VW Emissions Scandal Thread V2

[xman]

Unfixed diesels now to be banned in Germany!

 

https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/industry/unfixed-dieselgate-affected-volkswagens-be-deregistered-germany

Edited 16 August, 2018 by xman

[Ootohere]

'Could' have.   It says in the article,

I take it that the German Authorities are not letting VW Group off with panning off people who's cars having issues after the Fix has been applied.

[xman]

3 hours ago, Offski said:

'Could' have.   It says in the article,

 

 

Mandatory and already started.

 

"Automobilwoche reports that the KBA, Germany's motor vehicle regulator, has already revoked the registrations of several Audi and VW cars without the fix in Hamburg and Munich following repeated warnings to the drivers, because the cars were still emitting more NOx than was originally declared. 

The fix is mandatory in Germany because the authorities declared it a safety recall, whereas in the UK it was labelled a 'service action’. The KBA told Automobilwoche: "The recall is compulsory. Cars that are not fixed can eventually be taken out of service. Subject to the release date of the updates, the car owner has had about a year and a half. Plenty of time to take part in the recall.""

[Ryeman]

http://europe.autonews.com/article/20180816/ANE/180819891/vw-owners-in-germany-risk-de-registration-of-cheat-diesels?cciid=email-ane-daily

[CWARD]

Good to know the German authorities have sided with the manufacturers rather than the consumer and deregistered some cars who’ve refused the fix even though we know that has caused engine problems. Basically saying have the fix done and take the risk of a knackered car or we’ll deregister it. Taking legal action against VAG for problems after the fix will be harder to prove than the emissions cheat. 

Edited 17 August, 2018 by CWARD

[Ootohere]

SKY News are running a story today on real world testing and emissions.

Vehicles being tested with weight in them being driven with A/C on etc.

The WLTP stuff that has been introduced and will continue to be needs to be reviewed again. 

 

The SMMT or one of their spokespeople are always there to defend 'Official Tests' even though no more real world than fly in the polluted air.

Would they not better serve the Car / Vehicle Trade and Manufacturers by saying. 'This needs looked at more closely and the cheating sorted out!'.

They have all the gear and more than an idea, they have the results of tests they carry out, they know the cheats, so just name them and shame them and do them and the world a favour. 

Problem is they are the Masters of the Universe and the paymasters, the car manufacturers tell Governments & Politicians what they want and when or never.

http://news.sky.com/story/most-modern-diesels-still-too-dirty-study-shows-11474459 

 

He is the only face of the SMMT i ever see on the telly but then he is the CEO.

 

Edited 17 August, 2018 by Offski

[Sad555]

Thought I read that VAG reducing the power output of some of the range to meet new tests.

[xman]

3 hours ago, Sad555 said:

Thought I read that VAG reducing the power output of some of the range to meet new tests.

 

The addition of a GPF reduces the power by a few horses.

[Ryeman]

Will the UK follow in threatening de registration for those not ‘fixed’?.

[Sad555]

Who cares,I sold mine,happy days bye bye VAG cheats

[Sad555]

44 minutes ago, xman said:

 

The addition of a GPF reduces the power by a few horses.

Can the golf R afford to lose another 10 bhp against the competion?

[Ootohere]

Not only VW Group will have GPF's on petrol vehicles. There might be less 'Performance cars' with the engineers building in pops and crackles by injecting in more fuel to burn just for the stylee,  or maybe just the cars with higher emissions if they have them as tested will be available for those happy to pay more to have them.

 

The thing is that new cars without the WLTP approval can be sold and registered after the 31st August.

If they were built before the 1st June 2018 and the manufacturer has applied under the Derogation Rule, end of line models. only 10% of what they registered in 2017 and what ever other 'Grey Area' the EU / UK Government / DVSA let them get away with.

Maybe there is an update of this video correcting what was said on the WLTP from September 2018.

 

 

Edited 18 August, 2018 by Offski

[Ryeman]

You certainly won’t hear anything from the sales division about the GPF  ‘feature’ coming on new cars.

[xman]

9 hours ago, Ryeman said:

Will the UK follow in threatening de registration for those not ‘fixed’?.

 

Unlikely I would have thought. UK is too soft and there are too many lobby groups and "influencers" around for our idle greedy bar steward politicians/civil servants to do anything like that.

 

However, you may find that, in future, unfixed cars might not be allowed to enter Germany and possibly other countries like Switzerland maybe along the lines of the French Crit'air system.

[CWARD]

3 minutes ago, xman said:

 

However, you may find that, in future, unfixed cars might not be allowed to enter Germany and possibly other countries like Switzerland maybe along the lines of the French Crit'air system.

 

It be very awkward and expensive to administer any kind of system to prevent UK cars from entering such places. 

[Sad555]

Not with the number of cameras that police/dvla have access to in would be quite feasible and profitable to recognise the vehicle concerned send out a fine ,the the information is out there so perhaps a nice form of revenue?

