TMC traffic events no longer being received...firmware update required?

[Tell]

Vag is notorious at pulling the plug early on things it's deemed are finished. This one is specific to the UK market and a group of manufacturers that use it and fund it. Will be interesting to see whether they raise to the occasion to fix it other than that I quess you are looking to a DIY approach along the lines of that link above of fiddling with the parameters. It has the highly respected coding expert DV52 / Don on it.

 

May be Audi are thinking they might get the unit working on the other service if they are paying for it ?. Question is whether there is a DIY solution to that since other VAG brands wouldn't be doing a recall just for that. Any DIY is going to be developed in the UK with a collective of experts on the subject. Meantime cross checking with Google Maps and AmiGo. My normal navigator roll before heading off or if driving back from somewhere.

 

[skomaz]

Just thinking about this - we use Inrix and Trafficmaster data at work - not the live stuff but routing and speed data for traffic models.  I'm starting to wonder if the data we have access to might have the map tables in it etc.

 

[pcbbc]

33 minutes ago, skomaz said:

Just thinking about this - we use Inrix and Trafficmaster data at work - not the live stuff but routing and speed data for traffic models.  I'm starting to wonder if the data we have access to might have the map tables in it etc.

 

Be very careful there. Your company will have a NDA in place with those suppliers.

Better sources of location tables are available. For example other navigation products.

It’s still quite a task to integrate them into a different system.

[skomaz]

2 hours ago, pcbbc said:

Be very careful there. Your company will have a NDA in place with those suppliers.

Better sources of location tables are available. For example other navigation products.

It’s still quite a task to integrate them into a different system.

 

Oh indeed - I wasn't suggesting in the slightest that they could be  extracted or circulate them - I was really just thinking out loud about whether the data sets we have access to actually contain the various tables, as I'm interested in understanding how the technology / system works...   I'm guessing it has a node / link system that represents the network and the data s transmitted in such a way that individual links can be identified alongside live speed data on those links.  The headunit must then use that updated data for the links concerned in the routing algorithms??

[pcbbc]

Fairly much how it works.  TMC codes messages are highly compact, the objective being to fit most messages into the 37 bits that were still available in the RDS message group.  Have a read of chapter 7 here.

 

[Arthur124]

Does anyone have an update ?

[joek666]

21 minutes ago, Arthur124 said:

Does anyone have an update ?

 

Working on it ... it's very difficult trying to get through to anyone at Skoda that both understands the problem and is willing to do something logical about it. 

[Hillbilly23]

23 minutes ago, joek666 said:

 

Working on it ... it's very difficult trying to get through to anyone at Skoda that both understands the problem and is willing to do something logical about it. 

I am still waiting for a reply from my Audi executive who has promised to investigate the problem we are all having.

[Tell]

Suspect it needs a DIY fix if possible other than that the reasons for pulling the plug on the services will stop it (cost) eg. marry it up to the other service.

 

It did vanish for a week or so last year or the year before but this is permanent so it appears linked solely to one of the two UK providers of traffic services. Not European wide.

[Danoid]

I’m due to have my car in soon for something else and they’ll look at TMC at the same time and report back to the Skoda exec I’ve been talking too.

 

p.S I don’t think the person im speaking to is an exec at all just higher up than the previous person

 

[Hillbilly23]

15 hours ago, Danoid said:

I’m due to have my car in soon for something else and they’ll look at TMC at the same time and report back to the Skoda exec I’ve been talking too.

 

p.S I don’t think the person im speaking to is an exec at all just higher up than the previous person

 

We need to keep chewing their ears or nothing will be done.

[Hillbilly23]

Just had a call from Richard my contact at Audi Executive office. I explained our problems in detail and the possible way of solving them. I told him that  vehicles using the NRIX service were not affected and that VAG, Honda and other brand car owners were very unhappy with the situation. He has promised to speak to the technical people and get back to me but he does not sound very hopeful that they either can or will want to fix it. The more of us that complain and the higher up the ladder our complaints get the more chance of some action. He was talking in terms of the service being obsolete but I told him that many of us still use it and that it is not obsolete for owners vehicles using the INRIX service which I pointed out will still be active for a good few years yet. Maybe people with newer cars than mine need to contact them.

[Danoid]

3 hours ago, Hillbilly23 said:

We need to keep chewing their ears or nothing will be done.

Indeed, the thing is the higher up people if they get given a car it’ll always be the latest so they won’t see a problem or care.

 

I personally see it as a fault and dealerships should not be selling a car with a known fault

[Hillbilly23]

2 hours ago, Danoid said:

Indeed, the thing is the higher up people if they get given a car it’ll always be the latest so they won’t see a problem or care.

