Which engine?

[ednmra]

Mine is an October  2014 1.4 TSi manual on regular 16" wheels. Road tax £30. So far no hint of any mechanical trouble. Feels like a MUCH bigger engine.

Gets well over 40 mpg on a reasonably long run, cruising say in the 60s. So far all I have replaced is wiper blades.

I haven't yet heard of any built-in reliability problems, certainly not with timing chains.

[guitarman001]

That's encouraging to hear. What would you say your average mpg is? 

My 25 miles is half motorway (stop-start) and half bypass (plain sailing). 

Just trying to decide between 1.2 and 1.4. 

Edited 8 March, 2017 by guitarman001

[themanwithnoaim]

The 1.4 TSI is bulletproof, for god sake I've done everything but shoot mine and its still runing great.

[guitarman001]

I believe you! I've no doubts about the engine now, honest. Just weighing up the extra cost of the 1.4, that's all

[themanwithnoaim]

Guitarman001, with the stuff you've got come in your personal life, you're gonna need something that can put a smile on your face.

 

You might wanna look out for the Rio Fernand's documentary coming up in the spring, its about dealing with being a widower, my neighbor is in it talking Rio through what has and what hasn't helped him.

[guitarman001]

The grief will be overwhelming, it's like I'm mourning already. 

Totally understand what you're saying. Given the wedding & new-build house costs (+ solicitors & funeral costs) and the two girls who'll be staying with me, I need to watch the cash. That's the only reason I've mentioned the Civic diesel (sorry, I know this is a Skoda forum!) as @70mpg isn't to be sniffed at. I think when it comes down to it, I'll get the 1.2 TSi unless I feel flush on the day..!

Edited 9 March, 2017 by guitarman001

[guitarman001]

Do you guys think I'm dismissing diesel Octavias too early on? I see the price for the 1.6 diesel isn't too far off the petrol... and mpg is 55+ with zero road tax.. 

[Gerrycan]

All other things being equal you should never get a petrol to match the economy of a diesel.

The 10% higher calorific content per litre and the efficiency of the higher compression ratios of diesel mean you should get 15% better mpg BUT.....

 

Reading all the various threads on consumption, as I do, there seems to be a much larger unexplained variation in diesel results than petrol returns.

There are about four Octavia 1.4tsi owners showing their Fuelly.com returns in their signature, and we are all averaging about 44 to 47 mpg over the life of the vehicle, which I think is pretty impressive for the size/weight of the vehicle. My individual tank's returns vary from 40 to 55 mpg.

On the sort of run you describe I would expect to get around 50mpg or better. The high number of really short 3 mile or under runs my car does murders my figures especially in hot weather with aircon on when it dips below 40 mpg.

The 30 mpg return of TMWNA (themanwithnoaim) can be completely ignored for this exercise for obvious reasons.

 

A surprising number of the Octavia 2litre diesel owners who display their fuel returns show similar 45 mpg averages (Gabbo in Switzerland is reporting 52mpg). On longer journeys some are reporting 60+mpg returns, which is certainly possible in the right conditions.

On the other hand there have been a small number of diesel owners who just cannot get better than 45mpg in any circumstances, and the fact they could do better in other vehicles strongly suggests there was something wrong with their car not detectable by the dealers.

I cannot remember the exact details but one contributor complained his 2.0d got something less than 130 miles from a tank when his wife used it for a while, but it also returned to normal when he took it back. Short journeys and continual interrupted DPF regens must have done that.

On the hand if you look in the Superb forum there are a couple of owners with identical engines getting sensational returns, one 2litre diesel averaged 77 mpg for the first 2k miles with a best of 99mpg on one trip where he admitted to really trying to break 100mpg.

 

Reports of the Octavia 1.6d are also a mixed bag and while some can get very good returns, there are some very disappointed customers especially in view of the high official results. Again for some reason Superb 1.6d owners generally report better even impressive returns with the same engine. I guess Superb drivers must be .....superb drivers

 

For your sort of journey you would probably find the diesel a better option although possibly a bit more of a gamble.

