There is a comment posted on another vid..

'Driven by the ghosts of fascists past'. 

 

 

Loads of money!    Too much money maybe.

You too can be rich if you do not heat your office. 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited 29 January, 20251 yr by Ootohere

How about a luxury electric SUV that can float?

 

 

@OotohereI was already aware about Tesla not refunding Marks money, he has mentioned that before, I'm not sure if it is one of his other videos, or he mentioned it in interview with other vloggers. It is a despicable way to treat people and their money. Sort of a throwback to the early days of Sinclair and the other tech companies of the 80s when they used adverts in the newspapers and people paid up front months in advance of receiving anything.

If one way 690 miles and getting 4 miles a kWh that is 172.5 kWh.   £100 then an average of 58 pence a kWh. Really?

Return another £100.      

3.5 miles a kWh is 197 kWh, 50 pence a kWh. 

 

There and back?

Really 1,380 miles for 25 pence a kWh, £100 !!!

 

 

 

 

 

Edited 30 January, 20251 yr by Ootohere

Here we are on page 358. I was working yesterday in Coventry at our massive cross docking station.

 

A nice toodle for me ie 100 miles round trip in my EV.

Two others I was meeting, one coming from Liverpool, the other from Felixstowe, both around 260 mile round trips I reckon and both people needed to blast across/down and be back ASAP for family reasons.  Both also came in Renaults, a Capture and a Clio, both diesels.

 

I cannot argue that at this moment in time that those diesels were the best tools/cars to do the job.  It is late January, its coldish, they are probably driving at 70-ish, maybe pushing the NSL +10%+2 mph, one came flying past me once we got on the motorway, their cars are not new, they are in the middle of their careers and unlike me they have got better things to spend their money on that the latest car toys.

 

Certainly brought it home to me others priorities and economics.  EVs will get noticeably better and quickly but we have some way to go, maybe take until the end of the decade, before the choice of an EV becomes completely the default choice for the majority because of prices to acquire, the running costs and just the ability to to a long journey in the shortest time in a reasonably priced car.  Still much work to do.

 

Edited 30 January, 20251 yr by lol-lol

26 minutes ago, lol-lol said:

Certainly brought it home to me others priorities and economics.  EVs will get noticeably better and quickly but we have some way to go, maybe take until the end of the decade, before the choice of an EV becomes completely the default choice for the majority because of prices to acquire, the running costs and just the ability to to a long journey in the shortest time in a reasonably priced car.  Still much work to do.

👍

There is of course always cheaper cars, ICE had been around for a long time giving huge range choices and are almost equally capable. This is more fault with manufacturer not having capable EV offerings in 2010's. There's some waiting to be done for more affordable and capable second hand EV's enabling those as choice for everyone. 

 

But even in those cases driving 200+ miles a day, the range of today's EV are still plenty as long as destination charging is up to scratch. Saving everyone time by getting their EV charge up while parked. In this area there's still much work to do. Need more government grants or remove red tape, "build it and they will come". 

 

 

35 minutes ago, wyx087 said:

Need more government grants or remove red tape, "build it and they will come". 

One of the IMHO stupidest things was to reduce then remove the purchase grant on EVs, yes there are grants for home (EVHS), workplace (WCS) & on-street (ORCS) charging points but charging points without affordable vehicles are a long term investment that won't get more EVs purchased/leased right now.

 

As for the Plug-In Car Grant (PICG) the percentages look good, but the caps are so low as to be almost pointless!

 

23 minutes ago, PetrolDave said:

One of the IMHO stupidest things was to reduce then remove the purchase grant on EVs, yes there are grants for home (EVHS), workplace (WCS) & on-street (ORCS) charging points but charging points without affordable vehicles are a long term investment that won't get more EVs purchased/leased right now.

 

As for the Plug-In Car Grant (PICG) the percentages look good, but the caps are so low as to be almost pointless!

 

I don't feel that way for vehicle grants, the removal of grant saw car prices drop by similar amount. EV have been price parity for some time now.  I feel vehicle grant at this late stage is cash flowing out of the country or subsidising people who can afford new cars. 

