I'm not a tyre engineer nor do i work within the tyre industry but do know that a tyre rated as an M+S (all-season) is not subject to the same tests as a summer tyre which is why so many cheap Chinese tyres are on the market with appalling wet grip. They are dangerous, and they SHOULD be illegal, and i cant understand why people are arguing about it, good tyres prevent accidents and save lives.

I'm not a tyre engineer nor do i work within the tyre industry but do know that a tyre rated as an M+S (all-season) is not subject to the same tests as a summer tyre which is why so many cheap Chinese tyres are on the market with appalling wet grip. They are dangerous, and they SHOULD be illegal, and i cant understand why people are arguing about it, good tyres prevent accidents and save lives.

M+S tyres are mud and snow. They run bigger shoulder gaps for more grip in mud, snow and gravel and more open tread. If a tyre sports m+s then it's not a performance road tyre and should never be driven like one.

The number of accidents which could be avoided/prevented by tyre choice is tiny. It is far more important that people drive within the limits of what they have. The idea that you should buy the stickiest tyres possible to avoid an accident is problematic as tyres with more grip encourage people to drive in ways where they expect more grip.

The only set of dangerous tyres I've driven were a set of japanese winter tyres. These had soo little grip in the wet that a 1500cc corolla could spin them up in second gear. Now-days people are better educated about winter tyres than they were then.

Do these look like M+S to you?

I had some Sunny tyres on my MG ZR once, rated as M+S, using an old Dunlop summer tyre pattern. It was bloody dangerous!

The stickiest tyres would be pure slicks for dry circumstances. The grooves are only there to displace water, etc.

The stickiest tyres would be pure slicks for dry circumstances. The grooves are only there to displace water, etc.

As per F1....trouble is they wouldn't get through the M.O.T. !

Do these look like M+S to you?

Tread with decent amount of open area, decent size shoulder grooves. Yes they look like M+S.

Personally, that's nowhere near the design I'd look for on a M&S/winter tyre.

Looks like a rip-off of the Toyo T1-R tread pattern to me, which is a 'performance' summer tyre.

This is the sort of design you're looking for with M&S - the whole treadblock is designed differently with far more sipes (the small wavy lines you see in the image below), to allow the tyre to grip into looser and lower grip surfaces...

Personally, that's nowhere near the design I'd look for on a M&S/winter tyre.

M+S is not a winter designation. It's just a description of the size of the voids in the tyre, particularly at the shoulders. Once I had the measurements they had to be, but I can't find them now.

Pretty much all winter tyres are M+S due to the size of the tread voids, but the reverse isn't true. The best example of M+S tyres that aren't winter are offroad tyres suited to sand and gravel. Here is a bridgestone dueller which meets M+S, but is an all-season tyre, not a winter tyre:

To be a winter tyre you need an appropriate compound, be able to clear slush and have a lot of biting edges. M+S doesn't guarantee any of that.

A bit chunkier, but here is the old standard BFG A/T which is at the chunkier end of A/T tyres, still M+S but is as good on ice as a kayak. I run these on my 4wd. Great on sand and gravel, good tread life. Okay in spring snow (which is more like sand) but terrible in wet snow, wet roads or ice.

Now remember, I didn't say anywhere that I like that tyre Kidders posted, nor did I say I would buy one (directionals styled for looks aren't my thing). I just said it looks like it would meet the M+S requirements.

Edited 8 August, 201213 yr by Kiwibacon

I didn't say M&S was specifically a winter designation.

And I'm not getting into a full blown discussion over the spec of M&S tyres here. Either way it's off topic for the question the OP has asked anyway. So I suggest we move on....

The stickiest tyres would be pure slicks for dry circumstances. The grooves are only there to displace water, etc.

Dependant on compound there are slick tyres that offer far less grip than a good quality road tyre on a road car since they cannot either not generate enough heat for the tyre to work properly or generate too much causing the tyre to overheat

I said it before and I will say it again.

If you do not want to pay for premium tyres but want to be safe, put Hankooks on.

Agreed, just put these on wifes Audi, £100 a piece fitted,blanced, 235 17's - Very happy so far

I have to say, that the worst tyres I have ever encountered, were the set of Bridgestone Takuma's on the Mazda 3 which we sold a few months ago. They were lethal in the wet, and had extraordinary life expectancy - 48K miles!!!!!

Despite never throwing the Mazda 3 around (I never really trusted the twitchy handling), I nearly lost it a couple of times when exiting off camber, wet roundabouts, where it behaved more like an old rear wheel drive car - BMW 3 series for instance, rather than a modern FWD hatch.

I would never go near Bridgestone tyres again.

Why have Dunlop got such a bad name nowadays? They used to be first choice in many cases years ago.

I have to say, that the worst tyres I have ever encountered, were the set of Bridgestone Takuma's on the Mazda 3 which we sold a few months ago. They were lethal in the wet, and had extraordinary life expectancy - 48K miles!!!!!

Despite never throwing the Mazda 3 around (I never really trusted the twitchy handling), I nearly lost it a couple of times when exiting off camber, wet roundabouts, where it behaved more like an old rear wheel drive car - BMW 3 series for instance, rather than a modern FWD hatch.

