiting the 3:40 or whatever for the idle to drop before pulling away, whatever at least three tests of each method and you have some minimum information but it's your car to do with as you please, you've kept it 20+ years so you must be doing things right generally.

 

[D.FYLAKTOS]

3 hours ago, nta16 said:

I thought you were waiting the 3:40 or whatever for the idle to drop before pulling away

No way, that was only for time testing. I never liked the "crank & go" habit.

Today the fuel consumption rised to 10,99 ltr or 25.70 mpg, i will do another test but i am sure will be like this and End of Story with that.

 

Edited 24 March, 2022 by D.FYLAKTOS

[nta16]

3 hours ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

i will do another test but i am sure will be like this and End of Story with that.

I think that could be considered introduced bias to results, really you should not be doing the tests as you have an interest and bias to the results, or even really know what the tests are but just driving in a consist manner, but if the differences are marginal you might as well still to whatever method you prefer but this only relates to fuel consumption for the starts, and at this particular time of year and weather conditions.

 

If you gave it a fair try no more could be asked for from you and you have tested confidence in your method for you and your car (conditions as above).  Some people forget the world is full of variations and differences and think thigs instead are very binary.

 

[D.FYLAKTOS]

Yesterday although the weather was better and the traffic was very light the fuel consumption was 10,91 ltr or 30,82 mpg so the ''crank & go'' does not work for my car.

I don't like driving a cold car with 1100 rpm, i don't like the behaviour nor the sound of the motor and i will never do this again. I always waiting at least 30-60 seconds (depending on the outside temperature) before i start, this is my style for almost 40 years of driving and i don't want to change it no matter if a car manual suggest it. I test it (against my will) and never worked even before the TC-6 era, the ''crank and go" was always for me a hated way of starting a driving route.

Tomorrow i will make a short trip to the highway (to exceed the 100Km on the odometer) later a refuelling to measure the fuel consumption and from Monday morning back to the ''crank & wait" technique.