EU referendum/Brexit discussion - Part 2

[S00perb]

CWord - you quote that as it it were a bad thing. Nothing he has said I have a problem with.

At the end of the day I trust the EU more than I do the nutters that seem to end up running the UK. In the UK, they seem to look at what will win them the next election. Long term thinking goes out the window.

I have found that the bigger the ship, the harder it is to make a sudden turn and in general it heads in the best direction. It's the small ship that can make a hasty turn and end up on the rocks.

Edited 15 September, 2017 by S00perb

[CWARD]

Meanwhile Spain prepares to take drastic (desperate and stupid) action to stop Catalonia independence referendum 

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-41284764

 

It will be interesting to see how the Basque region takes this 80 years after the civil war. They've never really forgiven the Nationalist government or their German and Italian for their part in the murder  of whole villages. 

[S00perb]

8 minutes ago, CWARD said:

Meanwhile Spain prepares to take drastic (desperate and stupid) action to stop Catalonia independence referendum 

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-41284764

 

It will be interesting to see how the Basque region takes this 80 years after the civil war. They've never really forgiven the Nationalist government or their German and Italian for their part in the murder  of whole villages. 

Spain shoud let them vote, they have wanted independance for so long now.

I had a friend over from there and took him and his brother to Aberystwyth - they were stunned to find a Catalonian flag on the sea-front. No idea why it was there alongside all the other flags, but it made their day!

[CWARD]

9 minutes ago, S00perb said:

Spain shoud let them vote, they have wanted independance for so long now.

I had a friend over from there and took him and his brother to Aberystwyth - they were stunned to find a Catalonian flag on the sea-front. No idea why it was there alongside all the other flags, but it made their day!

 

I have friends in Barcelona and Calonge, they are so proud to be Catalonian and I know exactly how they'll vote and they will. 

[CWARD]

38 minutes ago, S00perb said:

CWord - you quote that as it it were a bad thing. Nothing he has said I have a problem with.

At the end of the day I trust the EU more than I do the nutters that seem to end up running the UK. In the UK, they seem to look at what will win them the next election. Long term thinking goes out the window.

I have found that the bigger the ship, the harder it is to make a sudden turn and in general it heads in the best direction. It's the small ship that can make a hasty turn and end up on the rocks.

 

Nice analogy but I prefer Martin Luther King

    "The ultimate tragedy is not the oppression and cruelty by the bad people but the silence over that by the good people."

[@Lee]

Remember this from May 2016 (one month BEFORE the referendum) http://www.itv.com/news/2016-05-22/armed-forces-minister-uk-unable-to-stop-turkey-joining-eu/

Well, The president of the European Commission said on Wednesday he saw no prospect of Turkey joining the EU in “the foreseeable future”

His full speech is here. The EU are open and transparent in what they do.  

[S00perb]

38 minutes ago, CWARD said:

 

Nice analogy but I prefer Martin Luther King

    "The ultimate tragedy is not the oppression and cruelty by the bad people but the silence over that by the good people."

The only oppression I see is that of the 48% who are having their citizenship put at risk

[@Lee]

1 minute ago, S00perb said:

The only oppression I see is that of the 48% who are having their citizenship put at risk

Not to mention the lives, jobs and families of The 3 million. 

[S00perb]

These two will actually be put behind bars next time their owners go abroad!!!!!!!

 

[CWARD]

@S00perb it's called democracy when the actual majority decide the outcome of a vote. 

The pictures of the cats was a low emotional blow, tugging at my heart strings. I want to change my vote and remain in the EU..... no I don't I'm a dog person. 

 

@Lee01 3 million is all that's left now if the jobs after what industries have been moved east and those that were employed now redundant or jobs taken by cheap labour from the east pricing them out of the market due to the EU? It's just as well we're leaving the EU so we can start to look after what's left of our workforce. 

[lol-lol]

 

Taken 15 months for the markets to realise just how bad BREXIT is going to be now we have had the UK currency down for over a year feeding inflation and it is sounding like the UK is going to get interest rate rises in a matter of weeks.  

 

FTSE 

 

 

Of course with interest rate rises coming over the horizon the currency has started its long back to the 1.45 it was in the first half of 2016 so that should slow inflation as many people have less to spend as more of their wages go to mortgages and other debts.   

 

"Interesting" times a head.   We will still use 1.279 for customs purposes until October sadly as law dictates.    

 

[moley]

9 hours ago, S00perb said:

12 hours ago, moley said:

Max Mosley said:

Care to elaborate on this?

[Ootohere]

lol-lol,

Many people had less to spend when Northern Rock went down and your money was in there getting 6.4% interest, and took it out or went to Virgin and then had to take 3.4% interest for a while and then could not even have that much for their life savings, or money from downsizing.

 

so plenty have been borrowing cheap money at low interest rates, and still bankers take their fees and get big bonuses and while the savers and tax payers pay for mis-selling and PPI mis-selling non in the UK go to jail or are losing ill gotten  gains.

 

Just remember those with saving from having bought property when they were paying 16% interest then got near nothing as Building Societies then lend their money.

[@Lee]

13 minutes ago, CWARD said:

@S00perb it's called democracy when the actual majority decide the outcome of a vote. 

The pictures of the cats was a low emotional blow, tugging at my heart strings. I want to change my vote and remain in the EU..... no I don't I'm a dog person. 