[CWARD]

As it’s not a recall in the UK the vehicles aren’t classed as dangerous like they are in Germany. Sharing the data with an EU state that doesn’t have access to our databases will be problematic and as no law has been broken in the UK there would be no basis to share data on specific owners. 

They could try something similar within the UK but again no law has been broken. Punishing owners twice would be counterproductive too. 

EU legislation was deliberately falsified and the EU should have fined the country who then take the company to task like has happened on many other pollution breaches which have been either failure to comply or accidental. When it comes to deliberate acts of pollution by huge companies which are vital to the EU economy they do nothing, g figure. 

[SWBoy]

11 hours ago, Ryeman said:

Will the UK follow in threatening de registration for those not ‘fixed’?.

I doubt it, UK ministers are toothless tigers who are scared of big companies so they won't want to upset VAG.

[moley]

What if you take your vehicle in for the fix at the VAG dealer and then take it to be re mapped, or will remaps become illegal as the software has been modified from the manufacturers specification?

[Ootohere]

^^^ At least some Politicians & Peers & Royals are car / motoring enthusiast and that is why Classic Cars are now able to not need a MOT or VED.

The UK Government have rubbered the EU for decades on changing somethings that they wanted.

The UK MOT'are dead lax, the legislation on Construction & Use and what is allowed on UK roads does not tie in with the Laws in England / Wales or Scotland or Northern Ireland.

The Highway Code which is not the Law is so full of outdated stuff that EU Type Approval is at odds with.

 

The UK Government might just need to clamp down on 'Imports' and Home Manufacturers are the kidology on testing.

Might all depend on how iffy the EU gets with UK Registered vehicles in the EU, or Exported UK Manufacturers vehicles.

 

It might just be Scandinavian Countries and other European Countries not in the EU that are going to take actions against VW Group vehicles with illegal software 

or high emissions due to the fix which has not actually reduced onroad emissions, just allowed the outdated tests to be re-done and the vehicles get a pass.

[Breezy_Pete]

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.theicct.org/sites/default/files/publications/ICCT-briefing_VW-fixes_USvEU_20171214.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwiB7LTR4fbcAhVixoUKHdhEC1MQFjADegQICRAB&usg=AOvVaw0ewvvDmmzh59pVN9Q8aWd9

 

Interesting reading on the relative success of US and EU fixes. Apologies if already linked.

[Ryeman]

They were well aware of their scam -

http://europe.autonews.com/article/20180818/COPY/308189994/vws-diess-learned-about-emissions-software-months-before-scandal?cciid=email-ane-daily

[Ootohere]

Still waiting to see mention of Stafan Jacoby head of VW USA 2007-2010.   I know he was / is not an Engineer like Martin Winterkorn is or VW Group Board members, 

but surely not all that have not trained as Engineers are selectively Deaf, Dumb & Blind. 

What ever happened to the Buck Stops Here, and gets passed down to those on the rink at the time?

 

Started in VW 1985,  must have sat in lots of meetings with Engineers and other Board Members globally.

http://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stefan_Jacoby 

Edited 20 August, 2018 by Offski

[lol-lol]

On 18/08/2018 at 15:15, Wino said:

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.theicct.org/sites/default/files/publications/ICCT-briefing_VW-fixes_USvEU_20171214.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwiB7LTR4fbcAhVixoUKHdhEC1MQFjADegQICRAB&usg=AOvVaw0ewvvDmmzh59pVN9Q8aWd9

 

Interesting reading on the relative success of US and EU fixes. Apologies if already linked.

 

Great article if not very concerning as it basically says that VW is basically just paying lip service to the emission issue and how to improve existing cars.

 

First time I saw the "laminar flow improver" I wonder if it was a joke but apparently not.    

 

Birmingham is looking to take its own action like many cities:-  (though I expect there will be a lot less Euro 5 diesels on the Birmingham roads by then as people head to petrol).  

 

https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/midlands-news/drivers-older-diesel-petrol-cars-14799866 

 

But, after much speculation, drivers whose cars meet the Euro 4 petrol standard – mostly vehicles made since 2006 – and Euro 6 diesel, mostly manufactured since 2015, will NOT have to pay.  The rest, thought to represent around 45 per cent of the city’s traffic, will face a daily charge from £6 to £10 to travel within the A4540, known as the Middle Ring Road.

[Breezy_Pete]

31 minutes ago, lol-lol said:

First time I saw the "laminar flow improver" I wonder if it was a joke but apparently not.

There was a perfectly reasonable explanation of why this was needed back when it was first mentioned.

Something to do with the precision of MAF measurements required to accurately control the EGR function.  Cars that already had a MAF screen (the 2.0 and 1.2 engines?) could do it with the existing MAF set-up (plus of course the new control software); the ones that lacked it (1.6s) needed it adding, as well as the software changes.  Can't remember the source of that explanation I'm afraid, but it's probably in here somewhere.  Edit: Found it - https://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2015/12/vw-flow-straightener-really-works/

 

I thought the most interesting point in that ICCT article was the one about the impossibility of improving NOx emissions of the EU cars significantly without affecting fuel economy in a negative way.

 

 

Edited 20 August, 2018 by Wino