Diesel - the future

[ufitsy]

Recently I have been looking at the possibility of buying a new Octavia. I've owned a diesel Octavia for 5 years. The problem is that diesels are getting a bad press but I feel that a diesel suits us for mpg and towing.

 

My worry is that I get a new diesel and some hairbrained gov scheme makes it all a bad idea.

 

So at the mo I'm just sticking with what I have and wondering when to pounce.

 

Any ideas?

[bytterga]

if the politicians in norway get what they want,diesel cars is pretty much doomed (petrol is bad too)

Guess it is time to buy a Bicycle and ride through the snow....

and yet i ordered a diesel.......

Your question is indeed relevant.

Edited 16 September, 2015 by bytterga

[Gromle]

Euro 6 diesels are still safe in Norway, but who knows what the future brings.

[Richf]

Living in Shropshire I wouldnt worry too much but if i regularly drove into a city i might be concerned , what with increased parking charges and even extra charges for diesels even entering some cities , this will only rise when the LA's realise how much money they can get from motorists

[Hooknorton2002]

The UK Government are going to remove the current 3% surcharge on Company Car diesels from April 2016. Given that company cars are taxed on co2 emissions, this will mean that most company car drivers will be encouraged to choose diesel. I've just reordered a diesel without a 2nd thought. The Diesel I've just ordered 89g/km so 15% tax band, the equivalent Petrol is 116g/km so 20% tax rate. Add in fuel costs over 30000 miles per year and its no contest.  Company car tax rates have been published for the next 3 years and the still favour diesel, so I cant see an issue for that period at least. 

 

The main issue I have is that the company has taken Skoda of the company car list........

[M12MKD]

If I'm to be honest, regardless of what you buy now, it will change at some stage.

Base it on what you know now. I went to petrol as my driving pattern would not be dpf friendly. But if I did the mileage like before then it would have been diesel.

[BigLee]

I had a diesel for the past 7 years but when I test drove the Skoda the petrol engine was far better imo. I`m even getting between 35-40mpg and the engine is a peach, very flexible from 1k to 6500rpm. Looking on these forums as well the diesel seems to throw up more problems than the petrol. 

I`m very happy with my choice  :sun:

[Gabbo]

I wouldn't factor the possibilities of tax changes into your decision.

Diesel are for sure a hot topic at the moment, particularly for the effect of Nox & particulate emissions in cities.

But then petrol engines will still always but worse for CO2 which is bad for the polar bears.

 

Just buy the car which is best for your needs/mileage.

Any changes in VED are likely to be pretty small e.g. an extra 100gbp a year.
If you compare the fuel savings of a diesel over your mileage, I'm sure it doesn't take long to pay-off the increase anyway.

 

I never understand why people get so worked up about road tax changes when a couple of pence extra at the pump makes much more of a difference over a year of driving.

[Minimoke]

I don’t think there is too much to worry about for the next couple of years, but after that who knows?

 

People keep focussing on the VED rates, but I think that could be the least of the worries in the medium term.

 

Of possibly more impact will be the UK continuing failure to meet EU clean air directives. The government is tossing this over the fence and asking local councils to take action and they can smell money. According to the Department of the Environment new “clean air zones” charging or even banning the most polluting vehicles is likely to be needed in six English cities that are projected to fail EU air quality standards by 2020. They are (apart from London) Birmingham, Leeds, Nottingham, Derby and Southampton.  There will be a £12.50 charge a day for certain older diesels entering London from 2020.

 

I understand that Birmingham council could be one of those councils taking an extreme position, and banning all diesels from the centre. Whether that is eventually actually proposed or even implemented remains to be seen.

 

Islington council  recently started to charge residents a £96 premium for their parking permits if they own an older diesel.

 

Local councils can now clearly see a new income stream and inevitably will milk it for all its worth. This will suit central government who can shrug their shoulders and  blame local councils when the inevitable outcry arises.

 

I recently moved from a diesel Octavia to a petrol one, but that was due to my annual mileage sharply decreasing when I retired. I have been pleased with the TSI in terms of both performance and economy but I accept that it may actually be more polluting in certain emission categories. However diesel has now been firmly labelled as the devils brew.  

 

I would purchase another diesel if I were buying new today (and the mileage justified it), but I would certainly harbour second  thoughts a few more years down the track.

 

Breaking news: I see from the BBC News today that they are now predicting the UK will run out of diesel fuel anyway due to a lack of refining capacity!

[JPH0091]

Mayor announced she intends to eradicate diesel vehicules in Paris intra murros for 2020.

First step was on this September the 1st.

Buses and trucks older than 1997 are not allowed in Paris anymore at daytime.

[ufitsy]

Thanks for the informed replies all  - plenty of food for thought!

Edited 16 September, 2015 by ufitsy

[billybskoda]

My Octy 3 rs is my first ever diseasel. My mk2 was very fast and it sounded great. I have almost the same performance with my tractor, less ved to pay, diseasel is now cheaper than petrol and I have over twice the fuel economy... No really. The only downside is it sounds like a tractor... But there's always the sound generator to compensate partially.

I'm not looking back after ticking the diseasel box. Just wish both tailpipes were connected...

Personally, as a road cyclist I'd love to see the end of diseasel as nothing lubricates a race tyre as well as spilt fuel, but mine suits my lifestyle and more importantly my stretched financial resources....

