Felicia Combi 1.3 - what oil?

[Thefeliciahacker]

54 minutes ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

That kind of ''danger'' with the 5W is bigger in Winter or Summer?

if in the winter the temperature is 0C and in the summer 100C and you can guarantee the oil is olny going to work AT those temperatures is fine.

The issue is what happens in between... AND ABOVE 100C.
5W40 AT 120C does NOT HAVE THE SAME VISCOSITY AS 15W40 at 120C

[Thefeliciahacker]

10W40 @80C has a kinematic viscosity of 24 centistokes

5W40 @80C has a kinematic viscosity of 21 centistokes

and thats relevant for brand new oil the more the polymers mermanetly shear the bigger the gap...

You want to keep using 5W GO FOR 5W-50 at least

1 hour ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

All i am trying to understand is that the 5W will cause so much friction inside the engine parts?

YOU ARE GOING TO STARVE THE MOTOR FROM OIL PRESSURE YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED!!!!!!!!!

multiple times

[D.FYLAKTOS]

Just now, Thefeliciahacker said:

10W40 @80C has a kinematic viscosity of 24 centistokes

5W40 @80C has a kinematic viscosity of 21 centistokes

 

You want to keep using 5W GO FOR 5W-50 at least

 

That applies to any brand Synthetic or Semi-Synthetic?

 

5W-50 has Mobil-1 about 50€ the 4Ltr.

 

[Breezy_Pete]

Does this Felicia engine have no oil pressure switches to sense problems?

 

[D.FYLAKTOS]

1 hour ago, Breezy_Pete said:

have no oil pressure switches to sense problems?

 

Once upon a time i had an Oil Pressure gauge but after some years cause me a huge problem and i remove it.

It's red light was going on-off and i was in a summer vacations, i thought i had problem with my engine oil level but it was fine so i throw that gauge away.

[Breezy_Pete]

Pressure switches just operate red warning lights in the existing instrument cluster (and cause audible warning too sometimes) when pressure is inadequate. 

It seems very unlikely to me that your engine does not have at least one of these switches. I would expect this/these to give warnings if pressure is too low.

 

[D.FYLAKTOS]

2 minutes ago, Breezy_Pete said:

It seems very unlikely to me that your engine does not have at least one of these switches.

 

You mean the red indicator in the dashboard? Yes i have it.

No warnings so far, the engine oil level is OK.

 

1 hour ago, Thefeliciahacker said:

YOU ARE GOING TO STARVE THE MOTOR FROM OIL PRESSURE YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED!!!!!!!!!

multiple times

 

IF (i say if) i had an Oil Pressure gauge with scale from 0 to 100 what would be a ''normal'' indication and what a ''warning'' one?

[Breezy_Pete]

Just now, D.FYLAKTOS said:

the engine oil level is OK.

Oil level is not directly measured I think. That oilcan picture warning light, if lit red, is about low oil pressure.

That warning light will be controlled by a pressure switch somewhere on your engine, possibly more than one. 

With your engine code I may be able to show you where on engine.

[Breezy_Pete]

Here, I think.

 

[D.FYLAKTOS]

2 minutes ago, Breezy_Pete said:

 

That warning light will be controlled by a pressure switch somewhere on your engine, possibly more than one. 

With your engine code I may be able to show you where on engine.

 

I know only for one, looks like this

 

the part code is 028 919 081 D, has one cable and a plastic cover for protection.

[J.R.]

2 hours ago, Thefeliciahacker said:

The issue is what happens in between... AND ABOVE 100C.

 

Above 100°c the already very small difference in viscosity becomes even smaller.

 

Do you really believe that the difference between 15  Centistokes and 18 Centistokes at 100°c is going to kill your engine?

 

All the oils will fail to give adequate protection beyond 170°c, I have found this out to my cost on the track but most drivers will never get anywhere near that, they will all however experience low temperature starts where the majority of engine wear occurs hence the introduction of multigrade oils.

 

If like me circuit racing or like you driving at 5900rpm through the gears on mountain roads then its understandable to choose the best oil for those temperatures, most peoples engines will never experience that but all engines suffer the majority of the wear after cold engine startups and for most people that should be the deciding factor on oil choice.

 

I'm surprised that timing chain wear would be more significant or important than main and big end bearing failure if an oil does not perform.

[Breezy_Pete]

4 minutes ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

 

I know only for one, looks like this

 

the part code is 028 919 081 D, has one cable and a plastic cover for protection.

 

Yes, that is an oil pressure switch. According to this page though, that one is only correct for 1.6 and 1.9 engines?

 

See my previous post for 1.3 engine PN.

[D.FYLAKTOS]

@Breezy_Pete Here it is in a Favorit, it's in the right side of the block in the lower section of the picture.

 

[D.FYLAKTOS]

1 minute ago, Breezy_Pete said:

that one is only correct for 1.6 and 1.9 engines?

 

The 1.3 engine has it also.

https://kritosparts.gr/Code/028 919 081 D

 

https://kritosparts.gr/Part/BALBIDA-LADIOU-047919081-PSYLI-BOLTA-115094201/eG18115094201

 

[Breezy_Pete]

Different screw threads. Not equivalent.

Edited 18 November, 2023 by Breezy_Pete

[Thefeliciahacker]

5 hours ago, Breezy_Pete said:

Does this Felicia engine have no oil pressure switches to sense problems

they are set tremendously low, at high loads seeing a oil light barely illuminating means you have already cause major damage

[Thefeliciahacker]

Guys i know i started a war BUT our cars have very large main bearing clearances, many times, MORE than 50-60μm ΄lets assume 60μm with wear.
Based on tables you need for operation UP TO 102C (which can easily be exceeded with our stamped steel pans) you need at leas 10W40 or even better 15W40

For temperatures ABOVE 102C which can be acheived even DURING NORMAL DRIVING on the highway at 130kmh you need 15W50 or 20W50
Soooo I think I AM DOING the right thing running 15W50...