 

I personally see it as a fault and dealerships should not be selling a car with a known fault

Problem is that the person I spoke to seemed to think that as the service was supplied by a third party it is not their problem. However I did point out that as the maps no longer contain active LTN's that recognise the remaining INRIX RDS-TMC service then maybe £200 a pop is a bit steep.

[NeilE02]

I've just undertaken a journey today which should have taken an hour and a half (according to my sat nav) but actually took two and a quarter. As TMC isn't operational none of the hold-ups registered on the sat nav so obviously no attempt to reroute. Can't see how TMC is "obsolete" as this was the sat nav built into a Skoda which is just 4 years old. The point has been made that this can only increase congestion and pollution. This has cost me more in fuel than it needed to. I will be pushing again both with my local dealership and also with Skoda UK. Customers services have shown no interest in escalating the problem so I will have to do this myself.

[Scalachris]

I must admit to not having read in full the preceding 14 pages on this subject, but the online traffic updates in our 1969 Scala stopped working 3 days ago.  Our subscription with Skoda Connect for this is up to date, so I phoned our local dealer, Yeomans of Exeter.  The person in Service who answered the phone was not aware of any problems, but another person cut in and said that they had one like this last week, and it needs a software update!   So booked in for 4 hours in a fortnight's time, and I sincerely hope I do not have to pay, especially as I have taken out an extended warranty......

[Hillbilly23]

26 minutes ago, Scalachris said:

I must admit to not having read in full the preceding 14 pages on this subject, but the online traffic updates in our 1969 Scala stopped working 3 days ago.  Our subscription with Skoda Connect for this is up to date, so I phoned our local dealer, Yeomans of Exeter.  The person in Service who answered the phone was not aware of any problems, but another person cut in and said that they had one like this last week, and it needs a software update!   So booked in for 4 hours in a fortnight's time, and I sincerely hope I do not have to pay, especially as I have taken out an extended warranty......

Skoda Connect is a different entity from the one we are discussing here. It is the basic RDS-TMC that Trafficmaster used to supply that has been shut down. Yours hopefully may well be just a software issue.

[Tell]

36 minutes ago, Scalachris said:

I must admit to not having read in full the preceding 14 pages on this subject, but the online traffic updates in our 1969 Scala stopped working 3 days ago.  Our subscription with Skoda Connect for this is up to date, so I phoned our local dealer, Yeomans of Exeter.  The person in Service who answered the phone was not aware of any problems, but another person cut in and said that they had one like this last week, and it needs a software update!   So booked in for 4 hours in a fortnight's time, and I sincerely hope I do not have to pay, especially as I have taken out an extended warranty......

That one falls into the category of online connected cars where the Vag software is problematic rather than TMC where Vag and other companies presumably didn't renew the contract so the Traffic Master pulled the plug. 

 

[Scalachris]

Thank you for your various responses explaining how our problem differs; whether or not that is a good thing I shall find out in a fortnight!

[Tell]

If its like Seat / Cupra you'll go through updates which may or may not fix it. Down to the quality of your dealer reading the VAG firmware update material, what the assorted systems are on in the car. They have to all match correctly so they talk to each other correctly. Then you have to have the user login correct. All VAG cars are built with the same core code but embellished with logos etc. They tend to fix VW issues first then work onto the sub brands. Mib3 was a particular disaster for Vag. Yours will be in that area.

 

[dgc188]

I've just had need to make use of the SatNav on my '66 plate Octavia on the first trip out with the caravan and found, like all of us on here, that the TMC traffic didn't work and the SatNav failed to provide the mapping warnings. This has had quite a major issue for me this week in getting back across the Pennines and the horrendous traffic jam on the M62 and the failure of TMC and the SatNav to provide a suitable alternative route.

 

I've been reading through most of this thread (admittedly, not all of it) and find - in some ways - thankfully it's not MY car and, therefore, unnecessary to take it back to the dealer to attempt to diagnose and fix the problem (which they won't) and charge me for the privilege. 

 

I've noted here that it seems various config files loaded onto the car need to be "in sync" with each other. I've not had any "system" firmware during the past 12 months or so but the map data was updated earlier this year. Is it likely that this updated map had broken the sync'ing between these config files.

 

I've had a look/comparison at various map config files between different versions of the mapping and - without knowing exactly which file(s) to compare - they seem to be the same.

 

The current map data file is STD2_1910_EU1_202245 - previously it had been STD2_1810_EU1_202222. I still have the 1720_EU1_202148 file.

The Hardware is H30 - Software is 0359.

 

a) Would there be any mileage in reverting back to a previous map data file?

b) Or simply write the current status off and contact Skoda Support.

c) Anyone have the personal CEO email?

d) Any other ideas/conclusions/ etc.?