 

Similarly, home charge point grant saw higher than necessary install costs near the end. 

 

Don't get me wrong, grants are necessary to push something from innovator stage into early adopter stage. But once enough skills had been obtained, grant need to wind down otherwise it becomes price gouging. 

 

Key for painless EV ownership is grazing on destination charging whenever parked, especially hotels and workplace. I don't believe there's grants for hotels. Workplace grants could be higher to encourate more than 30% coverage of EV charge points in workplace car parks. 

 

For example, my workplace have more than enough, most of the time spare EV charge points and ok SS scheme. We are seeing more and more EV driver every day. 

 

Edited 30 January, 20251 yr by wyx087

20 minutes ago, wyx087 said:

I feel vehicle grant at this late stage is cash flowing out of the country or subsidising people who can afford new cars. 

I have to disagree, there are many people (me included) not in your fortunate position of having a substantial income/pension and savings; for us the grants were a lifeline to the possibility of replacing our ICE with an EV but an effective price hike of £5000 shattered that dream.

13 minutes ago, PetrolDave said:

I have to disagree, there are many people (me included) not in your fortunate position of having a substantial income/pension and savings; for us the grants were a lifeline to the possibility of replacing our ICE with an EV but an effective price hike of £5000 shattered that dream.

The grant was £3500 for a £35k car, there was an upper limit I can't remember, not many EV below price back then. That is 10% increase in price without grant.

 

It's not going to affect the end outcome is it? People who buy brand new cars can forego a few options to achieve similar price. Going through websites like carwow will usually net very close price reductions. 

 

Your wish may be granted soon though, government is said to be looking at 0% grants to boost private purchases: 

UK Government mulling EV loan subsidies to boost sales

38 minutes ago, wyx087 said:

Your wish may be granted soon though, government is said to be looking at 0% grants to boost private purchases: 

UK Government mulling EV loan subsidies to boost sales

I think you mean 0% loans?

Based on past performance, when do you think this affordable Telsa will actually make it to market??

 

 

12 minutes ago, PetrolDave said:

I think you mean 0% loans?

Apologies, yes, 0% loans. Which allows you to gain more than old grant if you invest the money into the market. 

 

I have a habit of thinking one thing typing something else. Proof read once sometimes doesn't pick out everything. 

 

TBH I'm not better off than anyone here, £9000 Octavia was the most expensive car I've ever bought up to that point. I just got lucky with some stock, shares and crypto during COVID. Without the giant market rally on tech stocks in 2021, I wouldn't even think about buying a brand new car. The money for the battery came from recent AI surge. Only the solar panel were from my own savings almost 10 years ago as I felt it was a worthy extra-long-term investment. 

In Scotland there were 6 year interest free loans to buy new EV,s. 

Then that changed to Interest Free to buy Used Electric Vehicles.  Currently closed to applications.  

 

There was an issue, The Administration and applications time to be processed and the car you wanted to purchase no longer being available because the useless office staff.

Maybe working from home.

I doubt they were snowed under with work...

 

 

Edited 30 January, 20251 yr by Ootohere

People are not stopping travelling by car while train services / timetables are terrible and the cost of them.

Then bus services have been cut in rural areas and not everyone is travelling city to city or to places on that routes.

The weather might be changing but as to cycling out of towns and cities to commute by bike or on foot then lets see the MSP,s  & Ministers doing that, they can claim a shoe expense. & get issued Hi-Viz gear identifying them so that the public can stop them to have a word about the cost of public transport. 

21 minutes ago, Ootohere said:

People are not stopping travelling by car while train services / timetables are terrible and the cost of them.

Then bus services have been cut in rural areas and not everyone is travelling city to city or to places on that routes.

The weather might be changing but as to cycling out of towns and cities to commute by bike or on foot then lets see the MSP,s  & Ministers doing that, they can claim a shoe expense. & get issued Hi-Viz gear identifying them so that the public can stop them to have a word about the cost of public transport. 

Its ironic that the Government have just release this consultation and as always with an extremely tight timeline for people to respond to it, anyone who was cynical would think that they don't people to take part in the survey as they have already made their minds what is going to happen and will ignore what people say, as per usual.