If you can get a 1.6d Honda at a good price then why not especially if that 70+mpg is being reported by owners and not just depending on official figures? You would have a much better idea of how good/bad it is than I since not many have been sold here in Australia.

 

[threadbear]

I'm getting an average of 56.7 mpg from my 1.6 TDi 110ps Octavia and it's only done 250 miles. 

[brettikivi]

I see that also from my 1.0

Summer saw us get around that from a 2.0TDI. Considering the tax regime and also re-check insurance costs.

 

 - Bret

[guitarman001]

Brilliant reply, Gerrycan!

I read this morning that government may be wanting to tax diesels more.

Another factor for me is that while I'm currently doing this commute.. I've been in this job 8 years so if I ever changed I'd only be driving half a mile to the train station car park. 

 

45+ mpg from either the 1.4 or 1.2 (should be about 3-4mpg higher for the 1.2 from what I read) would swing it for me I think. I'd be really disappointed if it dipped below that figure. Up to 50mpg for cars like that and I'd be very happy, I must say.

[Ootohere]

'All things being equal'  like driving your vehicle for more than 20 miles at a time and then driving the same speeds the diesel should really show a better economy by using less diesel than a petrol vehicle of much the same weight.

 

So getting 600 miles from a tank holding the same amount of diesel as the petrol version getting 500 miles is good.

The issue is if the diesel is doing regens because it is not always being used long enough to be at an efficient operating temperature and that lovely low mpg then goes right out the window meaning that the diesel costs you as much in fuel as a petrol vehicle does.

So that is not 'Simply Clever',  buy the vehicles with the engine that suits your needs & uses and location location.

 

PS

As to VW Group 1.4 TSI / 1.4 TFSI , 1,4TSI ACT 1.4 TFSI COD.  1.2 TSI , 1.2 TFSI, 

VW know they are now accepting that the Real World MPG and emissions results from EU Testing and future tests show their cheating and this is why they are going to the 1.5 TSI ACT and 1.0 TSI.

Maybe Implausible / Irregular Co2 results to end. Maybe not.

 

VW never just cheated or used questionable means with TDI's during Emission testing of Euro 5 engine vehicles.

http://skoda.co.uk/pages/fuel-consumption-statement.aspx 

Edited 9 March, 2017 by Awayoffski

[glosrich]

The Civic 1.6 iDtec can be had from £7k with reasonable miles circa 25k. They are good cars, only criticism is the Swindon build quality isnt maybe as good as the Japanese Honda, but there isnt much in it.

 

However is is a much smaller car, the boot isn't anywhere near as big, and the back seat area is smaller and quite claustrophobic due to the high windows.

 

I would buy a petrol Octavia, the are perky and responsive to drive and almost as economical as a diesel now. Especially if you do less than 15k miles a year. Also no DPF to worry about.

 

The tide is turning, diesels are becoming unpopular and values will drop as we realise they are choking us with the NO2 and particulates.

[iriches]

5 hours ago, Awayoffski said:

As to VW Group 1.4 TSI / 1.4 TFSI , 1,4TSI ACT 1.4 TFSI COD.  1.2 TSI , 1.2 TFSI, 

VW know they are now accepting that the Real World MPG and emissions results from EU Testing and future tests show their cheating and this is why they are going to the 1.5 TSI ACT and 1.0 TSI.

Maybe Implausible / Irregular Co2 results to end. Maybe not.