 

 

[Tell]

A. No

 

B. Yes

 

C. Pass

 

D. Well there is a hobbyist Mib2 Telegram group of software experts. I have been considering posting it up on one they read. It's around getting the unit to read the other network in the UK that still broadcasts. It is a specific UK issue so those resident abroad can't really experiment. Australian and I think NZ experience is useful you find on the net. I live in the sticks so I doubt it would receive those broadcasts to experiment, so I'm not going to try. Basically it's either going to be a hack solution to get it on that network if possible or navigation users including Vag coughing up to pay TMC to continue the service. Commercially the one Vag uses folded via the FM / DAB service. Not sure whether they used both bands or not. That just leave the

 

These hobbyists are the best bet I reckon if there is no commercial solution they know the ins and outs of mib2.

 

https://github.com/Mr-MIBonk/M.I.B._More-Incredible-Bash

 

But they probably haven't looked at hitching it up on a different TMC provider than those its paired with. There are some UK people on the software side that work with them.... thinking about it. That link is one of their mib2 high tools. There is a mib2 standard group somewhere as well. They produce the toolkits for the standard unit. Those folk that will know the inner workings of how it all hangs together and what's possible. It needs to be put on Inrix rather than Traffic Master as has been said on the thread.

 

Some 2021 discussion technical here. Needs a champion.

 

https://www.golfmk7.com/forums/index.php?threads/enabling-tmc-in-the-uk-is-it-possible.386243/ 

 

[Hillbilly23]

12 minutes ago, Tell said:

A. No

 

B. Yes

 

C. Pass

 

D. Well there is a hobbyist Mib2 Telegram group of software experts. I have been considering posting it up on one they read. It's around getting the unit to read the other network in the UK that still broadcasts. It is a specific UK issue so those resident abroad can't really experiment. Australian and I think NZ experience is useful you find on the net. I live in the sticks so I doubt it would receive those broadcasts to experiment, so I'm not going to try. Basically it's either going to be a hack solution to get it on that network if possible or navigation users including Vag coughing up to pay TMC to continue the service. Commercially the one Vag uses folded via the FM / DAB service. Not sure whether they used both bands or not. That just leave the

 

These hobbyists are the best bet I reckon if there is no commercial solution they know the ins and outs of mib2.

 

https://github.com/Mr-MIBonk/M.I.B._More-Incredible-Bash

 

But they probably haven't looked at hitching it up on a different TMC provider than those its paired with. There are some UK people on the software side that work with them.... thinking about it. That link is one of their mib2 high tools. There is a mib2 standard group somewhere as well. They produce the toolkits for the standard unit. Those folk that will know the inner workings of how it all hangs together and what's possible. It needs to be put on Inrix rather than Traffic Master as has been said on the thread.

 

Some 2021 discussion technical here. Needs a champion.

 

https://www.golfmk7.com/forums/index.php?threads/enabling-tmc-in-the-uk-is-it-possible.386243/ 

 

I think the TMC LTN's (location tables) are actually in the maps rather than the firmware. This would mean that every time the maps needed updating whatever fix was used would need applying to the new maps. I think our main leverage is to get this problem more widely known as it could well affect VAG Group and other manufactures used car sales. I would be more inclined to buy say a Volvo with working TMC than a VAG Group vehicle without it.

 

[Tell]

I'll see if I can get any comments from the Mib collective as I call them on the TMC LTNs location.

[dgc188]

Well, just as expected.......!

 

I emailed support@... ref the missing TMC data and received the following - and within 24 hours over a Bank Holiday (what a surprise!):

 

"We received your email, in which you requested information about TMC.

 

We're sorry to have kept you waiting. We kindly ask you to wait a little while, we have sent your enquiry to the information department in order to provide you with the most accurate and detailed instructions and answers to your questions.

 

Thank you for your cooperation.

 

With kind regards,"

 

Like most others on here I've been having a drag around the 'net and can only find map updates (even later those on the official Skoda portal) and a number of minor firmware updates, but these pre-date this TMC change of provider issue. I have SW MU version 0359 and the best I could get would be 0369 - with a harder to install 0480. Would I be able to update to 0369 without the likelihood of errors for which I would need an add-on box to clear the code? Or maybe it's not worth the hassle for a few (minor) fixes.

 

The full SW Train is MST2_EU_SK_ZR_P0359T - Part number: 5Q0035874B - and Software version: H28.28.133_STD2Nav_EU.

 

BBC's Watchdog might be a further lever to get this sorted, given there are so many owners affected across so many marques. I did shake that stick at support in my email. I doubt it will make any difference to them but maybe getting the Beeb involved might. Matt Allwright and his team are quite good at getting things done.