EU referendum/Brexit discussion - Part 2

[shyVRS245]

1 minute ago, Skoda_newby said:

 

A quote from Sir Brian Clough.....

He's always available for a good quote.

[domhnall]

19 minutes ago, moley said:

err....NO,

www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/wto-says-its-rules-would-not-force-eu-or-uk-to-erect-hard-irish-border-1.3710136

 

 

it's all rather academic because trade blocs have hard borders at their external frontiers - otherwise there is no point in having their favoured arrangements in their trade bloc single market

[shyVRS245]

On 11/03/2019 at 10:33, domhnall said:

 

 

I suspect unlike everyone else on this thread I have met and continue to meet with politicians who are driving this process. I meet not only the Brexiteers, but also Government Ministers and officials and of course the opposition. 

 

What this seems to be about for the Government is about changing the alignment of our legal system (and therefore the detailed regulations which control every aspect of our lives). They think that for too long we have been aligned with Europe. This is a relatively novel thing for England - though of course in Scotland it has been something that started in the 1500s if not earlier (our legal system is based on Roman law heavily  influenced by Dutch law and has been since the days of the Reformation).

 

The Government wants to align us with (and in some cases adopt) US law. 

 

Everything else is detail but that is the guiding principle behind current government policy. They want us to trade more with the Americans and in order to do that our laws and regulations have to become more American. No doubt many of the active participants in this thread will howl with protest and ask me to cite articles or proof or public statements. I can do none of those things. All I can do is tell you what Ministers and officials have been telling me in meetings since late 2016 onwards. On one occasion the UK companies I represent were told they'd said enough and they were "too European" and the Government wanted to hear more from the American companies in our group. They too hate the idea of US regulation coming here and all the GOvernment could say was "that's very disappointing". 

 

We may well find our "sovereignty" is merely an exercise in swapping from being one of 27 in decision making to being the junior partner trying to negotiate with a powerful giant. 

See you never discuss the WTO rules when you meet Government Ministers and the Opposition or you wouldn't concur with LEE about blatant lies. Or perhaps all of the above statement of fact is bull.

[RicardoM]

On 10/03/2019 at 15:53, moley said:

What is the exact source of this illustration? Link please.

Edited 12 March, 2019 by RicardoM

[domhnall]

Just now, shyVRS245 said:

See you never discuss the WTO rules when you meet Government Ministers and the Opposition or you wouldn't concur with LEE about blatant lies. Or perhaps all of the above statement of fact is bull.

 

 

listen my friend, you can choose to believe what I say I do for a living or you can not. I don't personally give a toss. WTO discussion of telecoms has been stalled since 1996 so no, we don't really see it as very relevant. What we are concerned about is 1) what law will apply?  2) we are experiencing a worsening labour shortage what will the government do to help? and 3) on transfer of data what plans do they have to seek an adequacy designation so that we can continue to import and export data. 

The government's focus is on transitioning us away from EU rules (which are largely a British invention) to a US based system of regulation (which none of the US based companies would welcome) 

Just by way of proof that I am not imagining all of this here is the text of an email I sent on 30 January

 

 

Dear all

 

As promised in our last meeting with them, DCMS are now starting work on planning for a no deal Brexit.

 

They have called and asked if we can suggest a date and time for a meeting with them. The things they are keen to hear our views on are:-

1. What are our key concerns about a no deal Brexit?
2. What have our members done to prepare for the impact of a no deal Brexit?
3. How can DCMS engage with us to help inform policy makers about industry concerns?

 

I was tempted to ask whether they had listened at all to what we said when we last met or if they had read any emails we have sent them over the last two years but good manners prevailed.

 

Is anyone able and willing to meet? If so can you suggest some dates?

 

Many thanks

 

 

 

 

[@Lee]

Just now, RicardoM said:

What is the exact source of this illustration? Link please.

Looks like Guardian font.

[moley]

1 minute ago, RicardoM said:

What is the exact source of this illustration? Link please.

Look in the lower left corner. 

[RicardoM]

Just now, moley said:

Look in the lower left corner. 