 

@Lee01 3 million is all that's left now if the jobs after what industries have been moved east and those that were employed now redundant or jobs taken by cheap labour from the east pricing them out of the market due to the EU? It's just as well we're leaving the EU so we can start to look after what's left of our workforce. 

It's hardly democracy when a VERY slim majority won a referendum that was based on lies and gerrymandering is it? Dogs will be subject to quarrantine as well a s cats, BTW
The comment aimed at me; I have literally no idea what you're talking about. That sentence is close to gibberish.

[Ootohere]

The slim majority were just those that voted one way,

the ones that had less voting the same as them are not get it their way and they also were feed nonsense and lies,

 and which ever way people voted they are doing nothing about it now other than bumping their gums.

 

Some Polititicians lost their seats in the Snap General Election and the biggest liars were re-elected.   Odd country, but then that is why so many are prepared to die trying to get into it, live and work here, the population looks like it is not dropping anytime soon. 

[CWARD]

39 minutes ago, Lee01 said:

It's hardly democracy when a VERY slim majority won a referendum that was based on lies and gerrymandering is it? Dogs will be subject to quarrantine as well a s cats, BTW
The comment aimed at me; I have literally no idea what you're talking about. That sentence is close to gibberish.

 

It is still democracy. If the vote had gone the other way you'd be singing a very different tune and I would accept the vote, unlike yourself. 

BTW,I don't own a dog. I just prefer them to cats 

 

1 hour ago, Lee01 said:

Not to mention the lives, jobs and families of The 3 million. 

 

It was yourself talking of only 3 million. 

[@Lee]

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/sep/13/brexit-wont-solve-issues-that-led-to-leave-vote-says-mark-price-ex-trade-minister

PLEASE give me some REAL positives of this total and utter catastrophe!!!

Even the backers who fed the lies think crashing out on WTO terms think it's a bad idea now http://leavehq.com/blogview.aspx?blogno=128

[@Lee]

54 minutes ago, Headinawayoffski said:

 

the ones that had less voting the same as them are not get it their way and they also were feed nonsense and lies,

 

The ones who voted remain voted for the status quo. The so-called 'nonsense and lies' you refer to were what was known as 'project fear' AKA (now Project Fact).

England, Northern Ireland, Scotland and Wales go to a pub. England gets pished and says 'we're leaving' so they all had to go.

[lol-lol]

1 hour ago, Headinawayoffski said:

lol-lol,

Many people had less to spend when Northern Rock went down and your money was in there getting 6.4% interest, and took it out or went to Virgin and then had to take 3.4% interest for a while and then could not even have that much for their life savings, or money from downsizing.

so plenty have been borrowing cheap money at low interest rates, and still bankers take their fees and get big bonuses and while the savers and tax payers pay for mis-selling and PPI mis-selling non in the UK go to jail or are losing ill gotten  gains.

Just remember those with saving from having bought property when they were paying 16% interest then got near nothing as Building Societies then lend their money.

 

I just fear for those who are in the same position we were when the Cons were in power in the early and mid nineties when they had mortgages and house worth 90% of the mortgage then through the economic mis-management ended up with the mortgage being 10 to 20% larger than the value of the properties and their mortgages going up as interest rates doubled, tripled, quadrupled.

 

It would be nice to see savings rates up at least around the level of inflation, which is now almost 4% for RPI-All Items but if that means mortgage rates at 6% or so on that would hurt a lot of people and especially those in the Public sector who have had only 1% pay rises (effectively 1,2,3% cuts measured against inflation so something like 10% compared to 2010.  Yes tax free allowance have gone up a bit but stealth taxes like NI (not National Insurance but now known as the Northern Ireland DUP bung cause it aint going on the NHS) whilst top pay has continued to rise way faster than inflation.

 

I can see a Winter of Discontent ahead and that is perhaps why Police and Prison Officers are to be given larger rises to deal with discontent ! 

Edited 15 September, 2017 by lol-lol

[Ootohere]

Lee01,

You read that someplace no doubt, or asked people, or just decided you know they voted for the status quo, 

there was going to be no status quo for the UK and the EU, because the UK were a PITA to them and not properly a member, just an affiliate member paying full price.

[@Lee]

1 minute ago, lol-lol said:

 

 

 

I can see a Winter of Discontent ahead and that is perhaps why Police and Prison Officers are to be given larger rises to deal with discontent ! 

Equating to ~ £7/wk. I'm sure they're ecstatic! 

[@Lee]

1 minute ago, Headinawayoffski said:

Lee01,

You read that someplace no doubt, or asked people, or just decided you know they voted for the status quo, 

 

No. It's simple, George. The question asked Remain or Leave. Those who ticked the remain box voted for the status quo.
Those who ticked the other box had no guarantee of what they were voting for. Read my comment Re Daniel Hannan a few posts back.

[Ootohere]

No they voted to remain in the EU, keep the MEP's and all the rest and still had no idea where the EU were going because the UK were not getting to veto everything.

[@Lee]

Seriously, George. Put the crack pipe down. The UK HAD a veto. 

[@Lee]

Worrying stuff. @trundlenut, this might interest you.

http://comprop.oii.ox.ac.uk/wp-content/uploads/sites/89/2017/07/Troops-Trolls-and-Troublemakers.pdf