EU referendum/Brexit discussion - Part 2

[lol-lol]

27 minutes ago, Lee01 said:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/sep/13/brexit-wont-solve-issues-that-led-to-leave-vote-says-mark-price-ex-trade-minister

PLEASE give me some REAL positives of this total and utter catastrophe!!!

Even the backers who fed the lies think crashing out on WTO terms think it's a bad idea now http://leavehq.com/blogview.aspx?blogno=128

 

1. We get proper Duty Free Back !  (But many people will not be able to afford to go abroad).
2. UK government gets a massive new line of revenue to collect upon to fill the massive hole in their finances (UK consumer will pay through the nose for goods they use to get much cheaper.

 

 Things they show little ability  to control:-

1.  Immigration control, now as they could not control non-EU immigration properly over the last 7 years. 
2. Trade deals.  Most countries are either tied to the EU already or get duty free access under General System of Preference (except China who will take a country over lock, stock and barrel given a sniff).   Trade deals take years and Sugar expert David Davis appears way out of his depth.
3. Diplomacy.  Kubla Khan seems to have more ability but the UK will not be the Xanadu (except for the UK rich with lots of their money abroad).       

 

In Xanadu did Kubla Khan  A stately pleasure-dome decree:    Where Alph, the sacred river, ran Through caverns measureless to man  Down to a sunless sea. 

So twice five miles of fertile ground   With walls and towers were girdled round;  And there were gardens bright with sinuous rills, 

Where blossomed many an incense-bearing tree;  And here were forests ancient as the hills,  Enfolding sunny spots of greenery. 

But oh! that deep romantic chasm which slanted Down the green hill athwart a cedarn cover! 

A savage place! as holy and enchanted  As e’er beneath a waning moon was haunted  By woman wailing for her demon-lover! 

And from this chasm, with ceaseless turmoil seething,  As if this earth in fast thick pants were breathing,  A mighty fountain momently was forced: 

Amid whose swift half-intermitted burst  Huge fragments vaulted like rebounding hail,  Or chaffy grain beneath the thresher’s flail: 

And mid these dancing rocks at once and ever It flung up momently the sacred river. 

Five miles meandering with a mazy motion Through wood and dale the sacred river ran,  Then reached the caverns measureless to man, 

And sank in tumult to a lifeless ocean;  And ’mid this tumult Kubla heard from far  Ancestral voices prophesying war! 

Edited 15 September, 2017 by lol-lol

[gadgetman]

2 hours ago, lol-lol said:

 

I can see a Winter of Discontent ahead

I know something is in the offing with the CWU and posties.... 

[S00perb]

5 hours ago, CWARD said:

@S00perb

The pictures of the cats was a low emotional blow, tugging at my heart strings. I want to change my vote and remain in the EU..... no I don't I'm a dog person. 

 

Oh well that is easy to fix - one more remainer on the way...............<soft, sad violin music>.........This poor fella will soon be put behind bars and not know why..... look at those poor sad eyes....will he ever trust his owners again....will he ever get to rip the guts our of Farage?

 

[CWARD]

Low blows indeed. 

[S00perb]

2 hours ago, CWARD said:

Low blows indeed. 

Hardly started

Edited 16 September, 2017 by S00perb

[S00perb]

"I have had the rabies shot to get this and if you think you are taking it away....well just you try......"

[S00perb]

I don't think so sunshine..........

[@Lee]

It's no wonder people who read the likes of The Express and Mail get so confused......................
 

[S00perb]

Murdock wanted brexit - sheeple followed

[CWARD]

yet still all three sources get the process wrong

[@Lee]

We'd trade with the world, they said. It'll be fine, they said..............................

 

Quote

Australia's historical relationship with the UK is now one of  "yesteryear," the country's trade minister told the European Parliament today, as he stressed that doing a free trade deal with the EU was now a greater priority for Australia than doing one with post-Brexit UK.

http://www.politics.co.uk/news/2016/09/08/australian-trade-minister-says-special-relationship-with-uk?utm_content=buffer85221&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer
 

[Ootohere]

Some in the EU and the President of the EU Commission think that a threat of sanctions against Hungary is 'simply clever', telling them future borrowing of money might become an issue.

Problem with the attitude some are taking is just how close the Hungarian leadership are to Putin and how much they are now tied in with finance from Russia.

[CWARD]

Same with Bulgaria, with more investment from Russia than the EU. Turkey received more EU funding than Bulgaria.

I wonder what motives are behind the push to the Euro.  

 

More EU trade agreements to be rushed  through before October 2019. Make no wonder why he wants qualified majority instead of actual agreement by all states. What benefits the few rather than majority of states, nice democracy. 

Hope they make a better job of it than they did of CETA. 

[gadgetman]

8 minutes ago, CWARD said:

More EU trade agreements to be rushed  through before October 2019. Make no wonder why he wants qualified majority instead of actual agreement by all states. What benefits the few rather than majority of states, nice democracy. 

Hope they make a better job of it than they did of CETA. 

Nearly all of these deals have been worked on for years. 

 

The problem is we'd have to either copy these, or go WTO. 