 

When it comes to official CO2 / economy figures on the European test cycle, VW is no worse (and given the data below potentially better) than other OEMs.  Looking at user-gathered data on fuel economy, drivers of an Octavia 1.4 TSI 140 get 87% of the "official" figures:

 

http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/realmpg/skoda/octavia-2013/14-tsi-140

 

If you have a Focus 1.5T 150, the same source of user-data shows drivers only getting 68% of the official figures:

 

http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/realmpg/ford/focus-2014/15t-ecoboost-150

 

For an Astra 1.4 T 150, 74% of the official figures:

 

http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/realmpg/vauxhall/astra-k-2015/14-turbo-150

 

A Mazda 6 2.0 165 is at 83% of the official figures:

 

http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/realmpg/mazda/6-2013/20-165

 

The "the car does nothing like the official figures" issue is a cross industry problem, and not in anyway specific to VW Group.  It has been getting worse over recent years as all OEMs have typically moved to downsized turbo engines.  These typically perform much better in the official tests than in the real world.  The tests have incredibly slow acceleration profiles which means the car is pretty much always off-boost.  High speeds are not maintained.  There are also numerous other (legal!) factors which lead to the measured results being at odds with the real-world.  I posted on this back in 2015:

 

 

There are new tests coming with higher speeds and faster accelerations.  We will thus see engine sizes start to grow a bit again.

Edited 9 March, 2017 by iriches

[Octy0GG]

1 hour ago, iriches said:

 

 

 

The "the car does nothing like the official figures" issue is a cross industry problem, and not in anyway specific to VW Group.  It has been getting worse over recent years as all OEMs have typically moved to downsized turbo engines.  These typically perform much better in the official tests than in the real world.  

 

Yes can confirm that gap between official and real world MPG is growing,

Had been aware of the reported gap between official and reality but given that I did achieve close to the official figures thought that perhaps my driving / journeys were such that official figures were reasonably achievable - with a bit of effort they could be bettered. Have since realised that this was more a function of the particular car than anything else, Octavia 2 1.9 PD Manual. Have changed to an Octavia 3 1,4 TSI much harder to get close to official figures. 

 

Other thing that is really noticeable was that the 1.9 PD was economical regardless of journey, speed, acceleration, hills, stop/start, temperature, load, prevailing wind etc. yes all these things would have some impact but not that much. The 1.4 TSI can be economical but only for that ideal journey.

[Ootohere]

^^^ When VW Group brands are worse than other manufacturers are they are found out, not with the likes of the Euro 5 Defeat Devices, 

but later with Euro 6 and Co2 Irregularities and Implausible test results that required retesting and new test results and even the Buying Back of Euro 6 Emission vehicles that had been sold / leased and ones not yet First Registered. 

ie They were EU tests with results and submitted data from 'Official Test Centers' as used by VW, SEAT & AUDI that were not errors but gained by deception or cheating with the oil in the engines of the vehicles, the tyre pressures, the brake pads etc while in the temperature controlled building on rolling roads.  

Or as VW call it 'mistakes'  the mistake being they got found out.

http://autocar.co.uk/car-news/industry/vw-emissions-scandal-audi-and-seat-deny-co2-cover 

 

We know how the EU testing is not real world or anything even to do with emissions at 'revenue weight' 

ie the number of passengers in a vehicle and stuff in the boot and maybe a caravan being towed, 

but it never will be.

There are people that can drive a vehicle on the road and exceed the 'Official EU Test result for comparison only results.'

But it was the EU Governments and mainly Germany, France, Italy and the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland that have allowed the Mickey Mouse testing system to be continuing for the past decade.

'Manufactures are the tail that wags the dog'.

 

The USA has made some moves towards a system of testing that gives some realistic idea of fuel use and emissions.

 

Edited 9 March, 2017 by Awayoffski

[vRSAnt]

On 08/03/2017 at 20:12, ednmra said:

Feels like a MUCH bigger engine.

 

Not like a 2.0TSi it won't

[ednmra]

50 minutes ago, vRSAnt said:

 

Not like a 2.0TSi it won't

Maybe, but not a lot different to my previous 1.8 TSi

[rothair]

Very happy 1.0 estate driver. Long runs, fully laden throwing out 56mpg plus...

[Ootohere]

adnmara,

the 1.8TSI 180ps as fitted to the Leon or the 192ps in the Polo & Ibiza are crackers and not just due to more hp than the 140ps 1.4TSI, 

and engine that VW are right to replace with a 1.5 TSI 150ps.