[Thefeliciahacker]

3 hours ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

https://kritosparts.gr/Part/BALBIDA-LADIOU-047919081-PSYLI-BOLTA-115094201/eG18115094201

 7.2 psi hahahaah when this thing lights up your mains will be a slurry

[Breezy_Pete]

The engine designer thought that was an OK pressure.  But that's going to be my last input here, because you clearly will not alter your view.

Edited 18 November, 2023 by Breezy_Pete

[D.FYLAKTOS]

4 hours ago, Breezy_Pete said:

Different screw threads. Not equivalent.

 

Was an example.

You can have both the factory switch and the oil pressure gauge together, all you need is an adaptor with new thread

https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/51uSmRtICaL._SL1000_.jpg

and some Cooper washers.

May look a bit ugly inside the engine bay but if you are a driver that likes to monitor things it's good.

[nta16]

Don't get stuck too much on the numbers, a better oil with better base stock and better additive package will offer better and wider protection for longer.

 

If you only want numbers then why not cover the range with a 5w-50 (bearing in mind 5w and 50 or any other set are ranges and oils vary where they are in the ranges and how long they stay at their figures).

 

Castrol GTX 15W-40 –

• Viscosity - Kinematic 100C (ASTM D445) – 13.9
• Viscosity - Kinematic 40C (ASTM D445) – 105

https://msdspds.castrol.com/bpglis/FusionPDS.nsf/Files/0E6EE706A3D90A638025842A006879BB/$File/BPXE-BDPMLT.pdf

 

Amsoil Europe on their ‘Find the right oil’ don’t have a 10w-40 listed for a 2000 Felicia 1.3 but instead Extreme Power Motor Oil 0W-40, Extreme Power Motor Oil 0W-30, Synthetic European Motor Oil MS 5W-40, Synthetic European Motor Oil LS 5W-30, Synthetic European Motor Oil FS 5W-40 and Synthetic European Motor Oil FS 0W-40, of course as with all databases theirs could have errors. So I don’t know which Amsoil 10w-40 D.FYLAKTOS might be using.  https://amsoil.eu/products/car-engine-oils/

 

As they’re not easy to get in Greece the following are for example only.

 

Millers EE Performance Engine Oil 5w50 -

• Kinematic Viscosity @ 100°C, cSt. – 18.4

https://www.millersoils.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/8209-EE-Peformance-5w50.pdf

 

Millers EE Performance Engine Oil C3 5w40 -

• Kinematic Viscosity @ 100°C, cSt. –13.6

https://www.millersoils.co.uk/products/ee-performance-engine-oil-c3-5w40/

 

Millers EE Performance Engine Oil 10w40 –

• Kinematic Viscosity @ 100°C, cSt. – 13.8

https://www.millersoils.co.uk/products/ee-performance-engine-oil-10w40/

 

The oil belief merry-go-round tends to make the riders feel dizzy and/or sick so it's better to get off it sooner than later.  🙃

 

Usual chart.

 

Edited 18 November, 2023 by nta16
spelling

[J.R.]

2 hours ago, Breezy_Pete said:

The engine designer thought that was an OK pressure.  But that's going to be my last input here, because you clearly will not alter your view.

 

He is not wrong regarding an engine running at high revs and under load, you have literally milliseconds to react and minimise any damage, thats on the assumption that the light has come on for oil starvation, usually cornering or braking on slick tyres. Glimmering at mid range RPM under little load could be survivable if shut down quickly.

 

All of which is of little consequence to the people that would drive around for days weeks or even months ignoring an oil light, although to be fair if they got that far it was probably a failed switch.

 

You can get higher pressure switches, I have used 15psi in the past, they give you a little bit more of a chance especially if you notice them glimmering, manufacturers would never fit them because they will illuminate at tickover with a hot engine, made worse with a worn engine, thinner or older oil etc.

 

Modern Skodas have 2 pressure switches high and low which trigger warnings at different RPM thresholds which is a lot better.

 

Oil pressure guages are a thing of the past, too many scary readings for the uninformed to hassle the dealers with, even the water temperature guages on VAGs fudge their readings for the same reasons.

[J.R.]

2 hours ago, Thefeliciahacker said:

Soooo I think I AM DOING the right thing running 15W50...

 

If you think its the right thing then indeed it is the right thing for you, peace of mind is a valuable and comforting commodity.

[D.FYLAKTOS]

22 minutes ago, nta16 said:

As they’re not easy to get in Greece

 

Yes, they are available here.

 

https://oilsmotoauto.gr/el/98_millers

 

https://www.skroutz.gr/c/1228/Ladia-Autokinhtou/m/22964/Millers-Oils.html

 

 

25 minutes ago, nta16 said:

So I don’t know which Amsoil 10w-40 D.FYLAKTOS might be using.

 

This one.

https://www.skroutz.gr/s/8217133/Amsoil-Synthetiko-Ladi-Aytokinitou-Premium-Protection-Synthetic-Motor-Oil-10W-40-1lt.html

Very expensine now, you need about 72 € at least for an oil change.

 

 

[Thefeliciahacker]

1 hour ago, J.R. said:

 

If you think its the right thing then indeed it is the right thing for you, peace of mind is a valuable and comforting commodity.

Exactly as you put it I rather sacrifice 0.5L/100km and an engine with higher windage losses and be sure that whatever temp the oil gets the engine won't blow up, rather than save that amount and constantly be in fear. 

And we rarely see 0c in west Greece even in the heart of winter so I don't care about cold starts