[CWARD]

16 minutes ago, gadgetman said:

Nearly all of these deals have been worked on for years. 

 

The problem is we'd have to either copy these, or go WTO. 

 

You say that like it's a good thing which means you don't understand the implications of CETA

 

Critics oppose the treaty on the grounds that it will weaken European consumer rights, including those concerning food safety, and that tariffs are already very low.^[14] It has also been criticized as a boon only for big businessand multinational corporations, while risking net-losses, unemployment, and environmental damage impacting individual citizens.^[15][16][17]The deal also includes a controversial investor-state dispute settlement mechanism. In contrast to its popularity among Canadians, the agreement has prompted protests in a number of European countries.

 

2.5 years to agree a weaker hand, that is far from impressive. 

 

Australians aren't the biggest fans of the EU when Junker has virtually called them racist for their immigration policy. I think we know who holds the upper hand when Australia doesn't list a great of benefits other than cheaper European designer goods and the EU need minerals and meat. 

Edited 16 September, 2017 by CWARD

[moley]

Australia wants post-Brexit free trade deal with UK 'ASAP', Turnbull says after talks with May

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-07-10/australia-wants-a-free-trade-deal-with-the-uk-asap-after-brexit/8695590

[@Lee]

4 minutes ago, moley said:

Australia wants post-Brexit free trade deal with UK 'ASAP', Turnbull says after talks with May

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-07-10/australia-wants-a-free-trade-deal-with-the-uk-asap-after-brexit/8695590

Well then I guess they changed their mind since that article from July  

[moley]

2 hours ago, Lee01 said:

Australia's historical relationship with the UK is now one of  "yesteryear," the country's trade minister told the European Parliament today, as he stressed that doing a free trade deal with the EU was now a greater priority for Australia than doing one with post-Brexit UK.

 

3 minutes ago, Lee01 said:

Well then I guess they changed their mind since that article from July  

The article you posted was dated 8th September 2016. It's now 2017

[@Lee]

20 minutes ago, moley said:

 

The article you posted was dated 8th September 2016. It's now 2017

Ahhh well. Looks like the game is afoot  

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-eu-trade-deal-australia-latest-new-zealand-jean-claude-juncker-a7944516.html

[moley]

2 minutes ago, Lee01 said:

Ahhh well. Looks like the game is afoot  

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-eu-trade-deal-australia-latest-new-zealand-jean-claude-juncker-a7944516.html

The UK cannot make any trade deals until it leaves the EU, therefore the EU can make deals before the UK. The Australians view is they want to do a deal as soon as we leave.

Quote

A free trade agreement between New Zealand and the UK will be finalised once Britain leaves the EU.

www.stuff.co.nz/business/world/94486159/new-zealand-and-uk-to-sign-a-free-trade-agreement-soon. Dated  09/07/2017

[@Lee]

3 minutes ago, moley said:

The UK cannot make any trade deals until it leaves the EU, therefore the EU can make deals before the UK. The Australians view is they want to do a deal as soon as we leave.

www.stuff.co.nz/business/world/94486159/new-zealand-and-uk-to-sign-a-free-trade-agreement-soon. Dated  09/07/2017

By which time guess who'll get the shi77y end of the stick  A trading bloc of 440 million customers or a pished up island of 65 million customers? 
 

[CWARD]

Lee, Australia and New Zealand won't be rushed to fit Junkers schedule.

 

Are you also under illusion that the UK couldn't make a trade agreement with any country the EU has? We can and that doesn't involve having any sticks

[Ootohere]

Lee01, only 65 million, or is that how many in the UK while there seems to be British Nationals around the world including in the Overseas Territories,

 there are plenty wanting their exports into the UK and the cash money, even using UK Banking & other Financial Services..

Be it only 65 million or what ever the real figure is for the population of the UK.

Those Australians & other Commonwealth Countries want to also visit and work in the UK not just trade.

 

Worthless Sterling and UK Taxes and  other little fringe benefits seem to have an attraction to so many from around the world even if not supposedly to the EU Countries.

There are still other European Countries not actually in the UK that it is important to trade with the rest of the world via the UK, ones like Switzerland.

 

?

Does anyone know how many UK Passport Holders there are around the world according to the British Government, 

or how many are free to enter the UK without any issues from Commonwealth Countries that are not UK Passport Holders?

Edited 16 September, 2017 by Headinawayoffski

[CWARD]

It does seem very odd how so many people want to the UK from all around the world with everything the remainers say. Still even after Brexit more have applied for U.K. passports by a third. They must know something that the remainers don't. 

https://www.ft.com/content/5cb90646-2ff8-11e7-9555-23ef563ecf9a

 

 

[@Lee]

9 minutes ago, CWARD said:

It does seem very odd how so many people want to the UK from all around the world with everything the remainers say. Still even after Brexit more have applied for U.K. passports by a third. They must know something that the remainers don't. 

https://www.ft.com/content/5cb90646-2ff8-11e7-9555-23ef563ecf9a

 

 

Why is that? Ha! If you haven't figured that out you really are in cloud cuckoo land