 

It is a pity that VW's will get this engine first while every euro can be squeezed from the engine that will keep fitting as long as they can get away with in the other brand of cars.

[guitarman001]

The more I think about it, the more I think I'll "steer" toward Skoda. The initial price of the car is better and I prefer the layout. I'd have to spend that bit extra to get the screen on the Honda, and there are too many diesel worries. Anyway we'll see... I test drive the 1.2 and 1.4 tomorrow!

[guitarman001]

I have something to tell you all.... I bought the 1.4 TSi Octavia! 

The garage in Edinburgh was REALLY good - no high-pressure sale or anything like that. Total pleasure and I'd use them again. 

I didn't even bother with the 1.2... what's the point for an extra 3-4mpg, with such a drop in performance...

 

I did consider a 1.6 TDI but reading the hit-and-miss mpg numbers users are getting on this forum, it solidified my belief that for diesel, the Civic 1.6 is the only one I'd go for. Unfortunately the one I wanted (Sport) costs £14k (compared to £10k I got the Octavia for) and the girlfriend also wasn't keen on the Honda. Also, I felt the seat position was too high on it (when it was lowered to it's lowest position). The 2017 Honda's look great so perhaps in future... 

 

In any case. The Octavia Elegance model is fantastic. Such power! And it showed 40mpg after a short trip, so I'd hope to see 45mpg+ on average for daily commute. I got a good deal on trade-in, and the test drive was very thorough. LOTS of features on this model, I need to read the manual! I pick it up week after next and will put my girlfriend on the insurance so she can enjoy a lovely car during her last months. 

 

Many thanks for all your help and advice. Hopefully I'll have no problems with this over the next 5+ years I intend to keep it for. 

[Sec8200]

Very good choice, now enjoy the moments together w/ the family

Edited 11 March, 2017 by TTodorov

[Warrior193]

1 hour ago, guitarman001 said:

I have something to tell you all.... I bought the 1.4 TSi Octavia! 

The garage in Edinburgh was REALLY good - no high-pressure sale or anything like that. Total pleasure and I'd use them again. 

I didn't even bother with the 1.2... what's the point for an extra 3-4mpg, with such a drop in performance...

 

I did consider a 1.6 TDI but reading the hit-and-miss mpg numbers users are getting on this forum, it solidified my belief that for diesel, the Civic 1.6 is the only one I'd go for. Unfortunately the one I wanted (Sport) costs £14k (compared to £10k I got the Octavia for) and the girlfriend also wasn't keen on the Honda. Also, I felt the seat position was too high on it (when it was lowered to it's lowest position). The 2017 Honda's look great so perhaps in future... 

 

In any case. The Octavia Elegance model is fantastic. Such power! And it showed 40mpg after a short trip, so I'd hope to see 45mpg+ on average for daily commute. I got a good deal on trade-in, and the test drive was very thorough. LOTS of features on this model, I need to read the manual! I pick it up week after next and will put my girlfriend on the insurance so she can enjoy a lovely car during her last months. 

 

Many thanks for all your help and advice. Hopefully I'll have no problems with this over the next 5+ years I intend to keep it for. 

I still find myself favourably comparing my 1.4 TSI to naturally-aspirated 2.8 - 3.2 litre, 6 cylinder engines of old.

[Ootohere]

^^^ That was what VW set out to get with the 1.4TSI 125kW Twinchargers and they achieved that. 

Sadly penny pinching ruined that and now means they discontinued manufacturing them. 

They failed with the 160ps because of the timing chains then pushed them to 180/185ps (132/136kW) and that was even worse for failures, but great when they did not.

No doubt they will be building similar again in the future but with Electric Superchargers and better engine components.

http://revotechnik.com/support/technical/14tsi-twincharger-engine-issues

 

 

Edited 11 March, 2017 by Awayoffski