That is not proof enough.

[@Lee]

9 minutes ago, shyVRS245 said:

See you never discuss the WTO rules when you meet Government Ministers and the Opposition or you wouldn't concur with LEE about blatant lies. Or perhaps all of the above statement of fact is bull.

You should be more careful with your words. I don't take kindly to being called a liar. If you care to read back I said 'IIRC' (If I Remember Correctly)
 

[shyVRS245]

6 minutes ago, Lee01 said:

Looks like Guardian font.

Must be true then.

[moley]

3 minutes ago, RicardoM said:

That is not proof enough.

Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition. 

[shyVRS245]

4 minutes ago, Lee01 said:

You should be more careful with your words. I don't take kindly to being called a liar. If you care to read back I said 'IIRC' (If I Remember Correctly)
 

Sorry keep forgetting about your inability to notice the difference between a fact and what you imagine/remember to be correct. I will bare that in mind going forward.TIA.

[@Lee]

13 minutes ago, RicardoM said:

What is the exact source of this illustration? Link please.

Found it in this link
https://inews.co.uk/news/charts/much-uk-pays-eu-much-get-back/

Four pages of reverse image searches so far nothing directly from a europarl site.
Possibly an interpretation from other graphs.

[RicardoM]

4 minutes ago, moley said:

Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition. 

Dude, you should have the decency to quote the exact source of the drawings you post. That looks an important piece of information, if true. Information should not be eaten with the big spoon unless verified. Don't you have enough BBC?

BTW, being sarcastic doesn't make you smarter.

Edited 12 March, 2019 by RicardoM

[shyVRS245]

Shame that the Netherlands, Sweden, Germany, Denmark, Finland, Austria and France will have to find an extra 7.1 billion Euro's when the UK leaves the EU. Perhaps they will put up taxation like Macron tried in France. Can see more protests and civil unrest throughout Europe going forward and the political map changing from the current cosy arrangements. No wonder the EU Commissioners are so worried.

[RicardoM]

5 minutes ago, shyVRS245 said:

Shame that the Netherlands, Sweden, Germany, Denmark, Finland, Austria and France will have to find an extra 7.1 billion Euro's when the UK leaves the EU. Perhaps they will put up taxation like Macron tried in France. Can see more protests and civil unrest throughout Europe going forward and the political map changing from the current cosy arrangements. No wonder the EU Commissioners are so worried.

So you have based your judgement on a piece of unverified info. A joke of a map.

[moley]

19 minutes ago, RicardoM said:

Dude, you should have the decency to quote the exact source of the drawings you post. That looks an important piece of information, if true. Information should not be eaten with the big spoon unless verified. Don't you have enough BBC?

BTW, being sarcastic doesn't make you smarter.

Any major dude well tell you.

https://inews.co.uk/news/charts/much-uk-pays-eu-much-get-back/

 

[@Lee]

 

[Ootohere]

If the lovely Blue & Yellow balls image is from 2014 showing money in and money out is there similar for 2018?

[moley]

2 minutes ago, Skoffski said:

If the lovely Blue & Yellow balls image is from 2014 showing money in and money out is there similar for 2018?

I could only find this one for 2010, but it's from the Guardian, so it has to be correct.

[shyVRS245]

BBC being investigated for not paying female workers the same as male colleagues. Nothing to do with how they report the news.

[Skoda_newby]

1 hour ago, shyVRS245 said:

He's always available for a good quote.

 

I wonder if his compost has it's own twitter account?

[shyVRS245]

24 minutes ago, RicardoM said:

So you have based your judgement on a piece of unverified info. A joke of a map.

So you think the EU Commission is a joke organisation as they produced this information?

[domhnall]

5 minutes ago, shyVRS245 said:

BBC being investigated for not paying female workers the same as male colleagues. Nothing to do with how they report the news.

[Ootohere]

I like this bloke. In short measures..

Regardless of any truth in what he says, he never asked for 'Fund me help' to my knowledge.

But who knows who is in it for what ever reason.   It is good to talk!