I would never go near Bridgestone tyres again.

Bridgestone are the largest tyre manufacturer in the world and own Firestone as well. They recently given up on the F1, look how well Pirelli are not doing with that, and Bridgestone supply the MotoGP bikes ie driving at over 210 mph on the contact patch of a large stamp.

I think Bridgestone have gone a bit too far on making their tyres last longer but be too hard and not giving enough grip.

Our little Fabia HTP came with Bridgestone RE30 and 26K later they are barely half warn.

But I think they have age hardened over 4 years and are now only suitable for the back.

Bought a full sized spare wheel kit from Skoda and that came with a RE300 which seems quite good. Better technology tyre but also less old.

I think may accusations of poor tyres is often down the tyre being old stock or just old. Manufacturers often buy old stock to save money on new cars builds.

Our Fabia VRS came with Continental Contact Sport 2s only 10 months ago, well old technology. The Octavia TSI VRS came this horrible Dunlop Sport Maxxs. All were changed to Michelin Pilot Sport 3s after a few months.

Bridgestone know how to build great tyres, I am currently working with them on the Aston Martin supply end.

What is more key is users buying budget ones or high mileage tyres and expecting great things with grip.

Have not tried the S001s but it is reckoned to be a contender and is a good mileage tyre so a good compromise.

Edited 19 August, 201213 yr by lol

I am currently working with them on the Aston Martin supply end.

You testing next week with them?

I should have said Bridgestone Turanza and not Takuma. I think that it is the ER300 tyre, and although I know that Bridgestone are very reputable, this tyre on this particular model was very bad. The Mazda forum members seem to be of the same opinion as well.

Ditto, I had the ER300 on a Fabia and they were bloody awful. Must have had granite in the compound - they lasted ages and wouldn't die. Downside was a huge lack of grip...

Ditto, I had the ER300 on a Fabia and they were bloody awful. Must have had granite in the compound - they lasted ages and wouldn't die. Downside was a huge lack of grip...

I have just had a look back at our old advert for the Mazda, and it actually had 52K miles on it, and the Bridgestones were the original tyres - very, very scary.

You testing next week with them?

Bridgestone supply the OE tyres for the Aston Martin range but the racing Astons use Michelins. I am buying my ticket for the Endurance race like every one else. £30 for adults, 15s and under free. Hope the weather is going to be OK, the WSB was interesting in this freaky summer weather.

Can win I ride with Darren Turner in the Aston when you buy a ticket. I have seen him in BSB, fingers crossed.

Ditto, I had the ER300 on a Fabia and they were bloody awful. Must have had granite in the compound - they lasted ages and wouldn't die. Downside was a huge lack of grip...

The ER300 is noticeably better than the ER30 the HTP came with but will keep an eye out for some good deals on Barums (Continentals) BOGO 1\2 Price.

Replacing these tyres at 3-4 mm and/or 30K seems sensible and maybe have Contis or Michelins on the front.

The Bridgestones certainly do last well probably about 0.2 to 0.3 p per mile per tyre I reckon.

I have had conti SP2 on from new, they were ok but quite hard and wore out after 18k miles on fronts.

I tried conti premium contact (coz the garage put wrong ones on). they were ok - wore well good ride.

When I bought a set of alloys to use for winter tyres they had michelins on and they were good. comfy grippy and wore very well.

Due to replace my rear's and gonna switch from conti premium contact to Michelin Primacy HP, which I can get for £72 each delivered from mytyres, and the same for the fronts when they're ready.

Budget or performance??? I prefer to get/pay for a well known brand that has done a lot of research and development. It's not just the tread pattern and how you drive - it's also about the compound of the tyre. A good compound will be more stable throughout harsh braking and cornering (which is where you need it most) so why scrimp on a lesser compound.

Like others have said on here - 4 bits of rubber are all that keep you on the road - is it worth the risk?

I never really liked the Michelin Primacy HP - I didn't rate them in the wet on the motorway. Lasted well and were good in the dry, but didn't inspire me with confidence in the wet at speed - had a few aquaplane moments.

The Pzero Rossos on mine have done about 16,000 miles, but unfortunatelyI hadn't noticed the alignment was out and the left needs replacing, so I may as well do both. I've been prettyy happy with the Pirellis - they've been grippy, not noisy on most surfaces and have even dealt well with gravel tracks.

I can replace with same, but does anyone have other recommendations? I'm still wary of Korean tyres, even though they are improving in comparisons, but open to other suggestions.

I just put on 4 Toyo Proxes T1R 225/40/18 92Y, they came out ay £97 each all in.

Not had much of a chance to use them this week as I've been in a hire car. I'll get a chance to put them to the test this weekend

Ended up headed to a tyre place today. A little surpirsed that they had 225/50x17 in stock, but they recommended Pirelli P7 Cinturato, which I hadn't heard of (although remember the Cinturato name, which is older than me) but seems to be the PZero Rosso replacement. Will be interesting to see how it compares once I get the pressures sorted out. Approx $250 (£165) each incl fitting.