 

Integrated National Transport Strategy: a call for ideas - GOV.UK

 

40 minutes ago, Ootohere said:

People are not stopping travelling by car while train services / timetables are terrible and the cost of them.

To highlight the silly prices of train fares, how about this then?

 

Woman travels to Manchester via Spain to save cash on rail fares - BBC News

When I got my Zoe there was government ie under the Con government, funding for both the car and a home charger.  Whilst the Zoe is and was a highish spec I suspect Renault was working on a big margin by then.  The RRP was a rather huge £34k for a B segment EV, even though it probably has the longest range of any B segment car at the time and better than some C or D segment EVs.

 

The Con UK government subsidy was £2.5K from memory and £500 for the home charger so that only cost me £449 fitted to the house.   I recall Renault gave me £5K further discount and I think the loca dealership gave me some more too so with all these discounts the Zoe cost me about £26K rather than £34k and then was put on a really good finance so has been costing me way less than £300 a month and bugger all running costs of course.  Similar with the Scenic, no subsidies under the Labour government but a discount way more than normal dealer discount plus a £1k freebie 7.4 kw wall box plus loads of other goodies.   Rumour circulating around the EV community is that the current Labour government is talking to the finance community about inderwring EV loans so they are low interest rates in close to inflation or inflation target ie 2 to 3% rather than subsidies.  I am getting the Scenic PCP loan at 4.9% which is lower than my mortgage at 5% so not much room there. 

 

Just interested as to what the Renault 5 will cost per month for say 8k or 10k annual miles.  Any trade in on the Zoe as a PCP early ie 6 months early return.  Interest rates down a quarter percent for the EU area and companies like Renault, VAG etc will look at whether to take loans for UK sales as Uk loans or EU loans as EU interest rates ae quite a bit lower but there is always the exchange rate risk of course.

 

Edited 30 January, 20251 yr by lol-lol

1 hour ago, wyx087 said:

Apologies, yes, 0% loans. Which allows you to gain more than old grant if you invest the money into the market. 

You're assuming that the money is there to invest, many people are living "hand to mouth" each day with no ability to save or invest.

 

After divorce when my ex stripped me out I'm definitely in that category - haven't been able to save or invest a single penny post divorce!

7 minutes ago, PetrolDave said:

You're assuming that the money is there to invest, many people are living "hand to mouth" each day with no ability to save or invest.

 

After divorce when my ex stripped me out I'm definitely in that category - haven't been able to save or invest a single penny post divorce!

 

Just to make the point not what I condone but a successful comedy by many measures...... 

 

 

Edited 30 January, 20251 yr by lol-lol

5 minutes ago, PetrolDave said:

You're assuming that the money is there to invest, many people are living "hand to mouth" each day with no ability to save or invest.

If no money to purchase outright. No money to spare month-to-month for car monthlies. How is money off a brand new car going to help? 

 

Please help me understand in that situation, why you think a few % off brand new car costing over £20k will help. 

23 minutes ago, PetrolDave said:

You're assuming that the money is there to invest, many people are living "hand to mouth" each day with no ability to save or invest.

 

After divorce when my ex stripped me out I'm definitely in that category - haven't been able to save or invest a single penny post divorce!

You hit the nail on the head there, and most of the EV owners who post on here cannot see or even acknowledge that they are in most cases in a far more privileged position than a large percentage of the population, seeing as EV's were and in reality are still way more expensive than a decent ICE car. Yes there are a few more affordable electric cars, but they are small, and very basic compared to ICE cars of the same value. 

17 minutes ago, Graham Butcher said:

You hit the nail on the head there, and most of the EV owners who post on here cannot see or even acknowledge that they are in most cases in a far more privileged position than a large percentage of the population, seeing as EV's were and in reality are still way more expensive than a decent ICE car. Yes there are a few more affordable electric cars, but they are small, and very basic compared to ICE cars of the same value. 

 

Privileged or hard working and intelligent?

 

26 minutes ago, lol-lol said:

 

Privileged or hard working and intelligent?

 

 

Privileged.