[usedit67]

I used to always have a diesel as I liked the driving characteristics - torque, lazy, not having to work the gearbox. With low miles and horror stories galore about diesel reliability I plumped for a 1.4 tsi this time. It took a week to get used to it but now I love how it drives. Petrol is different to drive, not better or worse, just different!

[Gerrycan]

I used to always have a diesel as I liked the driving characteristics - torque, lazy, not having to work the gearbox. With low miles and horror stories galore about diesel reliability I plumped for a 1.4 tsi this time. It took a week to get used to it but now I love how it drives. Petrol is different to drive, not better or worse, just different!

 

You are good! It took me at least a couple of months to comes to terms with the petrol after a diesel.

I was convinced I would never drive a petrol again after experiencing the diesel characteristics you describe then I test drove the 1.4tsi, the turbo biased to low rev torque production making all the difference.

Similar torque available but about 4 seconds faster to 100kph when required (purely for medicinal purposes of course).

Cannot match the economy of a diesel but then again not that far behind in normal (Australian) driving conditions.

The thing that still throws me is the complete lack of engine braking available from the 1.4tsi especially down a long reasonably steep hill. I feel stupid with the engine revving its heart out in second gear and still having to use the brakes.

[pipsyp]

I dont think diesel is done yet....they'll just continue to get cleaner.

One reason I really like diesels, particularly when they have a reasonable amount of bhp is that they are generally more effortless to drive than their petrol counterparts. They are also more forgiving on a heavy right foot than a petrol car. Petrols can return good economy nowadays if driven with a level of restraint but a diesel will still produce respectable economy even when ragged. Smaller capacity turbo engines despite their boosted torque outputs need a bit more stiring, particularly if loaded up and if you use the performance you do start seeing MPG figures that wouldnt shame an older high capacity straight six petrol.

I have a Mk7 GTD now....to all intent and purpose it drives like a GTI but with a diesel motor. Performance wise its v strong and in most circumstances as quick if not quicker than the Fabia vRS i had some while ago....maybe not off the mark but in gear once at speed.

It has to be driven differently of course and yes now and again I get frustrated when Im caught out in the wrong gear (where the motor suddenly gets breathless not long after 4k rpm and you feel as though youve hit a wall) but given its performance and the fact it reliably returns high 40's to low 50's per tank of diesel I have no complaints.

I loved the little TSI motor in the Fabia but as fun as it was chasing its 7k red line, it also ran out of steam before its red line and despite all the clever turbo and supercharging it did feel stragely lacking (torque light) at certain points of the rev range which again frustrated.....it also only returned 32mpg and was having to be filled up every 300 miles or so, whereas the Golf will cover a good 450 miles (easily 400 before the light comes on) and they have the same 50l fuel tank i believe. Its also fair to say much like the newer TSI's the new TDI's are leaps and bounds better than what came before them so diesel really isnt a second rate choice...unless of course you simply dont much like diesel powered cars.

I would probably say that if you do a reasonable amount of mileage and particularly spend a fair bit of time on long A or motorway roads a TDI is probably a better bet. If I were doing next to no mileage Id probably get a petrol but more so to avoid any potential difficulties with the DPF.....they are way better now than they were in the previous gen CR motors but short journeys dont do DPF vehicles alot of good particularly if regen cycles keep gettting disrupted.

[Gadget007]

I have a vrs diesel which is in the shop getting repaired (turbo boost pressure sensor issue) in the mean time they have lent me a vrs petrol so I can compare the two. Both are same spec and have the DSG so only difference is the engine.

With the diesel you have loads of low down torque which means effortless driving, but it is so easy to spin the wheels so tyre wear could be higher with the diesel. There is the typical diesel rattle but it's not excessive, many people have commented how quiet it is.

The petrol has plenty of get up and go once the revs build up, uses about 1.5l/100km more fuel at 110km/hr. The artificial sound maker to me makes it sound more like the diesel. Coming out of a corner if you are in too high a gear the diesel seems quicker to pull out of the corner vs petrol, in manual mode you probably would have the right gear selected.

Over here petrol prices vary wildly (upto 15-20c increase per L over night is not uncommon), diesel is very constant in price. The factor in the need for 98RON fuel, if you are doing high km the diesel is by far cheaper to run.

I have had no issues with the DPF, I can hear a change in the engine when it's doing a burn and the fuel consumption increases, but I do a high percentage of highway travelling.

So it really comes down to driving style, if you are only doing a lot of short trips then petrol is best. I guess we are lucky over here as there no extra taxes dependant upon emissions or fuel.

[philhoward]

I've just clocked 15,000 miles in a 177PS Passat TDI and can't wait to get back into a petrol...

 

With a manual diesel I find myself changing gear all the time (it's either too low in the revs and would lose a competition with a bowl of rice pudding, or runs out of revs too quick) and the DSG diesels I've tried don't seem to work right - too keen to keep changing up, then when you do need some "welly", it changes down a few gears into a huge blob of torque that seems to catch me out every time.

 

I found no issue towing across France with a 1.4TSI O3 with DSG.  The lower CO2 figures of a diesel (in manual version) versus the higher list price mean I'll choose a 1.4TSI every time (the upcoming Leon I have on order will be my 4th).  Pick DSG, and the diesel CO2 figures go up, yet petrol ones come down so it's virtually the same (fag packet calculation based on available cars for me).